Oh yes for sure, Don't get me wrong he pisses me off sometimes but who out there has his track record? Who could do it better? I can't and don't really have anyone but Scotty in mind I would trust really.
Precisely. The guy isn't perfect, far from it, but there is no such thing as a perfect GM. I'm certainly more willing to deal with an overly conservative, occasionally boring and/or predictable GM over a guy like Holmgren who swings at everything and rarely if ever hits a deal out of the park. The most relevant questions that those who want Holland fired have to ask themselves are these. Are there any GMs out there with an unblemished track record of success? Failing that (because there are none) is there a GM with a better track record than Holland, and more importantly, who is also available? Yzerman sure isn't (and would he even want to come here with the outright lunacy some of the Wings' fanbase has exhibited recently.) Scotty Bowman isn't available and the jury is still out on whether he'd even be a decent GM. Look at his tenure in Buffalo, and one of his first decisions here was to get rid of "The Captain". Ray Shero? Yeah he's available, but he took a team that was expected to be a perennial contender, left them with questionable defense and goaltending as well as absolutely no forward depth to speak of beyond the top 2 lines and left them with a coach who clearly couldn't rectify the problem. Seems like a downgrade to me. So really, I'm left asking, who is this Holland replacement that is going to come in and magically solve the fact that we no longer have Lidstrom on the back end, or trade for every elite player out there and give up nothing in return, etc etc? Because I really can't think of one.
Precisely. The guy isn't perfect, far from it, but there is no such thing as a perfect GM. I'm certainly more willing to deal with an overly conservative, occasionally boring and/or predictable GM over a guy like Holmgren who swings at everything and rarely if ever hits a deal out of the park. The most relevant questions that those who want Holland fired have to ask themselves are these. Are there any GMs out there with an unblemished track record of success? Failing that (because there are none) is there a GM with a better track record than Holland, and more importantly, who is also available? Yzerman sure isn't (and would he even want to come here with the outright lunacy some of the Wings' fanbase has exhibited recently.) Scotty Bowman isn't available and the jury is still out on whether he'd even be a decent GM. Look at his tenure in Buffalo, and one of his first decisions here was to get rid of "The Captain". Ray Shero? Yeah he's available, but he took a team that was expected to be a perennial contender, left them with questionable defense and goaltending as well as absolutely no forward depth to speak of beyond the top 2 lines and left them with a coach who clearly couldn't rectify the problem. Seems like a downgrade to me. So really, I'm left asking, who is this Holland replacement that is going to come in and magically solve the fact that we no longer have Lidstrom on the back end, or trade for every elite player out there and give up nothing in return, etc etc? Because I really can't think of one.
Precisely. The guy isn't perfect, far from it, but there is no such thing as a perfect GM. I'm certainly more willing to deal with an overly conservative, occasionally boring and/or predictable GM over a guy like Holmgren who swings at everything and rarely if ever hits a deal out of the park. The most relevant questions that those who want Holland fired have to ask themselves are these. Are there any GMs out there with an unblemished track record of success? Failing that (because there are none) is there a GM with a better track record than Holland, and more importantly, who is also available? Yzerman sure isn't (and would he even want to come here with the outright lunacy some of the Wings' fanbase has exhibited recently.) Scotty Bowman isn't available and the jury is still out on whether he'd even be a decent GM. Look at his tenure in Buffalo, and one of his first decisions here was to get rid of "The Captain". Ray Shero? Yeah he's available, but he took a team that was expected to be a perennial contender, left them with questionable defense and goaltending as well as absolutely no forward depth to speak of beyond the top 2 lines and left them with a coach who clearly couldn't rectify the problem. Seems like a downgrade to me. So really, I'm left asking, who is this Holland replacement that is going to come in and magically solve the fact that we no longer have Lidstrom on the back end, or trade for every elite player out there and give up nothing in return, etc etc? Because I really can't think of one.
I don't care who replaces him, probably someone in the organization. The point I make is that Holland is too tied to the past and cannot objectively make a decision to better the roster. At the very least someone else could come in and objectively say "Dan Cleary is done, we're going in another direction". I get loyalty, I get being good to the players who got you there etc. but Holland's loyalty to the old guard is actually hurting the team. If he doesn't have the balls to cut ties with the past and is too tied to his vets he needs to be replaced. He also has not shown that with parity in the league, he can manage a roster and assets successfully. When was the last move Holland made to acquire extra picks, or move out dead weight before he had to lose them for nothing via waivers. What was the last successful trade or ufa signing that Ken Holland has done on his own since 2009? Dekeyser was a no brainer and Alfie's agent called up Holland. If he can't make deals and can't be objective in how he looks at his roster he needs to go. When Ken Holland makes a trade now it's from a position of weakness and he gets fleeced (see the last few years of deadline trades).
My hope is he learned from last year when essentially 7 forwards were waived and our top two goal scorers last season were either in the pressbox or in Grand Rapids to start the season.
Depth really doesn't help and in fact hurts when you have 7 forwards no longer capable of playing hockey blocking NHL players from playing for your team and making your team better.
We waived seven forwards last year?
We waived seven forwards last year?
My hope is he learned from last year when essentially 7 forwards were waived and our top two goal scorers last season were either in the pressbox or in Grand Rapids to start the season.
Depth really doesn't help and in fact hurts when you have 7 forwards no longer capable of playing hockey blocking NHL players from playing for your team and making your team better.
And that's another thing as well. As the Blackhawks have shown, you have a core of players you build around and everyone else is just stop gaps and fillers. The Wings do the opposite, they load their roster with stop gaps and veteran fillers and have no room for the prospects to grow. Case in point, Drew Miller, Dan Cleary etc..etc. WE can't cut ties with Dan frickin' Cleary and other teams are talking about trading away roster players, teams like Chicago, Boston etc. are all talking about moving players who are not rally core players but nice complimentary pieces to get more flexible under the cap and keep their rosters fresh. If Brandan Saad was drafted b the Wings he'd be in Grand Rapids and we'd be wondering how we can make room for him with guys like Andersson and Glendening ahead of him. Pathetic
I think sheahan is comparable to Saad. and Sheahan is here to stay. Holland did one thing right already this off-season and that's not bring back Legwand. Sheahan is going to develop here instead of GR like he should.
1. the track record of Holland needs to stop being used as a defense. It's not relevant to the cap era. I always use the Lapointe for 5 million deal when this comes up. This was one of KH last non-cap signings and it really shows how he loved to make it rain if he wanted to strong arm weaker teams away from players he wanted.
I don't care who replaces him, probably someone in the organization. The point I make is that Holland is too tied to the past and cannot objectively make a decision to better the roster. At the very least someone else could come in and objectively say "Dan Cleary is done, we're going in another direction". I get loyalty, I get being good to the players who got you there etc. but Holland's loyalty to the old guard is actually hurting the team. If he doesn't have the balls to cut ties with the past and is too tied to his vets he needs to be replaced. He also has not shown that with parity in the league, he can manage a roster and assets successfully. When was the last move Holland made to acquire extra picks, or move out dead weight before he had to lose them for nothing via waivers. What was the last successful trade or ufa signing that Ken Holland has done on his own since 2009? Dekeyser was a no brainer and Alfie's agent called up Holland. If he can't make deals and can't be objective in how he looks at his roster he needs to go. When Ken Holland makes a trade now it's from a position of weakness and he gets fleeced (see the last few years of deadline trades).
Also we fail to acknowledge when he does something good. Let's not forget he got a pick for Brad Stuart from San Jose even though Stewie was destined to go there anyway. Or what about the conditional pick for Kent Huskins. Or any return whatsoever on the polished turd known as Ville Leino.
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Thread is relevant again!!!!
Seriously? One isn't enough?