News Article: Kane best American player per NHL.com writers

[crazyhawk]

Yeah, as of now I would rank the Best American players All Time in this order ..
Kane, Modano, Chelios, LaFontaine, Leetch for the top 5

 

[LordKOTL]

Yeah, as of now I would rank the Best American players All Time in this order ..
Kane, Modano, Chelios, LaFontaine, Leetch for the top 5

I don't disagree, but serious question:

Do you think when all's said and done Debrincat breaks into that top-5 list?

 

[No Fun Shogun]

If I said that Kane was a top five forward since he joined the NHL, I'd probably be understating it.

Unquestionable in my mind that he's the best American.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

How Patrick Kane traded weights for points

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

I don't disagree, but serious question:

Do you think when all's said and done Debrincat breaks into that top-5 list?

No chance in my opinion. That's no slight on Cat though.

 

[cassac]

How Patrick Kane traded weights for points

Good article. The change in conditioning might extend his career even longer.

 

[ColdSteel2]

Says Kane now: "Sometimes fans and media are not that far off, but sometimes it's far-fetched to read what they think, and put it together and make it realistic. If the team is not playing well, they want all these moves to be made, and it's just not realistic. You understand the passion, that's the great thing about being in Chicago and playing for a great organization and a great sports city. They're passionate and they want the team to win -- and trust me, we do, too."

Kane with a shout-out to us here.

 

[crazyhawk]

I don't disagree, but serious question:

Do you think when all's said and done Debrincat breaks into that top-5 list?

Getting back a little late here .. sorry but yes I would say the Cat would have that potential .. long way to go though!

 

[AmericanDream]

NHL Network just did the top 25 greatest American players all-time...

I can't recall the entire list,

but

#6. Quick
#5. Kane
#4. Modano
#3. Leetch
#2. Chelios
#1. Hull

obviously Hull isn't American born but he is a US player, so they put him #1 overall, I do not agree with him being #1 but he definitely is top 3...putting Leetch above Modano was odd as well.

Roenick was 12th...no Amonte...Lafontaine was 10th..hahahaha that is pure batshit wrong. They had Rod Langway, Mark Howe and Quick ahead of Lafontaine...a lot of great players on the list -Housley 11th as ex Hawk as well...Gary Suter was 22nd I believe as well...

 

[LordKOTL]

No chance in my opinion. That's no slight on Cat though.

VVV

Getting back a little late here .. sorry but yes I would say the Cat would have that potential .. long way to go though!

I agree he's got a shot, but it's a long way to go. I seem to recall way back when there being the same questions about Kane--being a small offensively minded FWD and with Toews having a much-more complete game.

We'll see how he develops. I think there are 2 things working against Debrincat:

Kane seems to be a better setup guy and thus more points via assists.

Kane, at 21, had one of the best 'hawk defenses of all time behind him. Debrincat at 21 has one of the worst. Ergo every D-mistake Debrincat makes is magnified because of the gong show behind him.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

I just think Cat as top 5 American all time isn't realistic at all and that's no shot at him. If you just took active players, it's not a slam dunk that he would be a top 5 player (for the career). Kane, Matthews, Gaudreau, Kessel, Eichel, Larkin, Suter, Quick are guys that I wouldn't be surprised at all to have better careers and that's just off the top off my head. Again, that' s no slight on Cat.

 

[RayP]

Cat doesn’t do enough other things to ever been in top 5 all time consideration. Maybe just as a goal scorer he is, though.

 

[AmericanDream]

Cat doesn’t do enough other things to ever been in top 5 all time consideration. Maybe just as a goal scorer he is, though.

yep, names like Tkachuk, Leclair, and Guerin all were pretty prolific goal scorers, Tkachuk hitting 500 goals plus and none of them would be considered in the top 5 let alone barely top 10..Cat will be like them, great player but just not enough there to put him at that level IMO.

 

[JaegerDice]

How Patrick Kane traded weights for points

It's interesting, as Toews essentially did the same thing over the last 2 off-seasons, particularly this past off-season. Stopped focusing on getting strong, start focusing on getting fast.

I think the days of NHL forwards spending their summers trying to bulk up are over. It's not necessary in this game, or at least, not nearly as necessary as being mobile.

 

[ChiHawks10]

It's interesting, as Toews essentially did the same thing over the last 2 off-seasons, particularly this past off-season. Stopped focusing on getting strong, start focusing on getting fast.

I think the days of NHL forwards spending their summers trying to bulk up are over. It's not necessary in this game, or at least, not nearly as necessary as being mobile.

I don't think this was ever a thing, at least for 99% of the NHL. Anyone with half a brain knows hockey is a sport that is entirely based around mobility/speed, and not bulk/strength(most the time). Toews was just being dumb.

 

[JaegerDice]

I don't think this was ever a thing, at least for 99% of the NHL. Anyone with half a brain knows hockey is a sport that is entirely based around mobility/speed, and not bulk/strength(most the time). Toews was just being dumb.

You may be right.

Most of what I've read and listened to on podcasts gives the impression that NHL skaters spent the bulk of their off-season at the gym, then hit the ice just before pre-season. I think it's changing.

Jeff Marek, who I like a lot and consider pretty smart, as well as fairly well connected as far as just shooting the **** with players, once made the point that while skaters were busy at the gym bulking up in the off-season, goalies were using the time to hone their craft, learn and implement new techniques. And that's why goalies overshot players as far as impact, more so than any equipment changes. And he said, years ago, that's starting to change. That the idea that 'you can't teach offense' is breaking down, as players find shooting coaches and skating coaches and whatnot. And why kids coming into the league now, who have only ever played and understood hockey within the prism of the post-2005 rules, are doing things and capable of shooting pucks from angles and positions that seem impossible. They've been training differently their whole lives, prioritizing differently.

As far as Toews... I think dumb is a little harsh. I definitely think he was behind the curve. I think he continued training the same way he had for his pro career up until that point. But the league was changing, and he didn't react fast enough to it. He kept training like a guy who made his money grinding on the cycle and fighting for space in front of the net. Last season he finally had a 'come to jesus' moment and said he had to adjust his training AND the way he plays for the younger faster game.

 

[Blue Liner]

You may be right.

Most of what I've read and listened to on podcasts gives the impression that NHL skaters spent the bulk of their off-season at the gym, then hit the ice just before pre-season. I think it's changing.

Jeff Marek, who I like a lot and consider pretty smart, as well as fairly well connected as far as just shooting the **** with players, once made the point that while skaters were busy at the gym bulking up in the off-season, goalies were using the time to hone their craft, learn and implement new techniques. And that's why goalies overshot players as far as impact, more so than any equipment changes. And he said, years ago, that's starting to change. That the idea that 'you can't teach offense' is breaking down, as players find shooting coaches and skating coaches and whatnot. And why kids coming into the league now, who have only ever played and understood hockey within the prism of the post-2005 rules, are doing things and capable of shooting pucks from angles and positions that seem impossible. They've been training differently their whole lives, prioritizing differently.

As far as Toews... I think dumb is a little harsh. I definitely think he was behind the curve. I think he continued training the same way he had for his pro career up until that point. But the league was changing, and he didn't react fast enough to it. He kept training like a guy who made his money grinding on the cycle and fighting for space in front of the net. Last season he finally had a 'come to jesus' moment and said he had to adjust his training AND the way he plays for the younger faster game.

Lot of truth here. Good stuff.

 

[LordKOTL]

I just think Cat as top 5 American all time isn't realistic at all and that's no shot at him. If you just took active players, it's not a slam dunk that he would be a top 5 player (for the career). Kane, Matthews, Gaudreau, Kessel, Eichel, Larkin, Suter, Quick are guys that I wouldn't be surprised at all to have better careers and that's just off the top off my head. Again, that' s no slight on Cat.

VVV

Cat doesn’t do enough other things to ever been in top 5 all time consideration. Maybe just as a goal scorer he is, though.

1st off, never though it was a slight in the least--just a good topic for discussion.

RayP kinda hit the point I was alluding to--Kane is a play maker and will get a ton of points for setting guys up--as his numbers show. Debrincat on the other hand would have to do it from raw goal scoring:

At the end of the 2010 season (looking at regular season alone since the D sucks bad enough that the playoffs, much less a SC run are virtually a pipe dream), in which Kane turned 21, he 1st broke 30 goals in his 3rd complete season. By the end of the 2010 regular season, Kane put up 76 regular season goals total under 244 games, or .311 G/GP.

Even though this year is not finished, it's Debrincat's 2nd full year and he's up to 34 goals. Debrincat turned 21 for comparison this year, and with 145 games under his belt so far he has 62 goals, or .428 G/GP.

I think it's a long shot especially since there's no guarenteed Debrincat will improve, but I think it's premature to say "no chance". Kane's G/GP went from .311 at the end of the 2010 season to .397 now. If Debrncat can improve at the same clip Kane did? he'd be over .500 G/GP. I don't know if that qualifies as "top 5 all time american born", but right now in the league there are only 3 players all-time with over .500 G/GP and over 500 GP: Oveckhin, Stamkos, and Kovalchuck.

No guarantees and the kid has a very long way to go, but I think if the kid winds up around .500 G/GP he's gotta be in the discussion for one of the top American players (top 10? 15?), especially since he didn't play in the 1980's.

 

[Blue Liner]

Alex DeBrincat is Brett Hull-Lite, and it's really only Lite because he's playing in this era where no one is going to score 72 or 86 goals in a season. He may not be as good or as prolific a scorer but there are a lot of parallels in their games, and I'm pretty sure DeBrincat is filling NHL nets at a better rate at a younger age than Hull did, off the top of my head.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

Cat as a top 5 US goal scorer either (in name or actual production) is a much more realistic possibility. I'd still bet against it, but it's in the realm of possibilities.

 

[LordKOTL]

We'll see. I just love what I see from the kid--especially the snarl from a pint-sized player.

Can we all at least agree he's a major boon to the club and no one wants to see him go?

 

[Blue Liner]

We'll see. I just love what I see from the kid--especially the snarl from a pint-sized player.

Can we all at least agree he's a major boon to the club and no one wants to see him go?

I tweeted it last week, I think, that I chuckle with every goal he scores at anyone who thought he would't be a goal scorer at the NHL level simply because of his size.

 

[ChiHawks10]

I tweeted it last week, I think, that I chuckle with every goal he scores at anyone who thought he would't be a goal scorer at the NHL level simply because of his size.

People are stupid.

Stevie Wonder could see the talent there...

 

[sharkhawk]

NHL Network just did the top 25 greatest American players all-time...

I can't recall the entire list,

but

#6. Quick
#5. Kane
#4. Modano
#3. Leetch
#2. Chelios
#1. Hull

obviously Hull isn't American born but he is a US player, so they put him #1 overall, I do not agree with him being #1 but he definitely is top 3...putting Leetch above Modano was odd as well.

Roenick was 12th...no Amonte...Lafontaine was 10th..hahahaha that is pure bat**** wrong. They had Rod Langway, Mark Howe and Quick ahead of Lafontaine...a lot of great players on the list -Housley 11th as ex Hawk as well...Gary Suter was 22nd I believe as well...

I’ve been posting on all these greatest American players threads for awhile, Modano was not a better player than lafontaine, lafontaine was one of the best players in the league for a few years, modano just played for a long time.

 

[featherhawk]

Its tough to place Kane yet as he is not done yet and in all likelyhood has another 3-4 years of high end production left. At this point in time I would rank them as follows:

Hull
Kane
Chelios
Lafontaine
Modano

I do think Kane and Hull will be switching spots at some point before the end of Kane's career.