Prospect Info: Jets Top Prospects Poll: #11 Prospect

[puck stoppa]

Jets Top 20 Prospects - 2019

1. Kristian Vesalainen - 45.4%
2. Dylan Samberg - 43.8%
3. Ville Heinola - 50%
4. Sami Niku - 90.8%
5. Mason Appleton - 71.7%%
6. Logan Stanley - 37.1%
7. Mikhail Berdin - 47.3%
8. David Gustafsson - 69.4%
9. Jonathan Kovacevic - 59.8%
10. Henri Nikkanen - 30.2%

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[DEANYOUNGBLOOD17]

Nikannen # 10

A bit early as usual with these polls. Fans get caught up after the draft on potential on the most recent draft picks. I would have preferred to have 3rd-7 Th round draft picks enter our top 20 lists at the 14 Th or higher spot. At least until their D2 year after we have seen them play for a year as a Jet prospect either against men or as an 18 year old in Junior....... or they start getting facial hair.

I remember a few years back in 2014 in our top 20 polls everybody had it hard for our recent 3 rd pick Glover. An up and coming D man that they were going to pair with Trouba. I was pushing Hard for Copp at #10 and people were pushing hard for Glover since the 6 Th pick. That is where I phrased the the term “Glover Lovers”...... The “Glover Lovers” won and I think Copp came in @ 12 on our rankings........... Where are they now on our team depth chart?

I hope this works out better than Glover for you guys “Pickanen Nikkanen”.......

I actually really like the pick Nikkanen ..... and I hope it works out great for the Jets..... but at this time I see it as no better value than our great value pick of 2015 in the 4 Th round Spacek who was rated to be drafted in the 2 nd round that year.

( 4 years later and Spacek will probably go @ #12 or #13 in this years poll)

Oh well

Chisholm is the easy pick here as he matured well past his draft position last year in his D+1 year and if he takes another leap in his development this year we may have a player.

 

[voyageur]

Nikannen # 10

A bit early as usual with these polls. Fans get caught up after the draft on potential on the most recent draft picks. I would have preferred to have 3rd-7 Th round draft picks enter our top 20 lists at the 14 Th or higher spot. At least until their D2 year after we have seen them play for a year as a Jet prospect either against men or 18 year old in Junior....... or they start getting facial hair.

I remember a few years back in 2014 in our top 20 polls everybody had it hard for our recent 3 rd pick Glover. An up and coming D man that they were going to pair with Trouba. I was pushing Hard for Copp at #10 and people were pushing hard for Glover since the 6 Th pick. That is where I phrased the the term “Glover Lovers”...... The “Glover Livers” won and I think Copp came in @ 12 on our rankings........... Where are they now on our team depth chart?

I hope this works out better than Glover for you guys “Pickanen Nikkanen”.......

I actually really like the pick Nikkanen ..... and I hope it works out great for the Jets..... but at this time I see it as no better value than our great value pick of 2015 in the 4 Th round Spacek who was rated to be drafted in the 2 nd round that year.

Oh well

Chisholm is the easy pick here as he matured well past his draft position last year in his D+1 year and if he takes another leap in his development this year we may have a player.

I have given up now. Apparently we have the best defense in the NHL, waiting in the wings. And our later round centres are can't miss. Nevermind that we have gone through Yuen, Glover, Kostalek. No mention of Nelson Nogier who could actually play in the NHL this year. We have studs in the foundation, if you believe these polls. Anyways I voted for the only guy on this list who had a two goal game in preseason last year. I'll keep trying.

 

[truck]

Chisholm again.

 

[DEANYOUNGBLOOD17]

I have given up now. Apparently we have the best defense in the NHL, waiting in the wings. And our later round centres are can't miss. Nevermind that we have gone through Yuen, Glover, Kostalek. No mention of Nelson Nogier who could actually play in the NHL this year. We have studs in the foundation, if you believe these polls. Anyways I voted for the only guy on this list who had a two goal game in preseason last year. I'll keep trying.

Go ahead and give up. I do not know why you are in a “Frenzy for McKenzie”.

I do not have him even making the top 20. ....... and for his 2 goals in a pre season game........ I have 2 words for you ..... Hanna Jarvenpaa. He had 4 goals in a pre season game and McKenzie has a tenth of his talent.

Voyageur If you are going to give up ( and not saying you should) maybe concentrate on next years Ice sculptures designs for the festival instead of these polls.

Note (mods this is not an attack on Voyageur the poster as he said he was going to quit and I have nothing but respect for the festival in Feb. and the people who do those sculptures).

 

[surixon]

Chisholm again for me.

 

[Rheged]

Green Bean!

 

[voyageur]

Go ahead and give up. I do not know why you are in a “Frenzy for McKenzie”.

I do not have him even making the top 20. ....... and for his 2 goals in a pre season game........ I have 2 words for you ..... Hanna Jarvenpaa. He had 4 goals in a pre season game and McKenzie has a tenth of his talent.

Voyageur If you are going to give up ( and not saying you should) maybe concentrate on next years Ice sculptures designs for the festival instead of these polls.

Note (mods this is not an attack on Voyageur the poster as he said he was going to quit and I have nothing but respect for the festival in Feb. and the people who do those sculptures).

It's funny just to see people's take on these polls. Who is going to make the NHL? I am willing to bet Mc Kenzie does. His d+1 was a wreck, with injury, but when he played with Suess he was pretty good. He put up a + last year on the Moose, how many others did? Where do we have opportunity? Bottom line forwards, and this kid can play. Spacek was horseshit in camp, couldn't play against strong competition. But he's ready? Green was teetering on being in the ECHL? These Chisholm and Vallati kids have some potential, but how far off are they? Mc Kenzie could play as early as this year, if the injuries pile up. I'd give him a better chance than Harkins just because of skating. Luoto might get a look if we need Pkers. But let's vote for guys that are 3 years away from being anything, if they become anything. That's the logic here.

 

[MardyBum]

Chisholm.

 

[nobody imp0rtant]

I'll Decline the Declan for now, and be Keen for Green.

Add Wong, please.

 

[garret9]

The Jets prospects defensive depth has never been better. The accomplishments of the current crops middling defenders outshines that any of those in the previous era. They lack the elites, as I don't think any have been as impressive as Trouba or Morrissey, but they dwarf the previous ones...

So ya, I do remember Glover, Kostalek, and Yuen, etc. and I can compare where they were to these guys.

I also remember that Jets were reluctant to sign "NHL ready" Nelson Nogier.

 

[Daximus]

It's funny just to see people's take on these polls. Who is going to make the NHL? I am willing to bet Mc Kenzie does. His d+1 was a wreck, with injury, but when he played with Suess he was pretty good. He put up a + last year on the Moose, how many others did? Where do we have opportunity? Bottom line forwards, and this kid can play. Spacek was horse**** in camp, couldn't play against strong competition. But he's ready? Green was teetering on being in the ECHL? These Chisholm and Vallati kids have some potential, but how far off are they? Mc Kenzie could play as early as this year, if the injuries pile up. I'd give him a better chance than Harkins just because of skating. Luoto might get a look if we need Pkers. But let's vote for guys that are 3 years away from being anything, if they become anything. That's the logic here.

I agree on all your other points except Green the kid had shoulder surgery and a concussion...

 

[voyageur]

The Jets defensive depth has never been better. The accomplishments of the current crops middling defenders outshines that any of those in the previous era. They lack the elites, as I don't think any have been as impressive as Trouba or Morrissey, but they dwarf the previous ones...

So ya, I do remember Glover, Kostalek, and Yuen, etc. and I can compare where they were to these guys.

I also remember that Jets were reluctant to sign "NHL ready" Nelson Nogier.

Source? Given that we have Buff, Morrissey, Pionk and Niku, you would think the primary need after that is defensive defensemen. Blues don't win without guys like Edmunson. Gunnarson. Poolman is up, but after him, it's Stanley, Kovacevic, Nogier next, one would think? Maybe Bitteto. Guys like Green and Gawanke I would think are down the depth chart?

We might be better at defense there are some promising players in the mix, I don't even remember if Chisholm and Vallati got a look in camp last year. Did Green suit up? I don't think they did. That says a lot does it not about how far away they are from being pros, no, from a management perspective?

 

[truck]

Green has some slick skill, but there have always been big question marks about his reads and defensive play. Those are still there and he's only played 25 game across the last two seasons.

I have him firmly in long shot territory - behind Chisholm, Valatti, Spacek and Gawanke - until he stays healthy and shows a more steady 2-way game.

 

[garret9]

Source? Given that we have Buff, Morrissey, Pionk and Niku, you would think the primary need after that is defensive defensemen. Blues don't win without guys like Edmunson. Gunnarson. Poolman is up, but after him, it's Stanley, Kovacevic, Nogier next, one would think? Maybe Bitteto. Guys like Green and Gawanke I would think are down the depth chart?

We might be better at defense there are some promising players in the mix, I don't even remember if Chisholm and Vallati got a look in camp last year. Did Green suit up? I don't think they did. That says a lot does it not about how far away they are from being pros, no, from a management perspective?

I'm the source... well my sources are.

I've broken a lot of things like that here. I have a reputation that has allowed me to say things here and mods have verified that.

As to who is "ready" for the NHL at this moment in time... don't see how that tells me that the depth in d-prospects now is or isn't better than what it was prior.

As to Blues don't win with... any team can and will win with or without any player. It's a team game and it's weighted probability. Players just increase/decrease your chance by a few percentage points.

 

[voyageur]

I'm the source... well my sources are.

I've broken a lot of things like that here. I have a reputation that has allowed me to say things here and mods have verified that.

As to who is "ready" for the NHL at this moment in time... don't see how that tells me that the depth in d-prospects now is or isn't better than what it was prior.

As to Blues don't win with... any team can and will win with or without any player. It's a team game and it's weighted probability. Players just increase/decrease your chance by a few percentage points.

I trust you as a source, as you have insider information. And I agree that the depth is better, but how many of these guys are actually serious candidates?

We have Morrissey and Buff that are irreplaceable, with the prospects we have. Heinola has a chance to be a solid top 4 defenseman. Niku was well down the depth chart last year. Behind Poolman, who is here for 3 more years, conceivably. Played behind Beaulieu, fwiw. Samberg looks blue chip. A lot to like about Kovacevic. Stanley is not popular in these parts but's he was given the TC experience, and by some accounts was a consideration for a callup last year. Now we might luck out and get one of these prospects into a solid bottom pairing, but none of them are guaranteed anything with the names (minus Beaulieu) I just mentioned ahead of them. They are going to have to be better, and that seems far from foregone in the conclusion. It's just optimism, that these players will amount to more than Nogier in their careers.

And say what you will. Those guys got their names engraved on the Cup. What's the relative value of that? Vs. a team that could not hold down a lead last year. I'll give Larry Robinson his due. But those were strong players during the Cup run, and you need those role players to win. It could be argued that our role players didn't match up, hence all the new faces, ripened with optimism. Still years away.

 

[MardyBum]

I trust you as a source, as you have insider information. And I agree that the depth is better, but how many of these guys are actually serious candidates?

We have Morrissey and Buff that are irreplaceable, with the prospects we have. Heinola has a chance to be a solid top 4 defenseman. Niku was well down the depth chart last year. Behind Poolman, who is here for 3 more years, conceivably. Played behind Beaulieu, fwiw. Samberg looks blue chip. A lot to like about Kovacevic. Stanley is not popular in these parts but's he was given the TC experience, and by some accounts was a consideration for a callup last year. Now we might luck out and get one of these prospects into a solid bottom pairing, but none of them are guaranteed anything with the names (minus Beaulieu) I just mentioned ahead of them. They are going to have to be better, and that seems far from foregone in the conclusion. It's just optimism, that these players will amount to more than Nogier in their careers.

And say what you will. Those guys got their names engraved on the Cup. What's the relative value of that? Vs. a team that could not hold down a lead last year. I'll give Larry Robinson his due. But those were strong players during the Cup run, and you need those role players to win. It could be argued that our role players didn't match up, hence all the new faces, ripened with optimism. Still years away.

How serious a candidate is McKenzie? These prospects going ahead of him are going because they're better prospects. He's not beating out Vesalainen or Appleton for a spot, and Gus will likely pass him this year as a C option that could also play wing. He's likely behind Letestu as well, maybe even Spacek.

No one can tell what our team will be in 2 years time.

 

[garret9]

Points are far from perfect but that's okay because the above is just looking at a trend, not an actual specific prediction.

The general trend, looking at non-first rounders, seems that the overall talent of the 2015-19 draft class is greater than the 2011-14 talent. Some of it may be that the average pick is a bit earlier (~30 picks), but it legit seems like a trend.


*Keep in mind some of these sample sizes are smaller than others... example Luke Green's +2 year is fairly low sample*

 

[voyageur]

How serious a candidate is McKenzie? These prospects going ahead of him are going because they're better prospects. He's not beating out Vesalainen or Appleton for a spot, and Gus will likely pass him this year as a C option that could also play wing. He's likely behind Letestu as well, maybe even Spacek.

No one can tell what our team will be in 2 years time.

Everyone here is entitled to their opinion so I don't have a problem disagreeing. I am predicting Mc Kenzie scores his first goal on the Jets this year. That's my short term optimism. Long term nobody knows. I am curious if we changed anything in our scouting department to make us better at scouting defensemen, because it is fair to say that recent picks have been better than past ones, excepting 2 defensemen drafted in 2012 and 2013.

 

[Rheged]

Points are far from perfect but that's okay because the above is just looking at a trend, not an actual specific prediction.

The general trend, looking at non-first rounders, seems that the overall talent of the 2015-19 draft class is greater than the 2011-14 talent.

Vollman's NHLe, or your own flavour?

 

[garret9]

Vollman's NHLe, or your own flavour?

Own.
I found a lot of my were close to Vollman though.
I prefer not to adjust scoring by leagues, but an analysis like this I think works.

 

[snowkiddin]

I’m going Chisholm again and then Spacek

 

[garret9]

I trust you as a source, as you have insider information. And I agree that the depth is better, but how many of these guys are actually serious candidates?

We have Morrissey and Buff that are irreplaceable, with the prospects we have. Heinola has a chance to be a solid top 4 defenseman. Niku was well down the depth chart last year. Behind Poolman, who is here for 3 more years, conceivably. Played behind Beaulieu, fwiw. Samberg looks blue chip. A lot to like about Kovacevic. Stanley is not popular in these parts but's he was given the TC experience, and by some accounts was a consideration for a callup last year. Now we might luck out and get one of these prospects into a solid bottom pairing, but none of them are guaranteed anything with the names (minus Beaulieu) I just mentioned ahead of them. They are going to have to be better, and that seems far from foregone in the conclusion. It's just optimism, that these players will amount to more than Nogier in their careers.

And say what you will. Those guys got their names engraved on the Cup. What's the relative value of that? Vs. a team that could not hold down a lead last year. I'll give Larry Robinson his due. But those were strong players during the Cup run, and you need those role players to win. It could be argued that our role players didn't match up, hence all the new faces, ripened with optimism. Still years away.

You only need to score more goals than the other team. How you do it may and will vary.

Luck.
Skill.
Grit.
Leadership.
Etc.

All of it is just scoring more goals than the other team. You don't need anything... you just need the sum of the above to be more than the sum of the other team.

 

[voyageur]

You only need to score more goals than the other team. How you do it may and will vary.

Luck.
Skill.
Grit.
Leadership.
Etc.

All of it is just scoring more goals than the other team. You don't need anything... you just need the sum of the above to be more than the sum of the other team.

Goaltending should be high on the list. Also execution. Jets defense was consistently beaten on the pinch, two years in a row, leaving lanes. I think this is an area that is being addressed, going forward.

 

[DEANYOUNGBLOOD17]

Source? Given that we have Buff, Morrissey, Pionk and Niku, you would think the primary need after that is defensive defensemen. Blues don't win without guys like Edmunson. Gunnarson. Poolman is up, but after him, it's Stanley, Kovacevic, Nogier next, one would think? Maybe Bitteto. Guys like Green and Gawanke I would think are down the depth chart?

We might be better at defense there are some promising players in the mix, I don't even remember if Chisholm and Vallati got a look in camp last year. Did Green suit up? I don't think they did. That says a lot does it not about how far away they are from being pros, no, from a management perspective?

Get a look in camp? Suit up? Chisholm /Vallati had just been drafted 3 months b4..... not many 18 year olds make it into a pre-season game at their 1 st camp unless they are blue chippers /1 st rounder. Stanley (1st rounder) did not get into a pre season game in his first camp.

McKenzie was not even drafted in his D+1 year ( drafted 7 Th round d+2)/ did not dress for a pre season game @ his first camp d+2, but did score 2 goals in a pre season game in his d+3 camp. He is heading into his D + 4 year and I see Seuss/Lipon/ Seth G/ Spacek/ and Logan Shaw* ahead of McKenzie on the call up list. that’s with Apples and VESA-Laine making the team.

So........ we would need 6 Fwd. injuries to have McKenzie get called up to sit in the press box as the 13 Th forward.