Confirmed with Link: Jake Allen (50% retained) traded to the Devils for cond. 2025 3rd (2025 2nd if Allen plays in 40+ games and team qualifies for playoffs next season)

[Sorinth]

Many applauded the signing, now they are applauding the trade.

The original signing by Hughes was a bit rushed, and overpriced but the price was basically irrelevant since we didn't need the money during the rebuild years. Ideally he would have waited until January or so to re-sign Allen at which point we would have seen that Montembeault had some real potential but that's mostly meh.

And in an alternate reality where we didn't sign Allen to that deal we easily could've ended up in a worse position because it would've meant playing Montembeault more which not only might mean more wins and worse draft position but also a higher contract for him. If this is Hughes' worst (Which so far probably is) then we are laughing.

 

[Rapala]

The fact they needed to move him, to get a top 90 pick, I'm impressed.

The salary retention still saves us cap space. Its not like we need it for anything major anyways.

Eddy comes off Allen goes on. No worries there.

 

[The Great Weal]

The original signing by Hughes was a bit rushed, and overpriced but the price was basically irrelevant since we didn't need the money during the rebuild years. Ideally he would have waited until January or so to re-sign Allen at which point we would have seen that Montembeault had some real potential but that's mostly meh.

I mean it definitely was relevant. We wouldn't have wasted a retention slot if his contract didn't suck. Yes some players on rebuilding teams get very expensive contracts (Foligno and Perry for 1 year deals come to mind) but those are short term players that they were going to keep no matter what to help Bedard. Just because he can get away with it due to the team's current situation doesn't dismiss the fact that it was a bad signing.

And in an alternate reality where we didn't sign Allen to that deal we easily could've ended up in a worse position because it would've meant playing Montembeault more which not only might mean more wins and worse draft position but also a higher contract for him. If this is Hughes' worst (Which so far probably is) then we are laughing.

I don't support this thinking. It would be the equivalent of saying we should play Jake Evans over Suzuki since Suzuki is getting us points in the standings.

 

[Sorinth]

I mean it definitely was relevant. We wouldn't have wasted a retention slot if his contract didn't suck. Yes some players on rebuilding teams get very expensive contracts (Foligno and Perry for 1 year deals come to mind) but those are short term players that they were going to keep no matter what to help Bedard. Just because he can get away with it due to the team's current situation doesn't dismiss the fact that it was a bad signing.

I don't support this thinking. It would be the equivalent of saying we should play Jake Evans over Suzuki since Suzuki is getting us points in the standings.

What part of my post do you think was "definitely relevant"?

A 2 year deal is short term deal, and I fully understand why Hughes did it. It was probably the right call even though the "perfect" situation would've been to wait 4 months and then workout a 1 year deal. But we shouldn't let the perfect be the enemy of the good, and even with hindsight this deal should probably be viewed as overall being good for the team.

 

[Rapala]

Hughes using his retention spot on Allen instead of Savard is very, very, very smart.

He kept it in play for as long as he could just in case mana fell from heaven in Savard's case.
It's pretty much what he said it was "We aren't looking to move David Savard"
People were kicking the tires so you have to wait just in case.

 

[Ezpz]

Still very impressed Allen got arguably the fourth or fifth biggest return of the trade deadline. We didn't take back any contracts or send any picks.

 

[Rapala]

Out of curiosity are the same people who were complaining about having extended him in the first place now crying about retention.

Hughes may have made a mistake re-upping Allen...
but damn if we could get rid of some of Bergevin's mistakes as painlessly there would be dancing in the streets.

 

[The Great Weal]

What part of my post do you think was "definitely relevant"?

The fact that he jumped the gun and grossly overpaid for a backup where he needed to retain half the salary to get a (likely) mid round pick back. For instance, we can only retain one of Armia/Dvorak/Savard now if we choose to trade them. They may be more valuable at 50% than Allen was.

A 2 year deal is short term deal, and I fully understand why Hughes did it. It was probably the right call even though the "perfect" situation would've been to wait 4 months and then workout a 1 year deal. But we shouldn't let the perfect be the enemy of the good, and even with hindsight this deal should probably be viewed as overall being good for the team.

It was an extension of the current deal he was on, so it's not the same thing. Nick Foligno also got extended for 2 years from his current deal, but the Hawks won't trade him because money for them doesn't matter when he's supposed to mentor Bedard. If a player emerges to overtake Foligno's current spot, that is still okay for the Hawks considering they are still lacking in NHL talent and still do not intend to trade him. It takes a lot more forwards to overtake Foligno for the Hawks than there would be goalies to overtake Allen on the Habs at the time.

The term and cap is the issue, not just the term. Had he extended Allen for 1.9x2 which is what he's retaining, then yes it's totally fine considering we are not hurt by it. Retaining on him for next year too hurts our chances of maximizing the return of one of Armia/Dvorak/Savard.

 

[Rapala]

The fact that he jumped the gun and grossly overpaid for a backup where he needed to retain half the salary to get a (likely) mid round pick back. For instance, we can only retain one of Armia/Dvorak/Savard now if we choose to trade them. They may be more valuable at 50% than Allen was.

It was an extension of the current deal he was on, so it's not the same thing. Nick Foligno also got extended for 2 years from his current deal, but the Hawks won't trade him because money for them doesn't matter when he's supposed to mentor Bedard. If a player emerges to overtake Foligno's current spot, that is still okay for the Hawks considering they are still lacking in NHL talent and still do not intend to trade him. It takes a lot more forwards to overtake Foligno for the Hawks than there would be goalies to overtake Allen on the Habs at the time.

The term and cap is the issue, not just the term. Had he extended Allen for 1.9x2 which is what he's retaining, then yes it's totally fine considering we are not hurt by it. Retaining on him for next year too hurts our chances of maximizing the return of one of Armia/Dvorak/Savard.

Give me a break.
Retaining on any of the names you mentioned isn't going to amount to a hill of beans.
Retention's worth is measured by the underlying value to begin with.
The idea is to move on from those players and there are various means of doing so.

 

[donghabs98]

A retention spot may not had been worth much depending on potential deals to broker. Plus side, we fixed our 3-goalie tandem situation and we’ll have a retention spot open for next year to potentially retain for Savard or Armia.

Considering its becoming the nornal to include a 3rd team in a trade to retain salary, I'm a bit taken back how much people are concerned at only having 1 retention slot. If someone really wants Savard, Armia, Dvorak next year, they'll find a way to make it work.

 

[montreal]

No GM is going to be right all the time, the problem is when they are wrong too often. Who knows what will happen in the coming years, either his moves are going to pan out or they won't. He sounds very smart, he's got experienced people around him. He's got a ton and I mean a ton of picks/prospects to work with so if he can make the right moves, the rebuild will be over sooner then later as he clearly has the parts to do a number of interesting things but they have to be the right moves or we will likely just be back to square one.

 

[The Great Weal]

Considering its becoming the nornal to include a 3rd team in a trade to retain salary, I'm a bit taken back how much people are concerned at only having 1 retention slot. If someone really wants Savard, Armia, Dvorak next year, they'll find a way to make it work.

I’m not complaining about the trade, the fact that we got anything for Allen for 50% is amazing. That being said Hughes is the one to give him that bad contract and I doubt a team is willing to move heaven and earth to get a guy like Armia. We could also definitely take cap back, but we probably won’t be able to maximize his value unless something like that happens which is far rarer than retention.

No GM will be completely flawless, but I don’t see the issue in pointing this out.

 

[Ozmodiar]

Folks complaining about not trading Savard when they don’t know what return was offered? lol

 

[Whitesnake]

Well it will be a 3rd. Kaakhonen now being acquired by Jersey? lol.

 

[Milhouse40]

I’m not complaining about the trade, the fact that we got anything for Allen for 50% is amazing. That being said Hughes is the one to give him that bad contract and I doubt a team is willing to move heaven and earth to get a guy like Armia. We could also definitely take cap back, but we probably won’t be able to maximize his value unless something like that happens which is far rarer than retention.

No GM will be completely flawless, but I don’t see the issue in pointing this out.

It's so easy to say years after that contract was signed.

But when Hugues signed Allen, Montembeault wasn't even a guarenteed 1A or 1B goaltender. Primeau was in AHL and barely sniff the NHL. Signing Allen was the right move back then as they needed Monty to have some competition and a veteran presence.

Was it too much of a contract?
It was market value especially considering all parties knew full well the team would suck and goalie would get destroyed on a nightly basis.

Having said that, today it would be consider a mistake but the mistake has been fixed and it's not a mistake on the level of Gallagher, we got a pick out of Allen and considering the price for guys like Tarasenko.......it's a good one!

 

[viceroy]

I still remember before last season when someone said they wouldn't trade Allen for less than 2x1st lmfao

Calling shenanigans.

Can we please stop using all our retention slots (for multiple years) to get mid round picks?

Well we have to clean up our messes don't we? Better that than buyouts. Criminy we're still paying for Karl Alzner's.

Judging by the reaction, you'd think we just acquired McDavid for future considerations.

So we can't enjoy small victories? Anywho if you're so miserable that you can't maybe change fandoms or seek help from a therapist.

He got it for retaining almost 2mil next season, that's what made Allen worthless. I feel like this needs repeating.

So what was your solution? Hold on to Allen, keep this three-headed monster of a goalie situation and hope for the best over the summer? Hughes was pro-active, I commend him for that.

So the habs have three 3rd round picks in 2025.

And if we're lucky we'll have 3 2nds instead.

Safe to say we aint getting that second round pick.

Why? I'm guessing the Devils don't want anything to do with a 3 man platoon in nets, so it'll be Allen + someone. He may very well be the 1A in this situation.

Not unless all their goalies get hurt and they have no choice but to play Allen.

They don't need to get hurt. They all suck, Allen IMHO sucks less.

I'm surprised mainboard isn't continuing this narrative that we all expect a 1st rounder for every asset in this organization.

Oh some were. Then again some still spew that Ryder, Halak and a 2nd meme to this day.

Matheson for a kings ransom
Newhook as part of a package for a big upgrade up front
Anderson if it (somehow) gets us a first
Evans if it gets us a first
Savard if it gets us a first

what are we getting by retaining on Eddy, Petry (x2), Allen (x2), Dvo, Armia?

Make it WORTH something

Now I just know you're delusional or as the kids say delulu...

Then there is only 1 slot left in 2024-2025 with expiring contracts like Savard and Armia to trade.

Not great.

I'm not sure why other Habs fans hail it like a super deal by Hughes.

Savard at the trade deadline next year will get us paid whether we retain or not. Oh and by the way did you watch Allen this season? Because if you did you'd know why it was a super deal.

Cue Habs fandom meltdown…. 3-2-1…

Meltdown? Most of us are pretty stoked over unloading him and actually getting some sort of return on him.

There's like a 1% chance of Allen playing 40 games next year. The odds are Devils add a legit starting goalie in the offseason.

Really? Because I swear they should've gotten help in the nets since early on in the season when they discovered they had squat talent-wise in goal but they pissed away their season dilly dallying. I'd be surprised if they made another confident move there this summer.

They should have put the condition on if they buy Allen out.

What? You think they'd buy out someone they just got who has 1yr left? I mean NJD management seem pretty dumb but that move over the summer? A pretty dumb idea to have.

I don't understand why people get all excited about 3rd+ rounders... at those rounds you're basically looking for luck for them to even make the NhL, let alone contribute.

Well our last 2 3rd Rounders are Jacob Fowler and Adam Engstrom. I personally like those 2 prospects.

I’m not complaining about the trade, the fact that we got anything for Allen for 50% is amazing. That being said Hughes is the one to give him that bad contract.

Yeah but back then nobody knew that Montembeault would finally arrive and turn into a legit #1 Goalie.

 

[26Mats]

Well it will be a 3rd. Kaakhonen now being acquired by Jersey? lol.

Yeah probably need Kakkonen to get injured or pkay really badly, it some combo of the two.

 

[Harry Kakalovich]

I never loved the most recent Allen extension, but he was coming off a pretty good season and the Habs had no known quantity between the pipes. The AAV was a bit too high for my taste but the term was good. In light of all that, it was not so terrible.

But I am happy to have that contract leaving the ledger (half now and half at the end of next season).

 

[Adam Michaels]

Looking at it from New Jersey's position, surely they had issues in front of the net and have had injury issues. but they are still 6 pts out of a playoff spot.

1) They move their top goal scorer in Toffoli for a 2nd and a 3rd, while retaining 50% of his $4.25M cap hit. So they still carry $2.125M.

2) They trade a condition 3rd for Allen, with Habs retaining 50% of his $3.85M, so Devils only have $1.925M.

So $2.125M + $1.925M = $4.05M.

So they saved $200K on the cap by shipping their top goal scorer out and bringing in another team's third goalie. And all they netted out of that in draft capital is a 2024 2nd round pick.

 

[The Great Weal]

It's so easy to say years after that contract was signed.

That would be like saying we shouldn't criticize the Drouin trade given that the plan was to have Drouin+Radulov on the team but Radulov wouldn't budge on his demands whatsoever and instead, we replaced him (terribly). This is a way more extreme version of what Hughes did, but the point is that this narrative can be applied to many scenarios.

But when Hugues signed Allen, Montembeault wasn't even a guarenteed 1A or 1B goaltender. Primeau was in AHL and barely sniff the NHL. Signing Allen was the right move back then as they needed Monty to have some competition and a veteran presence.

That still ended up being a bad decision. He jumped the gun on extending a backup goalie who wasn't due for a contract until that offseason. A GM can absolutely be evaluated for his moves based on hindsight, it goes for all of them.

Was it too much of a contract?
It was market value especially considering all parties knew full well the team would suck and goalie would get destroyed on a nightly basis.

Well it wasn't a good evaluation when the goalie significantly declined and we needed to retain half his contract just to get a mid round pick.

Having said that, today it would be consider a mistake but the mistake has been fixed and it's not a mistake on the level of Gallagher, we got a pick out of Allen and considering the price for guys like Tarasenko.......it's a good one!

Yes the mistake has been fixed, no denying that.

 

[Wats]

Did anyone confirm if it has to be regular season games?

 

[BozoTheClown]

This is a good trade. Would have been better carrying an extra skater for the year instead of the 3Gs.

 

[red devil]

Did anyone confirm if it has to be regular season games?

The condition states 40 or more games during the season, so it makes sense for it to be during the regular season

 

[Milhouse40]

That would be like saying we shouldn't criticize the Drouin trade given that the plan was to have Drouin+Radulov on the team but Radulov wouldn't budge on his demands whatsoever and instead, we replaced him (terribly). This is a way more extreme version of what Hughes did, but the point is that this narrative can be applied to many scenarios.

That still ended up being a bad decision. He jumped the gun on extending a backup goalie who wasn't due for a contract until that offseason. A GM can absolutely be evaluated for his moves based on hindsight, it goes for all of them.

Well it wasn't a good evaluation when the goalie significantly declined and we needed to retain half his contract just to get a mid round pick.

Yes the mistake has been fixed, no denying that.

A trade and a signing can't really be compare.....what the hell did we actually lost in signing Allen?
Cap space? Who cares we got a pick for it. Not like losing Sergachev.....

And we didn't needed to trade Allen, let's not forget that. The ONLY reason he's being traded is to make room for Primeau. If it wasn't for Primeau, there would be no talk of trading Allen.

The timing here was important. Hugues could have easily wait until this summer or even next trade deadline before trading Allen to get better value or not even retaining on Allen. Do you really think NJ got Allen for this and next season because they think he significantly declined? It's trade deadline, everybody retained salary, even for top players.

 

[Miller Time]

The biggest coup of this deal may well be the fact that it ties up two deadline assets (NJ 2nd & 3rd next year) from a team that we'll be fighting for a playoff spot with next season...

KH playing 3D chess