Prospect Info: Hurricanes Prospect Info and Discussion - Part VI

[AD Skinner]

Said actress to the bishop.

I feel like this is the classiest form of this joke

 

[geehaad]

I swear I saw something about Drury recently, but can’t find it atm, so apologies if this is redundant.

Drury, Walsh Head to World Junior Summer Showcase with USA Hockey

 

[cptjeff]

100% a workhorse. Definitely above average for OHL netminders. Just like in any league, it all comes down to the quality of the back-up and Kingston just didn't have much faith in either of the two back-ups they employed this year. As a team with 1st place aspirations, every win mattered and that meant a lot of busy weekends for Helvig. He was 3rd in minutes played behind Evan Cormier and Anthony Popovich, two goalies relied upon even more heavily.

As for a comparison. Always tough to compare goaltenders because their games are still evolving at this point. But probably projects as a Robin Lehner type. Fills a ton of the net with his size. They are built similarly. Key will just be to continue to improve his quickness. Definitely relies on positioning and does a good job swallowing up rebounds to limit second chances.

So, uh, hypothetically, if we were to run Helvig out for 74 games some year because our backup was a literal diseased goat, he might manage to hold up under that workload?

 

[A Star is Burns]

So, uh, hypothetically, if we were to run Helvig out for 74 games some year because our backup was a literal diseased goat, he might manage to hold up under that workload?

What does Michael Leighton have to do with this?

 

[Jerkob Slavin]

What does Michael Leighton have to do with this?

I thought a trade was underway. Darling (with 50% retained) for goat, diseased.

We shed a bad contract and upgrade in net.

 

[cptjeff]

What does Michael Leighton have to do with this?

Apparently nothing. I thought that it was Leighton when we ran Cam out for 74 games, but I checked back, and the backup that year was Peters.

 

[CandyCanes]

 

[cptjeff]

So a certain legendary (mythical?) Hurricanes defenseman pops up in the replies to that first tweet:

 

[CandyCanes]

So a certain legendary (mythical?) Hurricanes defenseman pops up in the replies to that first tweet:

Oh my gosh, my favorite Hurricane!

 

[emptyNedder]

Not sure I understand the comment in the above tweet: "lack of depth at C after Necas."

All of Wallmark, Kuokkanen, Saarela, Luostarinen, Maenalanen, Roy are listed primarily as centers or as W/C.

The prospect pool is deep. That includes center.

 

[NotOpie]

Geekie's also a C/W.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I get what Melichar is saying. Some of those guys listed are likely wingers if they make the NHL and the rest are probably 4th liners if they even make it to the NHL, and many of them won’t.

 

[spockBokk]

I get what Melichar is saying. Some of those guys listed are likely wingers if they make the NHL and the rest are probably 4th liners if they even make it to the NHL, and many of them won’t.

This is how I read it too. Sure there's a bunch of guys listed as Centers in the system, but the likelihood of them becoming a full time, NHL top 6 C is low. The likelihood they break in as wingers is much higher. There's not much to get excited about in the system as a potential 1st or 2nd line C, outside of Necas. Maybe Drury can be that 2C guy in the future, if he and Necas hit their ceilings.

 

[the halleJOKEL]

guys that isn't josef melichar

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

guys that isn't josef melichar

LOL....I fell for it as I didn't even pay attention once someone else posted it.

 

[CandyCanes]

I get what Melichar is saying. Some of those guys listed are likely wingers if they make the NHL and the rest are probably 4th liners if they even make it to the NHL, and many of them won’t.

But that’s true with all NHL prospect systems. I’d say the Canes might have one the deepest C prospect pools in the NHL. We have have a top tier guy in Necas (it’s quite hard to have multiple of those) and then we have 4-5 guys that all have fairly legit shots at becoming an NHL player, that’s pretty good depth in my mind.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

But that’s true with all NHL prospect systems. I’d say the Canes might have one the deepest C prospect pools in the NHL. We have have a top tier guy in Necas (it’s quite hard to have multiple of those) and then we have 4-5 guys that all have fairly legit shots at becoming an NHL player, that’s pretty good depth in my mind.

Not really. You have to look at it in terms of the system and what's at the NHL level when you talk about depth. Every team has guys that are AHL/NHL tweeners and/or 4th line capable guys like we do.

Canes legitimately have 1 top 6 C (Staal) right now. They have a couple of guys in Aho and Necas who have a chance to be one, but Aho's been a winger most of his career and that's about it.

Wallmark: to me he's barely NHL caliber from what I've seen. A poor man's Victor Rask. If he makes the NHL, I'll bet it's as a 4th liner.
Kuokkanen: I'm not as high on him as others are, but if he makes the NHL, it will be as a winger IMO.
Saarela: He's the prospect I'm highest on of all of those listed and has the best chance of making the NHL full time as more than a 4th liner. Still think he'll be a scoring winger though and not a C.
Luostarinen: Long shot to make the NHL.
Roy: Skating will be his downfall. If he makes the NHL, it's probably no more than a 3rd line C, but even that's a long shot.
Maenalanen: He's a bit of a wildcard that I don't know much about.

When you look at other teams, most of them already have one or two very good top 6 C so if they only have guys like Wallmark, Roy, etc.. in their system, that's fine. Canes don't have depth at the NHL level and the depth is all tweeners/bottom 6 guys.

That's what I think that tweet was saying with respect to Drury. After Necas, we have little to no depth in terms of guys that could become a top 6 C. If Aho and Necas pan out as top 6 centers, the organizational depth will be solid.

 

[emptyNedder]

That's what I think that tweet was saying with respect to Drury. After Necas, we have little to no depth in terms of guys that could become a top 6 C.

I haven't seen Drury other than prospect camp. But he doesn't seem to have top 6 upside either. The Draft Analyst said this in grading the Canes' 2018 draft:
Speed must not be that important to the Canes, because after taking elite sniper Andrei Svechnikov (second), they grabbed with their next two picks a pair of marginal skaters in centers Jack Drury (42nd) and Luke Henman (96th). Both have strengths in terms of puck possession and playmaking, but the speed just isn’t there.

I understand this is just one opinion. Still, skating has become the first criterium for considering prospects. At least that is what many of you have stated about the likes of Roy and even Zykov. My guess is that the praise for Drury is a bias toward U.S. players. Because it appears that Drury doesn't skate as well as Luostarinen or Saarela. Apparently only a little better than Roy, who has significantly more reach and is better at face-offs.

Maybe it is recency effect that is having others high on Drury. I don't see him as having any specific skill that would immediately raise him to the top of the Canes' prospect list for centers. Especially at his size--basically the same as Aho, whom many have been concerned is not big/strong enough to play center in the NHL.

 

[bleedgreen]

Drury is not a pretty skater. He’s a scrappy character player with a decent skill level. You can’t help but wonder how high he would’ve been drafted if he didn’t have the blood lines. On the other side, maybe the blood lines may part of the reason he fights through and makes it. Both his father and uncle were undersized and at the time of their draft not the most skilled, they both took long routes to the NHL and made it to different levels of success.

He is faster than Roy though. He moves his legs pretty fast they just aren’t overly efficient and graceful strides. Roy skated like a pregnant yak when he started pro. Time will tell there, but he’s got a battle.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I haven't seen Drury other than prospect camp. But he doesn't seem to have top 6 upside either. The Draft Analyst said this in grading the Canes' 2018 draft:
Speed must not be that important to the Canes, because after taking elite sniper Andrei Svechnikov (second), they grabbed with their next two picks a pair of marginal skaters in centers Jack Drury (42nd) and Luke Henman (96th). Both have strengths in terms of puck possession and playmaking, but the speed just isn’t there.

I understand this is just one opinion. Still, skating has become the first criterium for considering prospects. At least that is what many of you have stated about the likes of Roy and even Zykov. My guess is that the praise for Drury is a bias toward U.S. players. Because it appears that Drury doesn't skate as well as Luostarinen or Saarela. Apparently only a little better than Roy, who has significantly more reach and is better at face-offs.

Maybe it is recency effect that is having others high on Drury. I don't see him as having any specific skill that would immediately raise him to the top of the Canes' prospect list for centers. Especially at his size--basically the same as Aho, whom many have been concerned is not big/strong enough to play center in the NHL.

I know nothing at all about Drury so I'm neither high nor low on him.

The tweet asked about his ceiling and said IF he could reach his uncle's level, it would be huge for the Canes pipeline. IMO, that's a true statement because most of the guys we have in the system won't be a top 6 player and if Drury reaches his uncle's level, he would be. It's not saying he will reach that level, just asking if he would.

We do have depth in our pipeline, but we have a lot of unknowns at the NHL level (Aho a C or W?, How good will Necas be? Staal will be 30 to start the season. Can Rask bounce back? etc..) and the rest of the guys in our pipeline don't look to be a top 6 C to me.

 

[geehaad]

My guess is that the praise for Drury is a bias toward U.S. players.

The only praise I've seen is from Vanbiesbrouck, who made the comment relative to the players at the Team USA camp, so that praise cannot carry bias toward US players.

EDIT: I guess I should admit that I don't have any background on what prompted the comment to begin with, so I've made the assumption that this is a comment made by a guy in charge of Team USA at the conclusion of one of their camps/workouts/etc.

 

[NotOpie]

I get the takes about fears that our C depth might not be where it needs to be, but I also think there's a good deal of "short selling" going on.

Staal is a Top 6 centerman, better suited for 2nd line duties.

Aho has played C on the international stage effectively, has played briefly in the NHL at center. In both cases he was "fine".

Necas is a natural center w/Top 6 upside, but he's going to have a learning curve.

Rask very well could get back to his previous level if last year's efforts were based on a bum shoulder. If that's the case, then he's a middle 6 pivot.

I'm a little higher on Wallmark than some. His skating is still average to below average, but his hockey smarts are top notch. He's a bottom 6 centerman in my book.

The rest of the guys, we just don't really know about, but they have and are continuing to progress for the most part. Roy, Kuokkanen, and Saarela are "the next men up" on the depth chart. While Roy's skating is "a work in progress" he's definitely improved each year. He's a strong defender and has very, very good hands. Kuokkanen is a natural playmaker and Saarela is a natural sniper, but both have been effective in the middle and I think both will get a chance to make the NHL there (with Saarela maybe having a better shot at the wing). While primarily playing RW now, Stelio Mattheos played in the middle when Nolan Patrick was injured a couple of years ago...and he acquitted himself well. Morgan Geekie is a natural center and is a dark horse guy to have a much bigger role in Charlotte than many may consider. Luostarinen has a lot more to show and we just don't really know about Drury (who I thought was an awkward skater but not really slow) and Henman. Maenalanen played mostly on the wing, so I don't see him in the center discussion.

 

[Vagrant]

I haven't seen Drury other than prospect camp. But he doesn't seem to have top 6 upside either. The Draft Analyst said this in grading the Canes' 2018 draft:
Speed must not be that important to the Canes, because after taking elite sniper Andrei Svechnikov (second), they grabbed with their next two picks a pair of marginal skaters in centers Jack Drury (42nd) and Luke Henman (96th). Both have strengths in terms of puck possession and playmaking, but the speed just isn’t there.

I understand this is just one opinion. Still, skating has become the first criterium for considering prospects. At least that is what many of you have stated about the likes of Roy and even Zykov. My guess is that the praise for Drury is a bias toward U.S. players. Because it appears that Drury doesn't skate as well as Luostarinen or Saarela. Apparently only a little better than Roy, who has significantly more reach and is better at face-offs.

Maybe it is recency effect that is having others high on Drury. I don't see him as having any specific skill that would immediately raise him to the top of the Canes' prospect list for centers. Especially at his size--basically the same as Aho, whom many have been concerned is not big/strong enough to play center in the NHL.

the primary thing that saw drury taken where he was taken was the bloodlines combined with the upward trajectory in his development. waterloo is a powerhouse program in the ushl and tons of recent nhl players have gone through that system. to go from 4 goals in 52 games with 12 total points to emerging as better than a point per game the next year is fairly uncommon for a league as tough as the ushl has become. scouts love players that show dramatic improvement from one year to the next, because it's possible another jump is coming. it usually represents good off ice habits and a player that is amenable to coaching.

overall, i don't disagree with your point. there's nothing making him fundamentally different from a lot of our other prospects except name recognition value. he's a legit prospect on his own merit, but the similarity in size and production leading to natural comparisons to his uncle certainly bolster his case.

 

[DaveG]

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