Speculation: HOW will/should DRW resolve roster squeeze? (3 goalies, Ed, danielsson)

[Detroit Knights]

Play the worse player now so you have a better player to call up later is such a weird stance. If the reserves are better than your starting roster you're doing it wrong.

I think it's more of, Don't trade or waive a pretty good player for a prospect that shows greater because when injuries inevitably occur, we have a very good player to step up in its place.

Someone made the connection before that just makes sense. Instead of calling up McIssac, we can call up Edvinsson.

We should all keep in mind and many others have said this before, Ed just had surgery and is still recovering. There is a great possibility that he is around 80-90% healthy from it. I'd much rather him get to 100%+ for the possibility of a great 10-15 year career than getting him at possibly 80%, getting injured in the same shoulder because it still hasn't healed, and him getting derailed with injuries for the foreseeable future. One injury in isolation isn't that bad, but when they start getting stringed along with more, the body becomes much more fragile. See Fabbri as an extreme example.

Will Yzerman have a press conference before the season starts?

Even if he does we already know what he is going to say...

Just once, I'd like to be surprised and he just comes out and says things without beating around the bush. I get why he doesn't but still.

Like come on Stevie, just put the dam hockeytown stamp on center ice already...why has no reporter asked him this god dam question yet??

 

[norrisnick]

I think it's more of, Don't trade or waive a pretty good player for a prospect that shows greater because when injuries inevitably occur, we have a very good player to step up in its place.

Someone made the connection before that just makes sense. Instead of calling up McIssac, we can call up Edvinsson.

We should all keep in mind and many others have said this before, Ed just had surgery and is still recovering. There is a great possibility that he is around 80-90% healthy from it. I'd much rather him get to 100%+ for the possibility of a great 10-15 year career than getting him at possibly 80%, getting injured in the same shoulder because it still hasn't healed, and him getting derailed with injuries for the foreseeable future. One injury in isolation isn't that bad, but when they start getting stringed along with more, the body becomes much more fragile. See Fabbri as an extreme example.


Even if he does we already know what he is going to say...

Just once, I'd like to be surprised and he just comes out and says things without beating around the bush. I get why he doesn't but still.

Like come on Stevie, just put the dam hockeytown stamp on center ice already...why has no reporter asked him this god dam question yet??

Ed is not the only D we can stash in GR. He's just the only one waiver exempt. We have guys that would clear, so you wouldn't be losing any depth.

It's functionally no different than keeping Czarnik and shipping down Ray. So that when injuries hit we can call up Ray rather than calling up someone like Czarnik! Isn't that much better?!? Ignoring the fact that someone like Czarnik was already up to necessitate sending Ray down.

If Ed isn't 100% the staff that cleared him should be fired. He's good to go, or not. Health should never be a factor for a roster decision. Because the only options should be active, scratch, or IR. The AHL doesn't magically not have injuries.

 

[RedWingzz]

My favorite new narrative is that Yzerman is soft. He's keeping vets up because he doesn't want to hurt feelings. He can't make the tough roster decisions.

If you look at his handling of players all the way back to the Martin St. Louis situation, he hasn't exactly had a problem making tough calls.

I wouldn't call him soft, but i would definitely call him stubborn. He's not worried about hurting Chiarot's feelings by waiving him, but if he waives him, he's admitting he made a mistake by signing him to that contract to begin with.

We're spending over 15 million dollars on depth defencemen (Chiarot, Maatta, Holl, Ghost). Toss in Copp, and that's 20+ million dished out in the last 2 free agencies on depth players.

Will Yzerman have a press conference before the season starts?

he should, but he will probably go hide like he always does

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

I wouldn't call him soft, but i would definitely call him stubborn. He's not worried about hurting Chiarot's feelings by waiving him, but if he waives him, he's admitting he made a mistake by signing him to that contract to begin with.

We're spending over 15 million dollars on depth defencemen (Chiarot, Maatta, Holl, Ghost). Toss in Copp, and that's 20+ million dished out in the last 2 free agencies on depth players.


he should, but he will probably go hide like he always does

You realize this is a narrative that is entirely your invention, right?

 

[RedWingzz]

I think it's more of, Don't trade or waive a pretty good player for a prospect that shows greater because when injuries inevitably occur, we have a very good player to step up in its place.

Someone made the connection before that just makes sense. Instead of calling up McIssac, we can call up Edvinsson.

We should all keep in mind and many others have said this before, Ed just had surgery and is still recovering. There is a great possibility that he is around 80-90% healthy from it. I'd much rather him get to 100%+ for the possibility of a great 10-15 year career than getting him at possibly 80%, getting injured in the same shoulder because it still hasn't healed, and him getting derailed with injuries for the foreseeable future. One injury in isolation isn't that bad, but when they start getting stringed along with more, the body becomes much more fragile. See Fabbri as an extreme example.


Even if he does we already know what he is going to say...

Just once, I'd like to be surprised and he just comes out and says things without beating around the bush. I get why he doesn't but still.

Like come on Stevie, just put the dam hockeytown stamp on center ice already...why has no reporter asked him this god dam question yet??

i wasn't aware that injuries don't happen in the AHL.

You realize this is a narrative that is entirely your invention, right?

If you're confused by that post, I don't know what to tell you. Nevermind I guess, it really wasn't that hard to understand.

 

[ricky0034]

i wasn't aware that injuries don't happen in the AHL.


If you're confused by that post, I don't know what to tell you. Nevermind I guess, it really wasn't that hard to understand.

I don't have any data i'm going off of here but I wouldn't be surprised if there were more injuries in the AHL than the NHL

it's a much more physical league nowadays than the NHL is

 

[19 for president]

Veleno played very well this preseason an absolutely won a spot. Fischer is the questionable guy.

Berggy did not win a top 9 spot and he isn't going to be in the NHL long as a 4th liner if that is all he can muster. He does need consistency and can work on that in GR. He should be our top 9 callup.

Ed from a preseason standpoint should be on the team. He played better than Holl, Ghost, and Chia. With that said I think the Petry deal surprised Yzerman and now he is hoping one of these guys plays well enough to get traded. Other teams can't get good looks if they aren't playing. Also Ed can continue to work on his defensive game in the AHL. He still made a lot of rookie mistakes in the preseason.

Soder was a dissapointment. He still needs another year I think before we can hope for an NHLer. He plays way too passive of a game. I'm not looking for Chris Pronger or Bert physicality but he needs to learn more than weak stick checks. Doesn't work in the NHL.

Kasper needs some time to adjust to NA ice and also get back from injury. I give him until Nov in the AHL before I expect to see numbers.

Ammo needs to develop physically. The hockey sense and hands are there but he looked super small out there. He's probably 2 years out.

Danielson looked fantastic and I want to see him dominate juniors. Big year ahead of him but I think he really pushes for a spot next year. With the early bday I think he is AHL eligible which makes it easier to keep him here. I think the whole Ras situation has made them leary to keep juniors.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

i wasn't aware that injuries don't happen in the AHL.


If you're confused by that post, I don't know what to tell you. Nevermind I guess, it really wasn't that hard to understand.

I'm not confused by it at all. I'm merely pointing out that it is your fabrication that Yzerman refuses to waive Chiarot out of stubborness because it would be admitting he made a mistake. It's a storyline you've invented.

 

[GMR]

Poor Edvinsson.

Kid comes to America hoping to play in the NHL and bang hot chicks. Instead, he gets sent to Grand Rapids, Michigan, to fill the shoes of Brian Lashoff and play with a bunch of jobbers.

 

[RedWingzz]

I don't have any data i'm going off of here but I wouldn't be surprised if there were more injuries in the AHL than the NHL

it's a much more physical league nowadays than the NHL is

You're probably right, but people here actually believe Edvinsson was sent down to protect him from injury.

It's so blatantly obvious why he was sent down. Yzerman is protecting every asset that he can, and Ed doesn't need waivers. The old "tie goes to the vet" except in this case, the rookie blew the vets out of the water.

The correct move would have been to waive Chiarot. The asset would still have been "protected", because nobody is going near that horrible contract. Last year, everyone on this board was hating on Chiarot based on his play with Seider in the first half. Now it's a new year, and people seem to have forgotten how bad he is.

 

[Detroit Knights]

Ed is not the only D we can stash in GR. He's just the only one waiver exempt. We have guys that would clear, so you wouldn't be losing any depth.

It's functionally no different than keeping Czarnik and shipping down Ray. So that when injuries hit we can call up Ray rather than calling up someone like Czarnik! Isn't that much better?!? Ignoring the fact that someone like Czarnik was already up to necessitate sending Ray down.

If Ed isn't 100% the staff that cleared him should be fired. He's good to go, or not. Health should never be a factor for a roster decision. Because the only options should be active, scratch, or IR. The AHL doesn't magically not have injuries.

yikes.

I know you are well aware that czarnik is not raymond. That would be like comparing luff and debrincat. Let's settle down on that one because you are obviously over-exaggerating to register a point but it doesn't work.

Ed has 9 games NHL experience. He is obviously the future. But he did not definitively outplay holl (his d partner this preseason yes?) or Petry. Petry actually was quite a welcoming surprise in how he played. Chiarot wasn't terrible and as a cap management move if kept, we would have what 4 mil in dead cap space in ahl and would then make him untradeable i'd imagine. Someone else also said that they believed management likes chiarot and what he brings, so there's that (I tend to agree). I wasn't happy with Ghost, so I guess we could have an understanding there.

lastly, guys play injured all the time. so your last paragraph makes zero sense and is lacking actual reality. You can be cleared for contact after having a great rehab, but no one will know how the rehab worked/didn't work unless you test it out. You could also take a slap shot to the hip and play through a deep bone bruise (those actually hurt quite a bit) but that doesn't make you 100%. Maybe ed told them that he doesn't feel 100% or didn't seem confident when he said he was doing fine?

The ahl obviously has injuries (see i can understand sarcasm vs trolling, crazy!); however, I would argue NHL has significantly better players and faster rate of play than the AHL...so i guess you are more prone to injuries in the nhl than ahl, especially if you are coming off of a surgery. Who woulda thunk it, eh?

 

[RedWingzz]

I'm not confused by it at all. I'm merely pointing out that it is your fabrication that Yzerman refuses to waive Chiarot out of stubborness because it would be admitting he made a mistake. It's a storyline you've invented.

But when a GM waives a player, it means they don't want him on the roster anymore, thus would mean they made a mistake signing him in the first place.

Tell me this, you truly believe today, October 9th 2023, Yzerman is still happy with that contract?

Poor Edvinsson.

Kid comes to America hoping to play in the NHL and bang hot chicks. Instead, he gets sent to Grand Rapids, Michigan, to fill the shoes of Brian Lashoff and play with a bunch of jobbers.

Yeah, if this was the plan, he may as well of stayed in Sweden and developed in the SHL.

 

[Detroit Knights]

Danielson looked fantastic and I want to see him dominate juniors. Big year ahead of him but I think he really pushes for a spot next year. With the early bday I think he is AHL eligible which makes it easier to keep him here. I think the whole Ras situation has made them leary to keep juniors.

What do you mean by early bday making him AHL eligible?

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

But when a GM waives a player, it means they don't want him on the roster anymore, thus would mean they made a mistake signing him in the first place.

Tell me this, you truly believe today, October 9th 2023, Yzerman is still happy with that contract?

For starters, your first statement is not correct. It's entirely possible that when a GM first signed a player they actually made sense for the team at that time, but as circumstances changed (be it with the team or the player) waiving that player is now the best move. That doesn't necessarily mean the initial signing was a mistake. To be clear I'm not even specifically referring to Chiarot here, just pointing out your faulty logic.

I have no idea what Yzerman's emotional state is. Even if he's incredibly unhappy with the contract right at this moment, that does not necessarily make waiving Chiarot the best move to help build a Cup-competitive team.

 

[RedWingzz]

For starters, your first statement is not correct. It's entirely possible that when a GM first signed a player they actually made sense for the team at that time, but as circumstances changed (be it with the team or the player) waiving that player is now the best move. That doesn't necessarily mean the initial signing was a mistake. To be clear I'm not even specifically referring to Chiarot here, just pointing out your faulty logic.

I have no idea what Yzerman's emotional state is. Even if he's incredibly unhappy with the contract right at this moment, that does not necessarily make waiving Chiarot the best move to help build a Cup-competitive team.

Chiarot was signed last offseason, let's not pretend this was a contract signed years ago, that started off well, and eventually soured. That contract looked awful the day it was signed, and looks even worse now.

And, with Edvinsson in GR, we are icing an inferior team to start the year. If we want to be a Cup competitive team, shouldn't the best players be playing in the NHL and not in the AHL?

 

[GMR]

Cujo rode the bus in the AHL in 2004 as the world's highest paid goalie.

Compared to that, sending Chiarot to the AHL would not make waves.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Except with Edvinsson in GR, we are icing an inferior team to start the year. If we want to be a Cup competitive team, shouldn't the best players be playing in the NHL and not in the AHL?

To be clear, you believe based on 5 preseason games that with Edvinsson in GR, they are icing an inferior team. It's entirely possible Yzerman and company don't feel that way.

And as I've said earlier in the thread and Yzerman has said in his press conferences, he ultimately wants to build a team that can compete for the Cup for multiple years. So there may be situations where the long term development of players takes priority over icing the absolute best team for the opening game.

 

[GMR]

To be clear, you believe based on 5 preseason games that with Edvinsson in GR, they are icing an inferior team. It's entirely possible Yzerman and company don't feel that way.

And as I've said earlier in the thread and Yzerman has said in his press conferences, he ultimately wants to build a team that can compete for the Cup for multiple years. So there may be situations where the long term development of players takes priority over icing the absolute best team for the opening game.

Yzerman is rumored to be a pothead. So it's possible his decision making is altered at times.

 

[stillwater]

Will Yzerman have a press conference before the season starts?

Why, to explain all the phycological warfare?

 

[jkutswings]

the rookie blew the vets out of the water

Part of the debate revolves around this phrase.

Some fans see a kid flying up the ice, adding an element that the veterans lack. Others see a talented kid that is still making plenty of defensive mistakes and may need more time to round out his game.

Do I think Edvinsson played well enough to stick in Detroit? Yes. But not well enough that he, "blew the vets out of the water" or that I'm offended he could have to wait a bit longer.

 

[Detroit Knights]

Yzerman is rumored to be a pothead. So it's possible his decision making is altered at times.

I believe he smokes weed rather than taking in prescriptions because of his knee.

Could be wrong, but I am pretty confident in it.

 

[ricky0034]

To be clear, you believe based on 5 preseason games that with Edvinsson in GR, they are icing an inferior team. It's entirely possible Yzerman and company don't feel that way.

And as I've said earlier in the thread and Yzerman has said in his press conferences, he ultimately wants to build a team that can compete for the Cup for multiple years. So there may be situations where the long term development of players takes priority over icing the absolute best team for the opening game.

you could say that about literally anything up to and including something like trading Seider to the Devils to get Brendan Smith back

 

[Detroit Knights]

But when a GM waives a player, it means they don't want him on the roster anymore, thus would mean they made a mistake signing him in the first place.

Tell me this, you truly believe today, October 9th 2023, Yzerman is still happy with that contract?


Yeah, if this was the plan, he may as well of stayed in Sweden and developed in the SHL.

AHL > SHL

 

[Detroit Knights]

you could say that about literally anything up to and including something like trading Seider to the Devils to get Brendan Smith back

sometimes opinions are just wrong

People need to stop making stupid comparisons that are just ridiculous. No, it does not match what you feel is ridiculous in the statement you are replying too.

Seider being traded for Smith is no where near the same as Ed, a 9 game NHL career thus far coming off his first major injury and not glaringly obviously beating out a recently signed D, being sent to ahl over waiving Holl/ghost/chiarot.

They are all much closer in terms of level than seider and smith, so just stop.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Yzerman is rumored to be a pothead. So it's possible his decision making is altered at times.

Lalonde and Stevie making final roster decisions: