HF Retro Game of the Year - 1996 - Super Mario 64

[Frankie Blueberries]

I think the indie surge brought a lot of gamers back.

Somehow, after all this time, big gaming companies are constantly shocked that people like variety.

It's funny because it's true. My least favourite era of gaming was the gritty grey shooter era. I'm talking Gears of War, Killzone 2, etc. when all games seemed to have that grey filter over everything and most of the games lacked any vibrant colour to them.

 

[Commander Clueless]

It's funny because it's true. My least favourite era of gaming was the gritty grey shooter era. I'm talking Gears of War, Killzone 2, etc. when all games seemed to have that grey filter over everything and most of the games lacked any vibrant colour to them.

It's annoying because we're always seeing the industry flock after the latest trend and then wonder why they can't make any money in a saturated market. Or even worse, try to cram beloved IPs into a crowded space and then shut them down when it (shockingly) doesn't work.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

It's annoying because we're always seeing the industry flock after the latest trend and then wonder why they can't make any money in a saturated market. Or even worse, try to cram beloved IPs into a crowded space and then shut them down when it (shockingly) doesn't work.

Yeah, definitely. Hopefully the Battle Royale genre begins to die soon.

On the other hand, I really like the model where developers charge for cosmetics but release free DLC, where you don't need to pay for any updates to the game and only skins/cosmetics cost money, so it doesn't interfere with any of the gameplay or enjoyment of the game. DOTA 2 and TF2 were the first games that I noticed that did this, but Overwatch has been great at it as well. It's the best model for the current climate of gaming IMO, I much prefer it over the constant DLC/season pass crap that EA and Activision employ.

 

[Shareefruck]

A lot of those games are why I always shake my head when people say gaming isn't what it used to be. It's never been better in terms of options available and even in terms of prices with the Steam sales, GOG and the list goes on.

The golden age of 1997-2007 was an age of discovery and boundaries getting pushed so it's a very different environment from now due to the big studios who are very risk averse with their big projects, but it just takes a little peek beyond the AAA stuff to see things are as good as they have ever been.

Get ready to shake your head, then, because I still think that gaming isn't what it used to be, personally.

There's more baseline polish, quality of life convenience, variety, and quantity of enjoyable or "good" games, but there aren't games released every year that feel as inspired and fully realized as things like Super Mario World, A Link to the Past, and Super Metroid, which was more of a regular occurrence in the 90s (the only game on that list that I feel THAT strongly about is maybe Inside). The peak is lower, IMO, and frankly, the peak is what I care to judge things by-- I blame it on the divide between Indie and AAA mentalities saturating/putting a bit of an artistic ceiling on what's out there. It's similar to what's happened to music in these last few decades, IMO (although I think that's a lot worse).

I also just outright dislike the look of the typical videogame these days, often feeling more like a product/example of technology than a personal inspired work/labor of love, even when the work put into it may say otherwise.

I think the 90s were the golden age and 2000-2010 was kind of a wasteland for me. I can only count a handful of games from that era that really got through to me, like Shadow of the Colossus, the Portal series, Ikaruga, and Metroid Prime. There were so many FPS shooters/action games or addictive online games that I didn't give a rat's *** about.

Personally, I'm hoping that the next step is that the success of indie titles cause some of that inspiration/mentality to merge with big budget AAA developers, and then we can get to something that's never been better.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

There's more baseline polish, quality of life convenience, variety, and quantity of enjoyable or "good" games, but there aren't games released every year that are as inspired as things like Super Mario World, A Link to the Past, and Super Metroid, which was more of a regular occurrence in the 90s (the only game on that list that I feel THAT strongly about is maybe Inside). The peak is lower, IMO, and frankly, the peak is what I care to judge things by-- I blame it on the divide between Indie and AAA mentalities saturating/putting a bit of an artistic ceiling on what's out there. It's similar to what's happened to music in these last few decades, IMO (although I think that's worse).

I don't know if I agree that there aren't games comparable to Mario World or A Link to the Past released nowadays: Mario Odyssey and Breath of the Wild are right there with them I'd argue. I will always feel more connected to the peaks of the 90's, I was a kid/teenager so everything was new and shiny and the industry was essentially growing by leaps and bounds so it was an exciting time for the medium, so how much of those feelings is due to the nostalgia goggle effect?

I want indies and AAA to stay well apart. AAA games tend to have a mould they follow (due to how expensive they are to make, the studio needs something they are sure will sell lots) while indies are for the hardcore gamers, people who really prioritize gameplay. Nintendo is similar: Nintendo tends to be for the hardcore gamers because they always, always put gameplay first.

 

[Shareefruck]

I don't know if I agree that there aren't games comparable to Mario World or A Link to the Past released nowadays: Mario Odyssey and Breath of the Wild are right there with them I'd argue. I will always feel more connected to the peaks of the 90's, I was a kid/teenager so everything was new and shiny and the industry was essentially growing by leaps and bounds so it was an exciting time for the medium, so how much of those feelings is due to the nostalgia goggle effect?

I want indies and AAA to stay well apart. AAA games tend to have a mould they follow (due to how expensive they are to make, the studio needs something they are sure will sell lots) while indies are for the hardcore gamers, people who really prioritize gameplay. Nintendo is similar: Nintendo tends to be for the hardcore gamers because they always, always put gameplay first.

I despise the idea of nostalgia, personally. I grew up with Mario and Street Fighter, but I didn't grow up with Super Metroid and didn't like Zelda as a kid. Most games and things in general that I did grow up with, I don't think have held up well at all (if anything, I have a habit of unfairly turning on things that I grew up with rather than look back on them fondly), and many of the old games I like most, I was first exposed to in the last ten years as an adult (I didn't try/click with Earthbound until one or two years ago, and it's my second favorite game of all time). I just genuinely think those peak games from that era are better than what we tend to get now, personally (at least in terms of what I appreciate/value). I grew up in the 90s-2000s, but those eras are generally my least favorite for movies/music as well. Also, my least favorite era of videogames was when I was at an age that was most suitable for playing videogames (I was twelve years old in 2000). In addition to that, some of the old games that I put on a pedestal (like the NES version of Super Mario Bros. 3, which I prefer the look of over the All Stars version, or Megaman 2, which I think is better than any Megaman besides X) were before my time. It's not a nostalgia thing.

If there's a bias, it has more to do with aesthetic bias rather than nostalgic bias-- loving the way that a game looks and sounds is a big factor for me (I generally won't forgive a game that underwhelms me on those terms even if it has great gameplay). I generally don't love the way that 3D looks, except in rare cases and I don't like how soundtracks in videogames have become less melodic. So that probably has a lot to do with it.

I didn't love Breath of the Wild or Super Mario Odyssey nearly as much as others did (especially the latter). They're solid, but they don't charm, inspire, or wow me, and there's a reason I mentioned those indie games instead of them.

I like the stubborn/eccentric mentality that modern Nintendo has more than the other big name developers, and I think they're very good at making things control well but they were also responsible for the N64 and the WII, which I found very anti-putting-gameplay-first. In fact, those are two of the biggest reasons I stopped playing videogames.

 

[Shareefruck]

Did you ever give Braid or Shadow Complex a shot?

I played Braid but not Shadow Complex. I thought it was interesting and clever, but kind of heavy-handed.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

I played Braid but not Shadow Complex. I thought it was interesting and clever, but kind of heavy-handed.

You might like Shadow Complex. The art style/2.5D approach might not be up your alley, but it's one of the best Metroid-style games I've played.

 

[Shareefruck]

You might like Shadow Complex. The art style/2.5D approach might not be up your alley, but it's one of the best Metroid-style games I've played.

I think you've recommended it before, right? I'll keep it in mind.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

I think you've recommended it before, right? I'll keep it in mind.

Yeah, I think so. I have not played it since it was released, but given the genre and mechanics, I think it should hold up.

 

[Shareefruck]

Yeah, I think so. I have not played it since it was released, but given the genre and mechanics, I think it should hold up.

I can promise I'll look it up, watch videos, and read reviews to see if I'm interested, but I can't promise I'll give it a shot.

 

[Commander Clueless]

What about Ori and the Blind Forest, though?


I liked that one.

 

[TheDoldrums]

I think the 90s were the golden age and 2000-2010 was kind of a wasteland for me. I can only count a handful of games from that era that really got through to me, like Shadow of the Colossus, the Portal series, Ikaruga, and Metroid Prime. There were so many FPS shooters/action games or addictive online games that I didn't give a rat's *** about.

I consider MGS3, Resident Evil 4, Fallout: New Vegas and REmake to be among the finest games ever made. They would all rank in my top 10.

 

[RandV]

I don't know if I agree that there aren't games comparable to Mario World or A Link to the Past released nowadays: Mario Odyssey and Breath of the Wild are right there with them I'd argue. I will always feel more connected to the peaks of the 90's, I was a kid/teenager so everything was new and shiny and the industry was essentially growing by leaps and bounds so it was an exciting time for the medium, so how much of those feelings is due to the nostalgia goggle effect?

I want indies and AAA to stay well apart. AAA games tend to have a mould they follow (due to how expensive they are to make, the studio needs something they are sure will sell lots) while indies are for the hardcore gamers, people who really prioritize gameplay. Nintendo is similar: Nintendo tends to be for the hardcore gamers because they always, always put gameplay first.

The problem is the lack of a middle ground. The majority of developers from back then got sucked up by a handful of big publishers, who all push the same market chasing mass-appeal blockbuster games. Indies have been great but they usually don't have anything resembling a budget so they're mostly making retro-games which are much cheaper to develop. There just isn't enough developers out there with actual budgets that are allowed to make games targetted to selling in the 1-3 million copy range.

 

[TheDoldrums]

The problem is the lack of a middle ground. The majority of developers from back then got sucked up by a handful of big publishers, who all push the same market chasing mass-appeal blockbuster games. Indies have been great but they usually don't have anything resembling a budget so they're mostly making retro-games which are much cheaper to develop. There just isn't enough developers out there with actual budgets that are allowed to make games targetted to selling in the 1-3 million copy range. There just isn't enough developers out there with actual budgets that are allowed to make games targetted to selling in the 1-3 million copy range.

This is another reason why I disagreed with the good fellow who said 2000-2010 was a wasteland. I thought it was a very fertile period, particularly the first half of that decade. Because at that time publishers were still willing to give decent budgets to somewhat niche games that never really had a big chance of mainstream success. Things like Psychonauts, Silent Hill, Beyond Good and Evil. The PS2 lineup felt legitimately quirky at times and it wasn't indie stuff.

This doesn't really fit into that category, but I always think of the balls it took to make MGS2. I can't imagine it being released today with the same strategy. Absolutely massive budget and Kojima basically gave a middle finger to all fan expectations and completely kept the true nature of the game hidden in all the previews. It sold huge but it was such a risk. But it felt like there were more risks taken in those days.

Like you said, it feels like the middle ground has somewhat eroded. If you have a decent budget, you're somewhat forced to try and make it inviting for a wider audience. So many of today's AAA games feel similar because they borrow the elements that have been known to sell. Last year I just got so burnt out on open world games with light RPG elements. I really wanted to like Horizon Zero Dawn and it probably does the formula well, but it was just too similar to the stuff I had been playing.

 

[MetalheadPenguinsFan]

1995 options??

 

[Shareefruck]

I consider MGS3, Resident Evil 4, Fallout: New Vegas and REmake to be among the finest games ever made. They would all rank in my top 10.

This is another reason why I disagreed with the good fellow who said 2000-2010 was a wasteland. I thought it was a very fertile period, particularly the first half of that decade. Because at that time publishers were still willing to give decent budgets to somewhat niche games that never really had a big chance of mainstream success. Things like Psychonauts, Silent Hill, Beyond Good and Evil. The PS2 lineup felt legitimately quirky at times and it wasn't indie stuff.

A big part of why it's a wasteland for me (I get that I'm in the minority here) is that I fundamentally dislike how most of these games look, sound, and feel (not to mention the way that they're written/voice acted)-- that's a huge deal to me-- and so even the stuff from that period that could be quirky, innovative, and interesting in terms of mechanics (usually not even that) can end up feeling like the videogame equivalent of a campy B-movie to me (which I am not receptive to). I feel that way about most of the Resident Evil, Silent Hill, and Metal Gear Solid type stuff that was popular from that era.

Really, just none of it interests me.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

I consider MGS3, Resident Evil 4, Fallout: New Vegas and REmake to be among the finest games ever made. They would all rank in my top 10.

+1 for MGS3 and RE4.
I'd also throw in Half-Life 2, Ninja Gaiden Black, KOTOR, Rock Band, Burnout 3, L4D2, TF2, Halo: CE, Diablo 2, and Advance Wars. Surprisingly, I think Burnout 3 is the best of the bunch. L4D2 has a strong case as well; nothing beats versus mode on Dark Carnival.

 

[PilotRedSun]

I lost interest in gaming roughly around 1994 - I loved the NES and early Genesis but never cared for the SNES- but Super Mario 64 was interesting. It sometimes felt more like a tech demo than a game. Some of the levels, like the one with Bowser's sub, are bizarrely empty and under designed. It's a strange game and surprisingly wasn't all that similar to Super Mario Bros. I'm not sure if I actually like it overall but at least it's not what I expected.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

What about Ori and the Blind Forest, though?


I liked that one.

Fantastic Metroidvania, easily one of the best I have played and the sequel looks like it's going to be glorious.

 

[Commander Clueless]

Fantastic Metroidvania, easily one of the best I have played and the sequel looks like it's going to be glorious.

I agree.

If you like Metroidvania and art direction, Ori is top notch IMO. The soundtrack is great too.

The narrative is minimalist but compelling.


I'd say it's one of the better indie style games I've played in recent memory.

 

[Tasty Biscuits]

It's pretty cool how CC's OST used a lot of acoustic guitars, we don't get a lot of that in games these days (although more so in indie titles)

Big fan of the CC soundtrack. Got it on 3-disc way back in the day, and it's still on my iPod (yep -- I am, as the kids these days say, a "grandpa")

 

[TheDoldrums]

Big fan of the CC soundtrack. Got it on 3-disc way back in the day, and it's still on my iPod (yep -- I am, as the kids these days say, a "grandpa")

Mitsuda is my favourite VG composer. He did Xenogears and Chrono Cross in consecutive years and they're two of the best ever in my estimation.

He still hasn't lost his touch either, Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is another absurdly great soundtrack.

 

[member 157595]

I lost interest in gaming roughly around 1994 - I loved the NES and early Genesis but never cared for the SNES- but Super Mario 64 was interesting. It sometimes felt more like a tech demo than a game. Some of the levels, like the one with Bowser's sub, are bizarrely empty and under designed. It's a strange game and surprisingly wasn't all that similar to Super Mario Bros. I'm not sure if I actually like it overall but at least it's not what I expected.

That's interesting. Personally, I consider the SNES to be the greatest video game console of all time, and that the Genesis is extremely underrated since it faced off against such an industry titan.

I like SM64, but I definitely don't think it belongs in the same category with SMW or SMB3.

 

[PilotRedSun]

I gravitated towards the Genesis because it promised something radically new. I wasn't as interested in NES But This Time It's Super.