Has Shanny made his first mistake?

[member 300185]

Shanny didnt allow Hunter to sign with another team until after the July 1st deadline. (Or Dubas, whoever),

Should Shanny have done the same thing with Lou Lam? He is a cagey GM with a ton of experience and a true salesman who can handle each and every objection.

Lou had his hands slapped for Tampering before in the Kovalchuk deal.

1- Should Lou have been given the rule that he can only sign with a team after July 1st or hell, July 15 instead of being able to go to the Islanders, where he is having very positive talks with JT?

2- Is what Lou doing considered tampering? He went from a team that wants JT, to a team that already has JT and JT was getting ready to walk. Is it possible there are some things in the Leafs front office that Lou took advantage of in talking with JT?

It seems to me all this would have gone smoother had Shanny refused Lou to sign with the Islanders. He was under contract for the Leafs for the next 3 years. Shanny could have controlled where he would end up.

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[phillipmike]

Might not be shannys fault. Ownership let Lou talk to the Isles without Shanny knowing.

 

[Pookie]

I believe Lou’s contract was up when the Leafs season ended. I don’t think there is anything Shanahan could do to force a July 1st date.

Hunter on the other hand was under contract so dollars could be leveraged to negotiate an end date.

 

[member 300185]

I believe Lou’s contract was up when the Leafs season ended. I don’t think there is anything Shanahan could do to force a July 1st date.

Hunter on the other hand was under contract so dollars could be leveraged to negotiate an end date.

I'm pretty sure that there was a 3 year contract for Lou to work in an advisory role. Maybe there was a loophole to get out of it.

 

[Menzinger]

Without knowing the details of the contract we can’t really comment on what shanahan could or couldn’t have done.

Probably wouldn’t worry too much anyways, I suspect from what we’ve heard so far Dubas’ Off-season plans including the draft seem likely different from what the team would’ve done under Hunter, or if Lou had stayed

 

[Gallagbi]

Shanny didnt allow Hunter to sign with another team until after the July 1st deadline. (Or Dubas, whoever),

Should Shanny have done the same thing with Lou Lam? He is a cagey GM with a ton of experience and a true salesman who can handle each and every objection.

Lou had his hands slapped for Tampering before in the Kovalchuk deal.

1- Should Lou have been given the rule that he can only sign with a team after July 1st or hell, July 15 instead of being able to go to the Islanders, where he is having very positive talks with JT?

2- Is what Lou doing considered tampering? He went from a team that wants JT, to a team that already has JT and JT was getting ready to walk. Is it possible there are some things in the Leafs front office that Lou took advantage of in talking with JT?

It seems to me all this would have gone smoother had Shanny refused Lou to sign with the Islanders. He was under contract for the Leafs for the next 3 years. Shanny could have controlled where he would end up.

If Lou is a "cagey" GM, does it even matter?

 

[ShaneFalco]

I doubt Lou is the difference-maker in JT's decision

 

[LeafsNation75]

I believe Lou’s contract was up when the Leafs season ended. I don’t think there is anything Shanahan could do to force a July 1st date.

Hunter on the other hand was under contract so dollars could be leveraged to negotiate an end date.

Shanahan had said once Lou's contract finished as the GM it would change to him being a Senior Advisor for another 4 years. However I would assume he had some out clause if he was to become a President and General Manager of another team if he was given the chance and we all know that's what happened.

 

[93LEAFS]

It would be unethical by NHL conduct to block someone from getting a clear GM job once you have demoted them from such. I'm sure Hunter had an out for that as well, but due to the fact, there were none left when he resigned it made no sense.

There is basic acceptable conduct by teams. If you start blocking GM and Coaching candidates from leaving pre-draft, the rest of the league will hate you, and treat you terribly if you are ever in that situation. It is then generally accepted the secondary position's market (AGM's, Director of Scouting) opens up in July.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Dear summer...

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

no. Lou was a fine GM, but he really isn't going to be remotely close to a deciding factor on the future of the team.

 

[LeafsNation75]

It would be unethical by NHL conduct to block someone from getting a clear GM job once you have demoted them from such. I'm sure Hunter had an out for that as well, but due to the fact, there were none left when he resigned it made no sense.

There basic acceptable conduct by teams. If you start blocking GM and Coaching candidates from leaving pre-draft, the rest of the league will hate you, and treat you terribly if you are ever in that situation. It is then generally accepted the secondary position's market (AGM's, Director of Scouting) opens up in July.

Don't forget when Rick Dudley left the Leafs front office while he was the Director of Player Personnel to become the Canadiens Assistant General Manager in 2012, Montreal agreed to not have Dudley at their draft table or take part in any draft discussion before it happened. Remember since he was hired by Montreal on May 25, 2012 it was less than a month from the 2012 draft. So when the Leafs prevented Mark Hunter being hired by any team until July 15, 2018 there is precedent for them doing something like that.

 

[Al14]

Shanahan make a mistake? What is this nonsense?

 

[Mugzy97]

JT is going to sign where he wants to sign. Lou isn’t the deciding factor of that, JT is. Shanny isn’t stupid.

 

[hullsy47]

JT is going to sign where he wants to sign. Lou isn’t the deciding factor of that, JT is. Shanny isn’t stupid.

I agree ...steve stamkos 2 here ....if tavaras wants the leafs he ll be here ,anyone putting faith in lou lam to make the islanders a top 5 team is mistaken
hes too conservative

 

[Cor]

Lou was going elsewhere for a promotion. Hunter most likely won’t be.

I assume that may play into it

 

[Walshy7]

no he didnt. if lou wanted to go he'd go, and he did. There is no doubt he had a clause that if another GM job came up he could go freely, after his leafs GM role had been reduced.

/thread

 

[Buds17]

Lou joined and left the Leafs because of a bigger role than he had previously. Lamoriello could be a factor in determining where Tavares signs his next contract, but there should be other, greater considerations as well. If both Tavares and the Leafs want a deal to happen badly enough, it will.

 

[nuck]

Shanny didnt allow Hunter to sign with another team until after the July 1st deadline. (Or Dubas, whoever),

Should Shanny have done the same thing with Lou Lam? He is a cagey GM with a ton of experience and a true salesman who can handle each and every objection.

Lou had his hands slapped for Tampering before in the Kovalchuk deal.

1- Should Lou have been given the rule that he can only sign with a team after July 1st or hell, July 15 instead of being able to go to the Islanders, where he is having very positive talks with JT?

2- Is what Lou doing considered tampering? He went from a team that wants JT, to a team that already has JT and JT was getting ready to walk. Is it possible there are some things in the Leafs front office that Lou took advantage of in talking with JT?

It seems to me all this would have gone smoother had Shanny refused Lou to sign with the Islanders. He was under contract for the Leafs for the next 3 years. Shanny could have controlled where he would end up.

There is a strong possibility the Leafs have no interest in Tavares from a money standpoint so nothing Lou does with JT or the Isles makes any difference. Less likely, but also possible, is that they were quite certain JT would go to UFA regardless of anything Lou said or did so the courtesy cost them nothing. The chance that Lou getting an early word in with Tavares makes him forego free agency is much less likely than the first two scenarios. If he signs anywhere but the Islanders it will be pretty clear it was only a possible error. I am more worried about Lou bringing the Leafs scouting list over in his head.

 

[shortfuze]

Shanahan had said once Lou's contract finished as the GM it would change to him being a Senior Advisor for another 4 years. However I would assume he had some out clause if he was to become a President and General Manager of another team if he was given the chance and we all know that's what happened.

I would think both the organization and Lou would probably have to agree on the advisory role(pen to paper). It was probably agreed to before he signed on as GM but once he was done as the GM they both probably had to sign the new contract and Lou didn’t. At least that’s the way I look at it.

 

[Gabriel426]

What if JT signs with the Leafs? Would Shanny becomes a genius for letting Lou go early? While if JT re-signs with the Islanders, it is Shanny mistakes, even though there were really only ever TWO top tiers UFA signs with another team.
Come on. Lou is great and all but I highly doubt he is the reason JT re-signs, now JT might say stuff like Lou is a deciding factor.....but we all know thats not the main and only reason.

 

[willmma]

It would have been much better if all the boys were patient and Lou stayed and Dubas and Hunter hung around another year. Manage the 3 contracts and the Tavares pitch

 

[Nineteen67]

I made several mistakes already today so I bet it wasn’t his first either, assuming it was mistake. ....

 

[DarkKnight]

I doubt Lou is the difference-maker in JT's decision

I think he's played a huge role, don't kid yourself.

 

[lifelonghockeyfan]

Leafs were right to block Hunter. They didn't want him to use his draft knowledge for this year helping another team. Though looking at Hunters draft record....it really isn't that good as many proclaim. The signing of European UFASs have helped the Leafs and might really help in the future. Don't know how much Hunter had an influence with those players.