GDT: Group B • Dec. 30 • Finland 10, Denmark 1

[Keeptdos]

Crappy time... Have to pass this one .

 

[Shrimper]

3-1 Denmark. Finland never shows up in these games against weaker opponent.

They beat USA though?

 

[Zamuz]

This is exactly the only way for finland to loose this game. Playing half lights, not putting the puck on the net, giving up a few and wow, there is the upset of the tournament so far.

maybe loose but not lose

 

[Mestaruus]

Mikael Granlund 3 goals 6 assists this game.

I wonder which goalie Raipe will put in goal? My guess is Gibson, but I hope Ullberg. For sure Raipe will save Aittokallio for the Czech game as it might be a game of death for Finland if we manage to lose that one.

 

[Mestaruus]

Hes main weapon is the vision and stick handling and passing... Has pretty nice shot, but hasnt use it at all in this tournament. He really probably hasnt even a shot on goal. Have had many good chances, but has decided to pass in them.


Would maybe resemble S. Koivu (Stick handling, playmaking) but hes lots of better than him. I hope he gets it going in this tournament.


We need our first line to play close to their potentional in order to have a shot in this tournament. Other teams are beatable, but if we meet Canada again the first line needs to be on fire.

Put Saku Koivu and Raipe (Raimo Helminen) in 1 and that's Granlund. However they can't shoot as well as Granlund.

 

[FinRuutu]

I'm working 4pm - 8am so stream to the game would be magnificent. If someone finds one could he/she PM it to me, thank you very many.

 

[tikkanen5rings*]

Put Saku Koivu and Raipe (Raimo Helminen) in 1 and that's Granlund. However they can't shoot as well as Granlund.

Or just take a Marc Savard, slow him down a bit, add some cojones and voilá!

 

[Juzmo]

Mikael Granlund 3 goals 6 assists this game.

I wonder which goalie Raipe will put in goal? My guess is Gibson, but I hope Ullberg. For sure Raipe will save Aittokallio for the Czech game as it might be a game of death for Finland if we manage to lose that one.

Yeah it would be nice to give it to Gibson and maybe get his confidence back if we happen to need him later.

 

[tuozzi]

"As good" sound about right to me. It remains to be seen how Granlund will eventually develope. Maybe he will be better playmaker, but I am not sold on that yet.

Koivu is a really interesting comparison. At Granlund's age he put up about 1 ppg in Finland and about 1,5 the next season, his last one before NHL. It seems Granlund will make the transition from about the same starting point, just a year younger than Koivu was. Also Koivu's TPS was dominating the early 90s, while Granlund has scored a ton this season without a lot of help...

Summa summarum: Granlund seems to have a little bit bigger upside, but you never know.

 

[master4071]

Any news about Maatta?

 

[Levi]

Finland wins 5-1. MiG is involved in 3 of the goals.

 

[IceHockeyDude]

Denmark can win 1-0 or Finland can win 10-1. It's all about how good motivation Finland has and how much Finland underestimates the danes. I hope Finland does not think about the Czech game too much.

The Stamp will propably score at least one and pass a few. Armia, Pulkkinen, Salomäki will all get points, that's my bet.

 

[Diagonaali]

It is pretty ridiculous to compare Granlund to Koivu at this stage. Young Koivu was the most dominant center team Finland has ever had and Granlund has not yet shown anything that would suggest that he will ever be at the same level as young Saku Koivu was.

Saku Koivu international statistics


Pos Year Team Tournament Ga Go As Pts
2. 1994 Finland World Champs 8 5 6 11
3. 1994 Finland Olympics 8 4 3 7
1. 1995 Finland World Champs 8 5 5 10
5. 1996 Finland World Cup 4 1 3 4
3. 1998 Finland Olympics 6 2 8 10
2. 1999 Finland World Champs 10 4 12 16

If Granlund can ever achieve something close to this, the comparison might be valid but at this stage is pretty pre-mature.

 

[Slimmy]

Koivu is a really interesting comparison. At Granlund's age he put up about 1 ppg in Finland and about 1,5 the next season, his last one before NHL. It seems Granlund will make the transition from about the same starting point, just a year younger than Koivu was. Also Koivu's TPS was dominating the early 90s, while Granlund has scored a ton this season without a lot of help...

Summa summarum: Granlund seems to have a little bit bigger upside, but you never know.

Interesting.. How did Saku fair in international tournies at this age?

 

[FinRuutu]

It is pretty ridiculous to compare Granlund to Koivu at this stage. Young Koivu was the most dominant center team Finland has ever had and Granlund has not yet shown anything that would suggest that he will ever be at the same level as young Saku Koivu was.

Wut?

 

[Diagonaali]

Wut?

Young Koivu was tough as nails for a small man, had great puck protection and a unique overall vision of the ice which made him a beast in the offensive zone. Young Koivu was pretty quick on skates, too. While Granlund is skilled, he lacks pretty much in all these areas compared to young Koivu at present and Granlund has not yet shown anything similar to the dominance Koivu did on the international ice. Therefore, the comparison between the two of them is very much immature at this stage.

 

[FinRuutu]

Young Koivu was tough as nails for a small man, had great puck protection and a unique overall vision of the ice which made him a beast in the offensive zone. Young Koivu was pretty quick on skates, too. While Granlund is skilled, he lacks pretty much in all these areas compared to young Koivu at present and Granlund has not yet shown anything similar to the dominance Koivu did on the international ice. Therefore, the comparison between the two of them is very much immature at this stage.

I agree to degree. I agree that Granlund isn't Saku Koivu yet, nor has he accomplished as much. But saying that Granlund hasn't shown anything that would suggest him to ever be as good is total garbage IMO.

Granlund was one of the best forwards, if not best in the WHC last year (9 points in 9 games, most assist of the tournament, tied with Olimb). Guy has better hockey vision and set of hands than Koivu ever had and it's true that MiG isn't as fast but he compensates with hockey-IQ and has in my honest opinion much higher skill upside than Koivu.

 

[ToBBa]

Young Koivu was tough as nails for a small man, had great puck protection and a unique overall vision of the ice which made him a beast in the offensive zone. Young Koivu was pretty quick on skates, too. While Granlund is skilled, he lacks pretty much in all these areas compared to young Koivu at present and Granlund has not yet shown anything similar to the dominance Koivu did on the international ice. Therefore, the comparison between the two of them is very much immature at this stage.

If you think we're underestimating Koivu by comparing him with Granlund you're wrong. Granlund has achieved almost everything that a Finnish player in his age is able to. I have to agree that Koivu was better skater but it's immature to say that Granlund would lack in puck protection or vision compared to Koivu. Or that MG hasn't shown anything similar to Koivu's dominance on the international ice. Koivu wasn't a world champion in the same age and he didn't play as good in WC as young as Granlund. People seem to forget how young Granlund really is. For example Koivu and Selänne have made their breakthroughs as pretty much older.

 

[ToBBa]

I agree to degree. I agree that Granlund isn't Saku Koivu yet, nor has he accomplished as much. But saying that Granlund hasn't shown anything that would suggest him to ever be as good is total garbage IMO.

Granlund was one of the best forwards, if not best in the WHC last year (9 points in 9 games, most assist of the tournament, tied with Olimb). Guy has better hockey vision and set of hands than Koivu ever had and it's true that MiG isn't as fast but he compensates with hockey-IQ and has in my honest opinion much higher skill upside than Koivu.

Olimb had 1 more (8) assist you idiot but otherwise I totally agree with you.

 

[Finnish Flash 76]

Anyone knows a stream where to watch this live?

 

[SittingDuck]

This is exactly the only way for finland to loose this game. Playing half lights, not putting the puck on the net, giving up a few and wow, there is the upset of the tournament so far.

the thing is, if Finland plays half lights and denmark get's a goal, that's a wake up call for us to not underestimate them, our players are that much better, i think it as a same kind of game as finland - norway game in the wc this year at the quarter finals.

 

[SaekkiPaelli]

Seriously this is the most ridiculous thread I've read so far. I knew people are overhyping Granlund, but this? Granlund better than S Koivu? Are you kidding me? He hasn't played one game in the NHL yet, has had one good WC tournament, and people think he is better. Like I've said so many times before wait until you see him play against the best players in the world regularly.

People saying, how he is a better playmaker than Koivu, in a sense it might be true. If the playmaker was untouchable and he was stationary, I think Granlund might give better passes. But since that's not the case I think Koivu is the better playmaker. Koivu is ten times the skater Granlund is and if you watched Koivu in his prime, he was an excellent player along the boards. He knew how to sort of twist away from the opponent. Don't really know how to explain it.

I think this WJC will show that Granlund will not thrive in the NHL as he has in Europe. Still solid 1-2 line center maybe 1 80+ point season but will probably settle at 60-70 points, with 35-50 point rookie season.

Sorry, if I went off-topic, since this is a GDT thread. Just hate the classic finnish overhype.

EDIT: On topic, Finland will take it 5-1 or 6-2, Armia, Pulkkinen, Salomaki 2, Aaltonen and Barkov score. Granlund 0+2.

 

[ToBBa]

Seriously this is the most ridiculous thread I've read so far. I knew people are overhyping Granlund, but this? Granlund better than S Koivu? Are you kidding me? He hasn't played one game in the NHL yet, has had one good WC tournament, and people think he is better. Like I've said so many times before wait until you see him play against the best players in the world regularly.

People saying, how he is a better playmaker than Koivu, in a sense it might be true. If the playmaker was untouchable and he was stationary, I think Granlund might give better passes. But since that's not the case I think Koivu is the better playmaker. Koivu is ten times the skater Granlund is and if you watched Koivu in his prime, he was an excellent player along the boards. He knew how to sort of twist away from the opponent. Don't really know how to explain it.

I think this WJC will show that Granlund will not thrive in the NHL as he has in Europe. Still solid 1-2 line center maybe 1 80+ point season but will probably settle at 60-70 points, with 35-50 point rookie season.

Sorry, if I went off-topic, since this is a GDT thread. Just hate the classic finnish overhype.

EDIT: On topic, Finland will take it 5-1 or 6-2, Armia, Pulkkinen, Salomaki 2, Aaltonen and Barkov score. Granlund 0+2.

If something is ridiculous here it's you. We're talking about Granlund being or not being better than Koivu in the same age..

 

[FinRuutu]

Seriously this is the most ridiculous thread I've read so far. I knew people are overhyping Granlund, but this? Granlund better than S Koivu? Are you kidding me? He hasn't played one game in the NHL yet, has had one good WC tournament, and people think he is better. Like I've said so many times before wait until you see him play against the best players in the world regularly.

People saying, how he is a better playmaker than Koivu, in a sense it might be true. If the playmaker was untouchable and he was stationary, I think Granlund might give better passes. But since that's not the case I think Koivu is the better playmaker. Koivu is ten times the skater Granlund is and if you watched Koivu in his prime, he was an excellent player along the boards. He knew how to sort of twist away from the opponent. Don't really know how to explain it.

I think this WJC will show that Granlund will not thrive in the NHL as he has in Europe. Still solid 1-2 line center maybe 1 80+ point season but will probably settle at 60-70 points, with 35-50 point rookie season.

Sorry, if I went off-topic, since this is a GDT thread. Just hate the classic finnish overhype.

EDIT: On topic, Finland will take it 5-1 or 6-2, Armia, Pulkkinen, Salomaki 2, Aaltonen and Barkov score. Granlund 0+2.

Reading comprehension practice; read the thread again. We are not debating or saying that Granlund is better than S. Koivu. Or atleast I've never said that.

In a nutshell what I've said is that Granlund has skill set and potential to be better, IN FUTURE. Might he bust? Sure, but that's every time the case when speaking of prospects. It's always speculation when you speak about what is possible to be or not to be [(c) Shakespere].

What is this Finnish overhype, your talking about? I've not noticed once that Finns were overhyping their prospects more than other countries. Finns might be more excited about their few prospects because of the fact that there has not been prospects like Granlund for example, in many many years. I'd say it's the opposite, Finns are usually negative and cynic about their possibilities.

 

[Spawnisen]

5-1 Armia 2
MiG 1
MaG 1
Pulkkinen 1