Greatest Forwards of All Time #18

Discussion in 'The History of Hockey' started by canucksfan, Apr 4, 2006.

  1. canucksfan

    canucksfan Registered User

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    Since I put Apps on the other one twice and didn't put Malone on I will redo this one. Yzerman won with 25 votes. Joe Sakic will be added next. I am going to vote for Schmidt again and add Geoffrion.

    #1 Gretzky(64.71%)
    #2 Lemieux(63.77%)
    #3 Howe(63.41%)
    #4 Richard(31.58%)
    #5 Beliveau(53.49%)
    #6 Hull(28.81%)
    #7 LaFleur(72.73% won tiebreaker)
    #8 Esposito(34.88%)
    #9 Morenz(23.81%)
    #10 Messier(24.29%)
    #11 Jagr(30.99%)
    #12 Bossy(24.56%)
    #13 Mikita(27.08%)
    #14 Trottier(30.95%)
    #15 Clarke(36.49%)
    #16 Lindsay(36.84%)
    #17 Yzerman(55.56%)
     
  2. God Bless Canada

    God Bless Canada Registered User

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    Add Boom Boom Geoffrion. Since there isn't a player who stands out as a slam dunk pick, I'm going to with-hold my vote to help ensure one player who doesn't belong in the top 25 isn't picked. (Those who have been part of this survey from its beginning will know who I'm talking about. The guy with 45 points in 49 playoff games).
     
  3. NOTENOUGHBREWER

    NOTENOUGHBREWER Registered User

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    Marcel's been getting votes before Sakic was even in it? :shakehead

    If you're not talking about Marcel I'm gonna look real dumb :D
     
  4. Murphy

    Murphy Registered User

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    Voted for Newsy,

    Gotta get Sittler up there.
     
  5. Evilo

    Evilo Registered User

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    Voted Dionne. Add Francis.
     
  6. #66

    #66 Registered User

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    Voted Malone. Add Bill Cook.
     
  7. Sens Rule

    Sens Rule Registered User

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    Now it is getting hard!!!!!!!!! It is tough to pick now. I went with Mahovlich. But Bathgate, Sakic and others were close.

    Add Kurri
     
  8. Shelby-villains

    Shelby-villains Registered User

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    Voted Sakic. Add Francis.
     
  9. Darz

    Darz Registered User

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    Newsy Lalonde

    add: Boom Boom Geoffrion
     
  10. El_Scoobo

    El_Scoobo Registered User

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    Voted Schmidt again. Add Cook.
     
  11. KariyaIsGod*

    KariyaIsGod* Guest

    Voted for Schmidt because I want him or Lalonde to win here. Schmidt had a better chance I figured.

    Add BILL COOK...
     
  12. Czech Your Math

    Czech Your Math Registered User

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    Sakic, add Kurri.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2006
  13. Hockey Outsider

    Hockey Outsider Registered User

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    Add Bill Cook!
     
  14. Wisent

    Wisent Registered User

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    I voted Syl Apps for the 6th ot 7th time. Add Red Kelly
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2006
  15. Bring Back Bucky

    Bring Back Bucky Registered User

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  16. JWINK19

    JWINK19 southern Devils fan

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    Vote Newsy, add Conacher, Geoffrion or Brett Hull.
     
  17. kovy1335

    kovy1335 Registered User

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    voted Dionne...add Francis
     
  18. Hockey Outsider

    Hockey Outsider Registered User

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    It's a bit too early for both players, but Sakic is more deserving than Dionne. In fact, I don't think it's even close.

    Offense: Dionne has 1 Art Ross, Sakic has none. Dionne was a top five scorer 7 times, Sakic 6 times. Dionne was a top ten scorer 8 times, Sakic 9 times. Dionne gets a slight edge in dominance.

    Some people might be impressed by the fact that Dionne's "outscored" Sakic. Keep in mind Dionne played in the high-scoring 70's and 80's while Sakic had most of his best years in the dead puck era. Adjusted for era, Dionne has 1,508 pts in 1,388 games while Sakic has 1,471 pts in 1,192 games (not counting this season). So Sakic has already had the more productive career (in less games).

    Defense: Not even close. Dionne is as one-dimensional as they come. Sakic has evolved into a great two-way player and is a useful PKer. In fact, he nearly beat Madden for the Selke in 2001.

    Playoffs: Again, not even close. Dionne struggled in the postseason, recording just 45 pts in 49 games. That's a massive 43% drop in production. Never had more than 14 pts in a single playoff year, was above 1 ppg just twice.

    Sakic is a great playoff performer. 169 pts in 153 (a slight, 9% drop). Has exceeded 14 pts five times, was above 1 ppg five times. Plus, has a Conn Smythe.

    Awards: Dionne never won a Hart but was runner-up once and 3rd place twice. Four-time all-star (2 first, 2 second). No Conn Smythe's.

    Sakic won the Hart once but was never again in the top five. Won the Conn Smythe. Runner-up for the Selke once. Three-time all-star (3 first).

    Overall, Sakic is clearly the better player. Dionne was a bit more of a dominant scorer, but Sakic had the more productive career overall, and is vastly superior in terms of defense and playoff performance. Awards are very similar. Sakic by a mile.
     
  19. Leaf Lander

    Leaf Lander Registered User Sponsor

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    max bentley


    He never stopped skating and had as many moves in his day, contemporaries would later say, as Wayne Gretzky did during his era.

    Known as the "Dipsy-Doodle Dandy from Delisle" because of his fancy skating and superb stickhandling, Max was the youngest of the three NHL Bentleys (the other two were Doug and Reggie). Max grew up on a farm, one of 13 children, six of whom were boys. All of the kids played sports, and at one time five of the boys played on the same hockey team, the Drumheller Miners.
    Max originally had a tryout with Boston as a 16-year-old, but he looked so small the Bruins sent him packing. On his way home, he stopped off in Montreal to try out with the Habs, and there the Canadiens' manager said Max looked so sick he should see a doctor. Incredibly, the doctor told Max he had a heart condition. If he didn't go home and forget about hockey, the doctor said, Max wouldn't live a year.

    Max always looked gaunt and pale, and throughout his career he was plagued by minor injuries, pains, aches, dry throat, burning eyes, upset stomach, ulcers, diabetes and kidney trouble. He was often called "a walking drug store" because of his pharmacological tendencies, and for 155 pounds he was also quite resilient.



    In his first year Max played on a line with brother Doug and Mush March, but the following season the coach put Bill Thoms on the line as a policeman for the two high scorers. That was the turning point of the season, as Max finished third in the NHL's scoring race--Doug was first--and won the Lady Byng Trophy.
    Max became famous for his drive to the net, his aggressive play to score and the fact that he was constantly in motion. He never stopped skating and had as many moves in his day, contemporaries would later say, as Wayne Gretzky did during his era.

    Max won the 1946-47 scoring championship on the last day of the season--his second consecutive scoring title. Going into the game against New York, he was one point ahead of Rocket Richard, whose Canadiens were playing Boston. The game itself didn't matter for the Hawks, who were so far down in last place they couldn't see up at all. Max was getting reports about the Montreal game, and in the first two periods Richard had two points, and moved ahead. But in the third period, Max had an early assist to tie Richard. Then, midway through the period, he took a Mosienko pass at center and returned the favor at the blue line and cut to the net. Mosienko fed a perfect pass to the slot and Max's quick shot to the corner slid past the sprawling glove hand of Charlie Rayner. The Rocket was held off the score sheet and Max won the scoring title by one point.

    While his years with his brother in Chicago were rewarding, the turning point of his career came on November 2, 1947, when he and Cy Thomas were traded to Toronto for an unprecedented five players--Bud Poile, Bob Goldham, Gaye Stewart, Gus Bodnar and Ernie Dickens. While many thought Conn Smythe was crazy to make the trade, the Leafs won the Stanley Cup three times in the next four years with Max. He assisted on the game-tying goal in game five of the 1951 finals that saw Bill Barilko score the Cup winner in overtime

    Bentley himself was at first saddened by the trade and the loss of playing with his brother. But he immediately became a star on a star team and helped the Leafs to victory, and his popularity in Chicago was never as great as it was almost instantly in Toronto. One night at the Gardens, the Leafs needed a goal. Charlie Hempstead, a racehorse owner and season ticket subscriber who sat right by the Leafs bench, petitioned Max. "Score a goal and I'll give you a horse," he proposed. Max did and Charlie obliged.

    When he retired, he had scored 245 goals and was second among active players only to Maurice Richard
     
  20. kovy1335

    kovy1335 Registered User

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    245 goals doesn't seem like very much for a greatest forward of all time list...
     
  21. terreur

    terreur Registered User

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    Voted for Sakic... Had Jari kurri
     
  22. BM67

    BM67 Registered User

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    Considering that during the 13 years that he played in the NHL, there were ZERO 50 goal scorers and only 26 30 goal scorers, (16 different players of which he was one), it's not that bad.

    Max Bentley has more scoring titles and Stanley Cups than Sakic and Dionne combined.
     
  23. reckoning

    reckoning Registered User

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    So Joe Sakic is going to win his first time on the board. Makes you wonder if he could`ve beat Yzerman if he was added earlier. Then again, the Sakic vs. Yzerman debate is probably the 3rd most overdone argument on here next to Roy vs. Hasek and Gretzky vs. Lemieux.
     
  24. raleh

    raleh Registered User

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    Yeah, but Ron Francis would probably be winning this round too. People just vote for who they saw. I bet Pat Verbeek would get more votes than some of the guys on here just because of lack of research. Just my opinion though.
     
  25. NOTENOUGHBREWER

    NOTENOUGHBREWER Registered User

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    Francis isnt exactly a dinosaur. Most people old enough to have seen all of Sakic's career have seen enough of Francis in his glory years as well. Sakic versus Francis is a debatable subject not an out of your mind stupid one like Naslund or Forsberg vs Francis.
     

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