GDT: Game 8 Ottawa @ Vegas 7pm. Stone's nightmare?

[Super Cake]

Honestly, we deserve to lose.

oh yeah big boy? I got two words for you: Parking lot.

 

[Vegas Vince]

 

[Vegas Vince]

oh yeah big boy? I got two words for you: Parking lot.

Please, let's settle this the way that we do down South. Meet me behind the Sonic. Loser buys the slushies.

 

[MrLouniverse]

Glad Marchy got to get that one back. We always deserve to win.

 

[Super Cake]

Please, let's settle this the way that we do down South. Meet me behind the Sonic. Loser buys the slushies.

My beef is not with you though. It is with that doofus named Super Cake

 

[Vegas Vince]

My beef is not with you though. It is with that doofus named Super Cake

I know. I stopped at Sonic earlier today and just couldn't get it outta my head. Also, that's a running joke on the LSU board that I hang out on.

 

[HanSolo]

"I got no issues with Pirri, he's an NHL player and he's gonna be a part of this NHL team."

-Gallant

 

[Vegan Knight]

"I got no issues with Pirri, he's an NHL player and he's gonna be a part of this NHL team."

-Gallant

He helped get us the extra point. I didn't see anything less out of him than I saw from some other forwards. The hate is overblown at this point as much as the hype was during his scoring streak.

 

[hangman005]

I tell y’all to hold the fortress and we end up in a shootout... despicable

 

[HanSolo]

He helped get us the extra point. I didn't see anything less out of him than I saw from some other forwards. The hate is overblown at this point as much as the hype was during his scoring streak.

I don't hate him. I just think for how often he misses shots or passes, doesn't contribute to battles along the boards, very rarely backchecks, he just doesn't do much when he's not scoring and we can do better with our third line lw. Namely Tuch.

But beyond that, even Nosek has been a better all around hockey player.

 

[Vegan Knight]

I don't hate him. I just think for how often he misses shots or passes, doesn't contribute to battles along the boards, very rarely backchecks, he just doesn't do much when he's not scoring and we can do better with our third line lw. Namely Tuch.

But beyond that, even Nosek has been a better all around hockey player.

Nosek has had a good start to the year, that isn't an insult.

I have no doubt Pirri is the 13th forward when everyone is healthy, but they aren't, and I don't deny he's the 10th, 11th or 12th best forward any game. I just don't think he has been so far worse than other forwards in any given game.

 

[theslatcher]

I don't hate him. I just think for how often he misses shots or passes, doesn't contribute to battles along the boards, very rarely backchecks, he just doesn't do much when he's not scoring and we can do better with our third line lw. Namely Tuch.

But beyond that, even Nosek has been a better all around hockey player.

Minor thing: Tuch is our third line RW.

Also, Engo, & Hague should be split up. They never should have been put together in the first place, our 2 slowest dmen.

 

[KnishOfTheCrease]

"I got no issues with Pirri, he's an NHL player and he's gonna be a part of this NHL team."

-Gallant

“......because we need him in shootouts.” -Coach Gerard

 

[IceNeophyte]

Nosek has had a good start to the year, that isn't an insult.

I have no doubt Pirri is the 13th forward when everyone is healthy, but they aren't, and I don't deny he's the 10th, 11th or 12th best forward any game. I just don't think he has been so far worse than other forwards in any given game.

Mrs. Pirri, isn't it time to let the little bird leave the nest?

 

[LadyStanley]

First fight of season

 

[Vegan Knight]

Mrs. Pirri, isn't it time to let the little bird leave the nest?

I understand I've defended him a few times and it isn't from thinking he's any great player. I just don't like the oversimplification and whipping boy aspect he's gained. I don't particularly like his play style but he gets dunked on here in an over the top fashion sometimes and I don't enjoy it with any player.

I think the same about Holden, yes he struggled but I didn't ever think he wasn't a legitimate 6/7 D and didn't agree with over the top criticism that everything he did was wrong and he should be lucky to get by in the AHL. Only difference there is his contract, which is way too high and caused us problems this season.

My biggest gripe though is this, if you're saying Pirri plays reckless passes way too often or is not strong at all along the boards or too often misses the net that's different to me than saying Pirri doesn't do anything when not scoring or rarely backchecks, which paints an image of a lazy player who isn't trying, I think it's wrong and that's what I take issue with.

 

[HanSolo]

I understand I've defended him a few times and it isn't from thinking he's any great player. I just don't like the oversimplification and whipping boy aspect he's gained. I don't particularly like his play style but he gets dunked on here in an over the top fashion sometimes and I don't enjoy it with any player.

I think the same about Holden, yes he struggled but I didn't ever think he wasn't a legitimate 6/7 D and didn't agree with over the top criticism that everything he did was wrong and he should be lucky to get by in the AHL. Only difference there is his contract, which is way too high and caused us problems this season.

My biggest gripe though is this, if you're saying Pirri plays reckless passes way too often or is not strong at all along the boards or too often misses the net that's different to me than saying Pirri doesn't do anything when not scoring or rarely backchecks, which paints an image of a lazy player who isn't trying, I think it's wrong and that's what I take issue with.

I never said he's lazy. I said his skills don't translate. There's a difference.

The reason why I "dunk on him" is because I think he's at most times a non contributory presence in the line up and most others with his turnovers, lack of defensive pressure where it's needed, or penalties he has a negative impact on the team's overall performance, and then on the most rare occasions he does something useful like a shot that actually gets on goal or a pass that actually connects.

Compare a guy like Lindberg who we traded away. He wasn't some scorching offensive talent but at least he played a more complete 200 foot game.

And just from a personal standpoint, I'm invested in seeing Glass develop well because he's as much the future of our team as guys like Stone. When pucks die on Pirri's stick and the line has to spend more time in the defensive zone to pick up the slack for him it stands as a barrier to the line's success, and conversely, breaks down the quality of Cody's development opportunities.

 

[HanSolo]

As for Holden I don't think anyone said he should've counted himself lucky to get by in the AHL.

Sure he's good enough to be a 6/7 defender and you're right that money is a factor in the criticism. A guy tying up that much of our cap space shouldn't make as many mistakes as he does. But the primary reason for the criticism really comes down to the fact that this general core of players made it all the way to the finals. We want to see it happen again with a happier ending. On a contending team, there should be some baseline expectations that apply to everyone up and down the lineup. Meaning not everyone needs to be exceptional like a Mark Stone. But look at guys like Carrier, Nosek, and Reaves. They do their jobs and do it well. Even when they're not showing up on the score they're active on the forecheck and backcheck, and generally they're effective at it.

When a player like Holden (or first half of the season Merrill last year) or Pirri are not contributing or having a negative impact more often than they're helping the team, then it's a player whom could and should be improved on in the lineup. Pirri couldn't hold down a spot with a rebuilding New York Rangers and he really hasn't improved all that much.

In Holden's case I don't know what happened because he was pretty solid before joining our team. But now he's a liability far far too often even for a 6/7 defender. Engelland at least has the excuse that due to age he's probably overstayed his welcome. As I said, Holden may be a 6/7 defender but the kind that should be in that role on a longshot to make the playoffs. A team trying to go on a deep playoff run is at risk of being exposed by his inconsistent play.

 

[Vegan Knight]

I never said he's lazy. I said his skills don't translate. There's a difference.

The reason why I "dunk on him" is because I think he's at most times a non contributory presence in the line up and most others with his turnovers, lack of defensive pressure where it's needed, or penalties he has a negative impact on the team's overall performance, and then on the most rare occasions he does something useful like a shot that actually gets on goal or a pass that actually connects.

Compare a guy like Lindberg who we traded away. He wasn't some scorching offensive talent but at least he played a more complete 200 foot game.

And just from a personal standpoint, I'm invested in seeing Glass develop well because he's as much the future of our team as guys like Stone. When pucks die on Pirri's stick and the line has to spend more time in the defensive zone to pick up the slack for him it stands as a barrier to the line's success, and conversely, breaks down the quality of Cody's development opportunities.

I've seen plays die on Eakin's stick as often this season than Pirri's. Eakin hasn't been winning faceoffs. I don't think the third line is the place for Glass at all.

That third line has been a problem whether it's been Stastny, Glass, Pirri, Eakin or Zykov on it. I think it would be good to address it before Tuch returns.

As crazy as it sounds, if we are thinking of Glass, I would consider switching Pacioretty and Pirri. Pirri would have his strengths highlighted and his weaknesses hidden playing with Stastny and Stone. And, more importantly, Pacioretty could help Glass infinitely more because we need three good forward lines.

Stone (and Stastny) are complete, they don't need Pacioretty in order to produce a lot. Glass NEEDS a Pacioretty at this point in his career.

Pacioretty and Glass worked well together and Pacioretty and Eakin did well last year. Pirri showed some success in the top six, and Stastny and Stone (9.5M player) can carry a linemate, they back check well and are good along the boards, have good zone entries and can set up Pirri for the offensive skills he does well.

It wouldn't be a demotion for Pacioretty or a promotion for Pirri. It would be doing what we can to make three good forward lines until Tuch comes back.

 

[Vegan Knight]

As for Holden I don't think anyone said he should've counted himself lucky to get by in the AHL.

Sure he's good enough to be a 6/7 defender and you're right that money is a factor in the criticism. A guy tying up that much of our cap space shouldn't make as many mistakes as he does. But the primary reason for the criticism really comes down to the fact that this general core of players made it all the way to the finals. We want to see it happen again with a happier ending. On a contending team, there should be some baseline expectations that apply to everyone up and down the lineup. Meaning not everyone needs to be exceptional like a Mark Stone. But look at guys like Carrier, Nosek, and Reaves. They do their jobs and do it well. Even when they're not showing up on the score they're active on the forecheck and backcheck, and generally they're effective at it.

When a player like Holden (or first half of the season Merrill last year) or Pirri are not contributing or having a negative impact more often than they're helping the team, then it's a player whom could and should be improved on in the lineup. Pirri couldn't hold down a spot with a rebuilding New York Rangers and he really hasn't improved all that much.

In Holden's case I don't know what happened because he was pretty solid before joining our team. But now he's a liability far far too often even for a 6/7 defender. Engelland at least has the excuse that due to age he's probably overstayed his welcome. As I said, Holden may be a 6/7 defender but the kind that should be in that role on a longshot to make the playoffs. A team trying to go on a deep playoff run is at risk of being exposed by his inconsistent play.

The Blackhawks had very questionable 5 and 6 D their 3rd Cup year, all teams have deficiencies with a salary cap and Holden sheltered on a bottom pair can be fine even on a Cup team.

I think Engelland has played better than given credit for this year too, but we don't have to get into that.

 

[willy702]

People always going to complain about someone on a posting forum. Team could be winning every game 6-0 and some will come in here and say why isn't someone scoring. Pirri and Holden are just filler on the team, won't even be playing much when others return.

 

[GKG18]

I've seen plays die on Eakin's stick as often this season than Pirri's. Eakin hasn't been winning faceoffs. I don't think the third line is the place for Glass at all.

IDK...I disagree with this. The eye test tells me Eakin is fine. Pirri hasn't been terrible either. Can someone dig up some advanced stats?

 

[theslatcher]

The Blackhawks had very questionable 5 and 6 D their 3rd Cup year, all teams have deficiencies with a salary cap and Holden sheltered on a bottom pair can be fine even on a Cup team.

I think Engelland has played better than given credit for this year too, but we don't have to get into that.

You do realize the Hawks played their top 4 big minutes(because they had the D to do so) and the bottom pairing dmen got less than 10 minutes each per game? The comparable is not there.

 

[HanSolo]

People always going to complain about someone on a posting forum. Team could be winning every game 6-0 and some will come in here and say why isn't someone scoring. Pirri and Holden are just filler on the team, won't even be playing much when others return.

Yeah but in your case we could be losing every game 6-0 and you'd find a reason to complain about complaining. Being willfully oblivious to or disregarding flaws in the system is just as bad as nitpicking every little mistake.

IDK...I disagree with this. The eye test tells me Eakin is fine. Pirri hasn't been terrible either. Can someone dig up some advanced stats?

Depends on how you define terrible. Sure there have been players more irresponsible on and off the puck. It's not that Pirri is always having a negative impact on the team. For the most part he's just not contributing much.

 

[willy702]

Yeah but in your case we could be losing every game 6-0 and you'd find a reason to complain about complaining. Being willfully oblivious to or disregarding flaws in the system is just as bad as nitpicking every little mistake.



Depends on how you define terrible. Sure there have been players more irresponsible on and off the puck. It's not that Pirri is always having a negative impact on the team. For the most part he's just not contributing much.

No team is perfect and plenty of room to improve. It's just usually when you and a few other posters go on the rant it becomes this guy should never play in the NHL ever. Then when he does ok you would never admit maybe you overdid it a bit.