GDT: Game 25: Red Wings vs sharks 7:00 pm et 12/7/23 (ESPN+, BSD)

[sepster]

I did NOT end up going to the game tonight. I was actually at home with my ex.

I was just as disappointed as the rest of us.

Pretty awful display and Husso is terrible.

But yeah, FTR I WAS NOT THERE!

I require proof.

 

[JohanFranzenstein]

I woke up with a disgust I can't express with words. I'd take the 11-2 walloping by the Penguins again over that collapse last night.

 

[sepster]

If you're going to drop a turd in the punchbowl and get smacked in the mouth for it, better to do it against a non-conference opponent and still pick up a point in the process. Hopefully, the team is as pissed off and embarrassed as many fans are feeling and they come out with renewed focus and a burr under their saddle against Ottawa on Saturday.

Glad the Wings avoided last night's performance the previous game against Buffalo. That is exactly why I had said I was OK holding Kane out until the San Jose game. Now that the distraction of his debut is out of the way, the Wings get back to business.

 

[schuelma24]

If you're going to drop a turd in the punchbowl and get smacked in the mouth for it, better to do it against a non-conference opponent and still pick up a point in the process. Hopefully, the team is as pissed off and embarrassed as many fans are feeling and they come out with renewed focus and a burr under their saddle against Ottawa on Saturday.

Glad the Wings avoided last night's performance the previous game against Buffalo. That is exactly why I had said I was OK holding Kane out until the San Jose game. Now that the distraction of his debut is out of the way, the Wings get back to business.

well said

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

You’re right in terms of big picture, but I am with @norrisnick on this one. The overall success doesn’t give Lalonde and Stevie a pass for not doing the right tweaks to make it even better. There is no doubt in my mind that we would be breathing down Boston‘s neck right now, if

1. Lalonde wasn’t in love with Husso
2. Lalonde had a better feel for situational play
3. Stevie and Lalonde weren’t married to the idea of letting Edvinsson over-marinade

The only reason for us bitching in here is because our expectations have changed based on the way our team has performed. Our situation is good, but could be even better. These deficiencies are costing us points.

In terms of personnel I need my Coach to be a polygamist. „Oh you can’t satisfy me? Let me call in the other one and let him try“ Lyon and Reimer better be getting starts before we see Husso again.

On a micro level, I have some frustration with Lalonde last night. Use the timeout. Pull Husso. But on a macro level he's been very good with this team.

As for Husso, I think Lyon should be getting the shot at starter. I do like that Husso got what was supposed to be an easy game against San Jose and Lyon will likely get the start on an important game against the Senators. After what happened with Husso running out of gas last season maybe Lalonde is taking a more conservative approach than just riding one goalie. The reality is we've got one unproven and two proven to be not great goalies.

I would like to see Edvinsson play but he is almost certainly not going to be the savior people are painting him out to be. Last night our two youngest D men were our worst ones relative to their role.

Wings need to get 2 points in games like last night against the Sharks but they still do not have the talent of the top end teams in the league. Honestly it's probably a good sign fans have expectations high enough to be so frustrated with the coach. That means good things are happening.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

What do you expect when the team losses to the worst team in the entire league?

The team has enough talent to make the playoffs, barring major injuries, if they don't it's entirely on Lalonde.

If the Wings don't make the playoffs it's entirely on the coach and not any of the guys on the ice??

 

[Winged Wheel Willy]

On a micro level, I have some frustration with Lalonde last night. Use the timeout. Pull Husso. But on a macro level he's been very good with this team.

As for Husso, I think Lyon should be getting the shot at starter. I do like that Husso got what was supposed to be an easy game against San Jose and Lyon will likely get the start on an important game against the Senators. After what happened with Husso running out of gas last season maybe Lalonde is taking a more conservative approach than just riding one goalie. The reality is we've got one unproven and two proven to be not great goalies.

I would like to see Edvinsson play but he is almost certainly not going to be the savior people are painting him out to be. Last night our two youngest D men were our worst ones relative to their role.

Wings need to get 2 points in games like last night against the Sharks but they still do not have the talent of the top end teams in the league. Honestly it's probably a good sign fans have expectations high enough to be so frustrated with the coach. That means good things are happening.

By situational play I meant timeout and when to yank someone. Agree

Edvinsson is not the savior. Agree
But he should be better than two of our regulars. So I expect a net positive

Good things are happening. Agree
But that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t look to improve, especially when the deficiencies are fairly easy to correct.

Who is the unproven goalie?

 

[GreatGordie9]

Wings are currently in 10th overall and in a playoff spot and people are bitching about Lalonde?

This loss sucked but let's look at some big picture here of where the Wings are at in the standings and what the talent level of this roster actually is.

This is a Jekyl and Hyde team.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

By situational play I meant timeout and when to yank someone. Agree

Edvinsson is not the savior. Agree
But he should be better than two of our regulars. So I expect a net positive

Good things are happening. Agree
But that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t look to improve, especially when the deficiencies are fairly easy to correct.

Who is the unproven goalie?

Lyon. He's never started more than 19 games in the NHL if you include the postseason.

He's looked good in his starts for the Wings but that's still not the same as being named starter and playing 40 or 50 games. We've seen time and time again guys look great for short stretches but can't handle the role of a starter.

And I don't think the deficiencies are necessarily that easy to correct. Don't get me wrong, last night was maddening. but the Wings have a fair number of younger players on the roster that don't have a lot of experience with actually being good and closing out games. It happens to a lot of teams on the path upward.

 

[Detroit Knights]

I did NOT end up going to the game tonight. I was actually at home with my ex.

I was just as disappointed as the rest of us.

Pretty awful display and Husso is terrible.

But yeah, FTR I WAS NOT THERE!

Don't believe you at all. This all falls on you now like I stated before. Rules are rules man, sorry.

You are now not allowed to go to any games until further notice. THIS ISN'T WHAT I WANTED. I WANTED YOU TO HAVE BROKEN THE CURSE BUT MY HANDS ARE TIED.

 

[Detroit Knights]

Honestly, this is how my feelings went during the game.

1st period:
wow, feels like they are trying to boat race us. This might suck

2nd period:
Ok, we're moving now. wow 4 quick goals. (i just started laughing because of how fast they went in and how)
oh no that was a baaaad goal husso. I have been defending you on that pesky hockey boards and that'll come back to haunt me.
ok that second goal was a sick shot. no wonder some new jersey fans were somewhat upset for him in the deal. dude has a good shot
laughing when the 3rd goal went in. F*** it let a fourth in who cares
ok I was joking, you didn't need to let a 4th in

3rd period
just laughing the entire time because it was so obvious it was going to overtime.

before start of OT:
ok now I am remembering mickey redmond laying a jinx in the beginning of the game explaining to ken that this could be a trap game...no mickey wouldn't have done that on purpose

OT:
larkin...why are you falling down
no! don't act like it was a penalty, get on your horse and challenge the breakaway!
yeah, that is a fitting end. that makes sense

after the game:
man. f*** hanifin. Markstrom is now target #1 lmao

 

[Durango Red Winger]

Is it just me, or have the Red Wings lost the lead in the last few minutes, 6 on 5, more than any other team in the NHL, last ten years? I am trying to remember the last time we tied a game up in the last few minutes with a pulled goalie...

 

[Gniwder]

If the Wings don't make the playoffs it's entirely on the coach and not any of the guys on the ice??

There's enough talent on this team, he can sit just about any player aside from Larkin and Seider. I don't expect either to completely shit the bed. So YES.

Lyon. He's never started more than 19 games in the NHL if you include the postseason.

He's looked good in his starts for the Wings but that's still not the same as being named starter and playing 40 or 50 games. We've seen time and time again guys look great for short stretches but can't handle the role of a starter.

And I don't think the deficiencies are necessarily that easy to correct. Don't get me wrong, last night was maddening. but the Wings have a fair number of younger players on the roster that don't have a lot of experience with actually being good and closing out games. It happens to a lot of teams on the path upward.

It's kinda funny that you just described Husso, lol.

Anyways, nobody said to lock in Lyon for the rest of the games. You don't need to make black or white decisions like that. He should start until he starts shitting the bed.

This team isn't making it out of the first round with Husso in net. It's gotta be either Lyon or Reimer, if Lyon falters then Reimer needs to get a few starts.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

There's enough talent on this team, he can sit just about any player aside from Larkin and Seider. I don't expect either to completely shit the bed. So YES.



It's kinda funny that you just described Husso, lol.

Anyways, nobody said to lock in Lyon for the rest of the games. You don't need to make black or white decisions like that. He should start until he starts shitting the bed.

This team isn't making it out of the first round with Husso in net. It's gotta be either Lyon or Reimer, if Lyon falters then Reimer needs to get a few starts.

I realize no one said that about Lyon. I've also said that I think Lyon should be given the starting role. In an earlier post I referred to the Wings goalies as one unproven and two proven to be not very good. @Winged Wheel Willy asked who the unproven one was so I was clarifying. I'm not disagreeing with you on anything about goaltending here.

I do disagree that it's somehow entirely on coaching. Being able to sit any player doesn't automatically fix mental lapses on the ice. This is a team figuring out how to go from sucking to being consistently good. Learning to close out games is part of that.

 

[Sentinel]

If the Wings don't make the playoffs it's entirely on the coach and not any of the guys on the ice??

Depends on the manner in which they don't make it. We can all see they have the talent to compete (unlike in the last few years). But blowing THREE three and four game leads is ENTIRELY on the coach.

Switching goalies and calling a timeout in the middle of a free fall are the most obvious decisions a coach can make.

 

[Gniwder]

This is a team figuring out how to go from sucking to being consistently good. Learning to close out games is part of that.

You realize this team has only 5 players actually drafted by the Wings and everyone else was acquired through trades or UFA? Even Fischer has playoff experience, as do the 3 backup goalies, and I think everyone else that Stevie acquired.

Lalonde needs to make a point when the team starts shitting the bed like they did. Use the TO and/or pull the goalie. That's pretty much standard in the league.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

If the Wings don't make the playoffs it's entirely on the coach and not any of the guys on the ice??

Lalonde absolutely instructed all three of our forwards to get caught low.

 

[OneMoreTry]

I was actually at home with my ex.

That's almost as much of a recipe for disaster as our defensive pairings. Hopefully your evening went better than the Wings game?

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

You realize this team has only 5 players actually drafted by the Wings and everyone else was acquired through trades or UFA? Even Fischer has playoff experience, as do the 3 backup goalies, and I think everyone else that Stevie acquired.

Lalonde needs to make a point when the team starts shitting the bed like they did. Use the TO and/or pull the goalie. That's pretty much standard in the league.

Yes I'm aware of the roster.

Several of our key players still have relatively little experience at closing out games night after night. Larkin, Raymond, Veleno, Ras, Seider, Walman, Husso and/or Lyon. Hell even Debrincat is only 25 and missed the Blackhawks good years. And then you have players like Chiarot, Ghost and Petry who are playing big minutes and aren't exactly known for being consistent and stabilizing forces.

I wholeheartedly agree Lalonde should've done something in game to try and stop the bleeding. But after a game like last night I'm not sure who he'd single out to sit when half the team were candidates. And even then if you sit someone like Walman to send a message, you're still probably hurting the Wings chances at winning the next game.

It's possible to correct shit play without going full Torts. The Wings did that coming back from Sweden. Hopefully they can do it again and it will last longer.

 

[jkutswings]

And I don't think the deficiencies are necessarily that easy to correct. Don't get me wrong, last night was maddening. but the Wings have a fair number of younger players on the roster that don't have a lot of experience with actually being good and closing out games. It happens to a lot of teams on the path upward.

I think this is a point that isn't given enough discussion. Detroit could snap their fingers and add <insert your favorite stud defenseman> tomorrow, but that doesn't automatically make the rest of the roster play more responsibly.

It's a combo meal between a few factors. But nobody can say they have no room to improve.

 

[Gniwder]

Yes I'm aware of the roster.

Several of our key players still have relatively little experience at closing out games night after night. Larkin, Raymond, Veleno, Ras, Seider, Walman, Husso and/or Lyon. Hell even Debrincat is only 25 and missed the Blackhawks good years. And then you have players like Chiarot, Ghost and Petry who are playing big minutes and aren't exactly known for being consistent and stabilizing forces.

I wholeheartedly agree Lalonde should've done something in game to try and stop the bleeding. But after a game like last night I'm not sure who he'd single out to sit when half the team were candidates. And even then if you sit someone like Walman to send a message, you're still probably hurting the Wings chances at winning the next game.

It's possible to correct shit play without going full Torts. The Wings did that coming back from Sweden. Hopefully they can do it again and it will last longer.

He could start by not putting Walman and Holl together, or at least tell them not to swap sides. I was wondering why Holl and Walman swapped sides throughout that play, then sure enough Walman couldn't hold the blue line with his backhand, and Sturm scores on an odd man break.

Guess who was the forward totally floating on the play? Kostin.

Coaching can fix those problems.



Edit: Husso is also really bad about keeping his pads on the ice.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

He could start by not putting Walman and Holl together, or at least tell them not to swap sides. I was wondering why Holl and Walman swapped sides throughout that play, then sure enough Walman couldn't hold the blue line with his backhand, and Sturm scores on an odd man break.

Guess who was the forward totally floating on the play? Kostin.

Coaching can fix those problems.



Edit: Husso is also really bad about keeping his pads on the ice.

I guess I'm just saying coaching can point out these problems but ultimately it's the players on the ice that have to make the decision.

Walman needs better situational awareness and decision making on that play. He's on his backhand trying to hold the puck in with three Sharks at the blueline. The Wings have just given up three quick goals and it's almost the end of the period. He needs to be in retreat mode.

Admittedly the play could still end up ok if Kostin doesn't float there, Holl plays the 2-on-1 correctly and sticks with the pass, and Husso can stop a puck. Walman is coasting a bit at the end too which makes me wonder if it was the end of the shift. Which is another reason why he should've been backing up.

So it's bad decision by Walman. Bad effort by Kostin. Bad decisions/effort by Holl. Then Husso gonna Husso.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

The Lalonde hate is crazy

They need to learn how to hold leads BUT they're getting leads... that's step one and a massive step for this team

It was a wacky game. Drawing emotional conclusions from it is silly

No shit. Saying Lalonde is a Blashill clone whenever we lose is reductive. The team isn’t great defensively this year but they are leaps and bounds better offensively, and without looking too far I’d guess better than last year defensively.

 

[KJoe88]

Don't believe you at all. This all falls on you now like I stated before. Rules are rules man, sorry.

You are now not allowed to go to any games until further notice. THIS ISN'T WHAT I WANTED. I WANTED YOU TO HAVE BROKEN THE CURSE BUT MY HANDS ARE TIED.

you guys should sign a petition and send it LCA so I’m not allowed in

 

[Detroit Knights]

you guys should sign a petition and send it LCA so I’m not allowed in

the sad part is, is that you think that hasn't already happened.