GDT: Game 17: Columbus at Washington | 11/12 7PM EST

[Jyrki]

On the "bright" side, Dorsett, Moore and Brassard have combined for 12 pts, only 1 more than Gaborik.

it's disappointing to see him slacking when the team needs him the most, though.

 

[ca5150]

On the "bright" side, Dorsett, Moore and Brassard have combined for 12 pts, only 1 more than Gaborik.

it's disappointing to see him slacking when the team needs him the most, though.

On a brighter note, Chimera has MORE points than Gaborik and makes 5 million less! I would trade Gaborik one up to get Chimera back, one of the worst trades in franchise history...

 

[major major]

Sorry, I don't see it and I haven't at all this year. Gaborik is stone faced the whole time, zero emotion whatsoever. He isn't skating hard at all, you can see Atkinson fly around, that should be Gaborik also and it just isn't. I thought this might happen when JK called him out in the media (assist from Porty for starting that), he's gone in the tank like most european players do when they are challenged in the media. This will go the way of Jeff Carter with less fanfare and less in return. He will go quietly for a second if we're lucky.

You think it might just be age? Atkinson flys around like he's a young scorer; Gaborik uses his smarts like a veteran scorer who has an extensive injury history?

 

[CBJWerenski8]

On a brighter note, Chimera has MORE points than Gaborik and makes 5 million less! I would trade Gaborik one up to get Chimera back, one of the worst trades in franchise history...

Oh god I really need to go to bed now before I explode. He's been here what, 25 games? Jesus.

 

[ca5150]

You think it might just be age? Atkinson flys around like he's a young scorer; Gaborik uses his smarts like a veteran scorer who has an extensive injury history?

Gaborik is 30, not 40, he looks disinterested and I think he's almost playing not to get hurt so he can get a big contract with someone else. I haven't seen any "smarts" out of him and I certainly wouldn't label him a "scorer" at this point in the season. He hasn't stepped up against anyone worth a darn. Yet he still got the second most ice time next to Dubi, who kills penalties, of the forwards. He needs to be dropped to the 4th line and see how hard they work on every shift.

 

[ca5150]

Oh god I really need to go to bed now before I explode. He's been here what, 25 games? Jesus.

Not really, he's been present for about 5 games and slept through the other 20. Go ahead and explode, he's playing like garbage and needs to be called out. He's supposed to be a leader and he hasn't shown one bit of leadership or effort this season. Keep waiting...he'll be gone. I usually agree with you on most things, can't believe you don't see how poorly he has been. Sure he doesn't directly cost us goals in our own net, but he hasn't produced anything this season and floated last season for long stretches too. Dude hasn't scored in 7 games and yet some want to give him a pass still, we'll see what happens, I've seen his kind before and it doesn't end well.

 

[ca5150]

Oh god I really need to go to bed now before I explode. He's been here what, 25 games? Jesus.

He has 8 goals in 28 games...what is he waiting for?? How long does it take for him to decide he wants to step up? Dubi has been here less games than him and he's established himself as a leader and threat in all zones and steps up in big games!

 

[major major]

Gaborik is 30, not 40, he looks disinterested and I think he's almost playing not to get hurt so he can get a big contract with someone else. I haven't seen any "smarts" out of him and I certainly wouldn't label him a "scorer" at this point in the season. He hasn't stepped up against anyone worth a darn. Yet he still got the second most ice time next to Dubi, who kills penalties, of the forwards. He needs to be dropped to the 4th line and see how hard they work on every shift.

That's funny. He's done a few shifts on the 4th line lately.

Even in an awful slump he's still got 11 points in 16 games, and leads the team in scoring rate 5 on 5. That's not that bad.

I am familiar with your claim that those points are only against awful teams, but until you demonstrate that his rate of scoring is more skewed against awful teams than the average scorer is skewed that way, it means nothing. (Most will tend to score more against bad teams). So show me he's worse, and get a sample size.

BTW, I don't think Gaborik is all that good. I think we're only a marginally better team with him. I just want you to prove your point before you get carried away with your jeremiad.

 

[major major]

He has 8 goals in 28 games...what is he waiting for?? How long does it take for him to decide he wants to step up? Dubi has been here less games than him and he's established himself as a leader and threat in all zones and steps up in big games!

You are a comic, no? Dubi has been here more games and has fewer goals. He's obviously a better player, but still, that's the lamest attempt at a comparison I've seen in a while.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

He has 8 goals in 28 games...what is he waiting for?? How long does it take for him to decide he wants to step up? Dubi has been here less games than him and he's established himself as a leader and threat in all zones and steps up in big games!

I'm not saying he's been good, he hasn't, but he can clearly and has clearly been better before and I am completely confident he will turn it around at some point this year and if not and it's true he's dogging it then he won't be around. No, I don't believe the dogging it chatter you guys (not specifically you, people on the board) are spreading, and to compare him to Carter is laughable IMO.

Look, he needs to be better you're right. He's brought here to score goals and get points, and he's been pointless in what 7 games now? That can't happen with 7.5 million dollar players. But he is known to be hot and cold and thats what we invested in. We need to realize that, and not call him the worst trade we've ever made after only 20-something games.

 

[Mayor Bee]

On a brighter note, Chimera has MORE points than Gaborik and makes 5 million less! I would trade Gaborik one up to get Chimera back, one of the worst trades in franchise history...

....

I wouldn't trade an AHL player to get Jason Chimera back.

 

[Crede777]

Sorry, I don't see it and I haven't at all this year. Gaborik is stone faced the whole time, zero emotion whatsoever. He isn't skating hard at all, you can see Atkinson fly around, that should be Gaborik also and it just isn't. I thought this might happen when JK called him out in the media (assist from Porty for starting that), he's gone in the tank like most european players do when they are challenged in the media. This will go the way of Jeff Carter with less fanfare and less in return. He will go quietly for a second if we're lucky.

You could be right but it's a matter of perspective (maybe I'm seeing what I want to see or vice versa).

Maybe he's just going through the motions. I usually don't realize if someone is until right near the end of their tenure in Columbus. That said, he's been hitting a lot of posts (4 that I've personally counted) in the past few games. And he pulled double duty tonight playing on the top line AND on the line with Collins/Chaput.

I'm not ready to hang it on Gabby's head yet. I think it could be more line chemistry where he isn't getting much right now from Anisimov. Arty is the forward I really think should be stepping up more and being more consistent offensively each night. Dubi it's hard to argue with, Johansen and Atkinson are both young and doing fairly well, Gaborik has been cold but he started out hot, Foligno has had family issues, Calvert and Horton have been hurt, etc.

Bob's been average.

Our defense is currently doing their best Dr. Jekyl / Mr. Hyde / Ryan Murray (he's the only constant) impression. One night we're singing a d-man's praises, the next he's practically putting the puck into our net himself.

 

[ca5150]

That's funny. He's done a few shifts on the 4th line lately.

Even in an awful slump he's still got 11 points in 16 games, and leads the team in scoring rate 5 on 5. That's not that bad.

I am familiar with your claim that those points are only against awful teams, but until you demonstrate that his rate of scoring is more skewed against awful teams than the average scorer is skewed that way, it means nothing. (Most will tend to score more against bad teams). So show me he's worse, and get a sample size.

BTW, I don't think Gaborik is all that good. I think we're only a marginally better team with him. I just want you to prove your point before you get carried away with your jeremiad.

Well I don't really care what the "average player" is doing against anyone, we aren't paying 7 million to an average player and expecting him to step up in big games. I am only looking at this season, so if you want proof of his lack of production against teams with a winning record, 11 games, Pitt(2), Wash(2), NYR, Bos, Det, Tor, Ana, Van, Ott. He has 2 goals in those 11 games. In the 5 games against teams with losing records, Cal, NJ, Buff, NYI(2), he has 3 goals and none of them were very solid, 1 empty netter, and a couple slam dunks from good setups. He has 0 power play goals, yet plays on the 1st unit and 0 game winning goals. Not sure what more proof you want that he isn't performing up to expectations.

 

[major major]

I'm not saying he's been good, he hasn't, but he can clearly and has clearly been better before and I am completely confident he will turn it around at some point this year and if not and it's true he's dogging it then he won't be around. No, I don't believe the dogging it chatter you guys (not specifically you, people on the board) are spreading, and to compare him to Carter is laughable IMO.

Look, he needs to be better you're right. He's brought here to score goals and get points, and he's been pointless in what 7 games now? That can't happen with 7.5 million dollar players. But he is known to be hot and cold and thats what we invested in. We need to realize that, and not call him the worst trade we've ever made after only 20-something games.

I'm defending Gaborik for different reasons: you think he'll find another gear; I think he lost that gear four groin injuries ago. Leave him alone, what you see is what you get. He's a streaky old scorer.

 

[ca5150]

I'm not saying he's been good, he hasn't, but he can clearly and has clearly been better before and I am completely confident he will turn it around at some point this year and if not and it's true he's dogging it then he won't be around. No, I don't believe the dogging it chatter you guys (not specifically you, people on the board) are spreading, and to compare him to Carter is laughable IMO.

Look, he needs to be better you're right. He's brought here to score goals and get points, and he's been pointless in what 7 games now? That can't happen with 7.5 million dollar players. But he is known to be hot and cold and thats what we invested in. We need to realize that, and not call him the worst trade we've ever made after only 20-something games.

I didn't say this is the worst trade ever, though it could end up that way, it's way too early to call this the worst trade ever, and I hope you are 100% right and I'm wrong and he turns it around and goes on an unreal streak and ends up with 35 goals. I was talking about Chimera was one of the worst trades the Jackets have done. I'm very concerned because if you look back further than this season, he only had 3 goals in 12 games last season with us and farther back than that, he only had 9 goals in 35 games with the Rangers last season. There is clearly something wrong that he isn't the player that scored 41 goals a few years ago. I hope that player returns, but as of now, he hasn't shown me any flashes of that player, whatsoever.

 

[major major]

You could be right but it's a matter of perspective (maybe I'm seeing what I want to see or vice versa).

Maybe he's just going through the motions. I usually don't realize if someone is until right near the end of their tenure in Columbus. That said, he's been hitting a lot of posts (4 that I've personally counted) in the past few games. And he pulled double duty tonight playing on the top line AND on the line with Collins/Chaput.

I'm not ready to hang it on Gabby's head yet. I think it could be more line chemistry where he isn't getting much right now from Anisimov. Arty is the forward I really think should be stepping up more and being more consistent offensively each night. Dubi it's hard to argue with, Johansen and Atkinson are both young and doing fairly well, Gaborik has been cold but he started out hot, Foligno has had family issues, Calvert and Horton have been hurt, etc.

Bob's been average.

Our defense is currently doing their best Dr. Jekyl / Mr. Hyde / Ryan Murray (he's the only constant) impression. One night we're singing a d-man's praises, the next he's practically putting the puck into our net himself.

This is what I see in our team as well. Gaborik is doing what I expected him to do. Arty is not.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

I'm defending Gaborik for different reasons: you think he'll find another gear; I think he lost that gear four groin injuries ago. Leave him alone, what you see is what you get. He's a streaky old scorer.

That gear must have been lost during a shoulder surgery or abdomen surgery. Because he had 40 goals before those two. I don't think he can get 40 anymore, but I think he can get 30. He's always been streaky it's not just his age.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

I didn't say this is the worst trade ever, though it could end up that way, it's way too early to call this the worst trade ever, and I hope you are 100% right and I'm wrong and he turns it around and goes on an unreal streak and ends up with 35 goals. I was talking about Chimera was one of the worst trades the Jackets have done. I'm very concerned because if you look back further than this season, he only had 3 goals in 12 games last season with us and farther back than that, he only had 9 goals in 35 games with the Rangers last season. There is clearly something wrong that he isn't the player that scored 41 goals a few years ago. I hope that player returns, but as of now, he hasn't shown me any flashes of that player, whatsoever.

@the bold, I apologize, I thought you meant the Gaborik trade was the worst in franchise history.

Keep in mind he's been behind the pack in two consecutive offseasons. Last offseason during the lockout he had his shoulder surgery and didn't get to play overseas while everyone else who wasn't AHL eligible was, so when the NHL came back, he was already a step behind. Couple that with his relationship with Torts and you have a recipe for disaster season for him in New York and it was, so they moved him here. When he got here he knew Arty, Dubi, and Prospal. That's 3 people in a big room, he had to find chemistry and players he played well with, and he had very limited time and very limited practices to do so. Now this offseason he had his abdomen surgery and started behind on his offseason workouts than the rest of his teammates. True, he had all preseason and all training camp to get it going, but he's still new to the players.

 

[major major]

Well I don't really care what the "average player" is doing against anyone, we aren't paying 7 million to an average player and expecting him to step up in big games. I am only looking at this season, so if you want proof of his lack of production against teams with a winning record, 11 games, Pitt(2), Wash(2), NYR, Bos, Det, Tor, Ana, Van, Ott. He has 2 goals in those 11 games. In the 5 games against teams with losing records, Cal, NJ, Buff, NYI(2), he has 3 goals and none of them were very solid, 1 empty netter, and a couple slam dunks from good setups. He has 0 power play goals, yet plays on the 1st unit and 0 game winning goals. Not sure what more proof you want that he isn't performing up to expectations.

I deal in the empirics business, so perhaps I have a higher standard for what "proof" is, but if you want to know what constitutes proof, it would have to be a sample size of at least 30. Then you compare the proportion of goals against a weaker cohort of teams with the proportions of other players and groups of players. Right now you have a sample of 5 and no comparison group.

 

[Nanabijou]

Yes, Wiz looked like a pylon out there a few times, including the OT winner. He is what he is though, and I'd like to keep him around. We've paid a lot up front for his services - let him play it out and let those heaters keep coming from the point. I actually like that Murray-Wiz pairing and I think they will get better as Murray gets more experience and learns how to best cover Wiz's ass. Together, I see them putting up some big points on the board.

All that said, Wiz should be no where near the ice when we're up one with 3 min to play.

I'm really starting to get pissed off at Arty and Gabby though. Arty especially has been MIA since signing that contract in the off-season. We need more out of both of them.

 

[ca5150]

@the bold, I apologize, I thought you meant the Gaborik trade was the worst in franchise history.

Keep in mind he's been behind the pack in two consecutive offseasons. Last offseason during the lockout he had his shoulder surgery and didn't get to play overseas while everyone else who wasn't AHL eligible was, so when the NHL came back, he was already a step behind. Couple that with his relationship with Torts and you have a recipe for disaster season for him in New York and it was, so they moved him here. When he got here he knew Arty, Dubi, and Prospal. That's 3 people in a big room, he had to find chemistry and players he played well with, and he had very limited time and very limited practices to do so. Now this offseason he had his abdomen surgery and started behind on his offseason workouts than the rest of his teammates. True, he had all preseason and all training camp to get it going, but he's still new to the players.

You could be right, he could be working his way back from offseason surgery, but I just don't see the effort, look at a guy like Comeau, he isn't scoring but you can see the effort every shift. He seems to do the same thing everytime, glides through the neutral zone, goes wide and around and throws a pass out front. I want to see him drive the net, try to beat some guys one on one, go to the hard areas around the net and dig for rebounds. Anyone can do those things, look what Boll was able to do tonight by going to the hard areas. If he isn't what he used to be, he should adapt his game to contribute in other areas. Steve Yzerman had many surgeries and adapted his game to become one of the best defensive forwards and blocked shots and what not. He needs to find a way to make an impact, in my opinion.

 

[ca5150]

This is what I see in our team as well. Gaborik is doing what I expected him to do. Arty is not.

I agree Arty has been almost as bad many nights and needs to pick it up, but I expected more out of Gaborik, as I think many did. If anyone expected a 20 goal scorer for 7 million a year, then you are getting what you expected. Maybe I'm a fool for expected 35 goals.

 

[major major]

You could be right, he could be working his way back from offseason surgery, but I just don't see the effort, look at a guy like Comeau, he isn't scoring but you can see the effort every shift. He seems to do the same thing everytime, glides through the neutral zone, goes wide and around and throws a pass out front. I want to see him drive the net, try to beat some guys one on one, go to the hard areas around the net and dig for rebounds. Anyone can do those things, look what Boll was able to do tonight by going to the hard areas. If he isn't what he used to be, he should adapt his game to contribute in other areas. Steve Yzerman had many surgeries and adapted his game to become one of the best defensive forwards and blocked shots and what not. He needs to find a way to make an impact, in my opinion.

Gaborik is not a dangler. I can't remember the last time I've seen him burn a defender. This was known when he was acquired.

Though you're correct he doesn't have the same commitment to winning as Yzerman did.

 

[RogerSterling]

Last in the worst division in the NHL. That's one hell of an accomplishment after the end to last season.

I hope things change for the better soon, but I highly doubt this team can win in a game of catch up.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Last in the worst division in the NHL. That's one hell of an accomplishment after the end to last season.

I hope things change for the better soon, but I highly doubt this team can win in a game of catch up.

You can look at it that way, or you can look and see we are only 5 points out of the last playoff spot.