Prospect Info: Flames prospect rankings: #8 RUN-OFF POLL

[Anglesmith]

1. Matthew Tkachuk (73.81%)
2. Jon Gillies (54.00%)
3. Mark Jankowski (54.39%)
4. Oliver Kylington (45.95%:tiebreaker:61.54%)
5. Hunter Shinkaruk (60.98%)
6. Rasmus Andersson (52.17%)
7. Emile Poirier (35.00%:tiebreaker:59.52%)

Run-off rules:

• If first and second place are separated by a number of votes less than or equal to the number of votes for third place, a run-off vote will take place.
• If first and third are separated by a number of votes less than the number of all other votes, a three-way run-off vote will take place.
• Rules are subject to change due to common sense at all times.

Click to read more...

 

[Lunatik]

I vote for having a poll

 

[Volica]

Mangi. Highest potential prospect we have, did nothing but impress since his draft class. Most Underrated Player, Best Skater, and Best Shootout Player in the coaches poll. I'll take that for a 6th rounder overager. Skill's undeniable, he's up there with Tkachuk, Kylington and Andersson with the most raw skill.

 

[MonyontheMoney]

Accidentally voted for Klimchuk, wanted Hickey again, though don't ask me how I did it. If my vote can be changed, that would be best, if not I'm surprisingly fine with Klimchuk, he's criminally undervalued.

 

[tyflames]

Accidentally voted for Klimchuk, wanted Hickey again, though don't ask me how I did it. If my vote can be changed, that would be best, if not I'm surprisingly fine with Klimchuk, he's criminally undervalued.

What's undervalued? (Genuinely asking) His past season in the AHL, at least stat watching was abysmal at best

 

[MonyontheMoney]

What's undervalued? (Genuinely asking) His past season in the AHL, at least stat watching was abysmal at best

Looking at his stats I agree, it was disappointing from that standpoint, but from what I saw he was better than they would suggest. I also still have a tough time believing his offensive ability would have just dried up after showing gradual improvement in each of his WHL years, which were, at least moderately impressive. Alot of people seem to forget that this was his first professional season, which was also not an easy team to put up numbers on, they scored the 3rd(?) least goals in the AHL, and he suffered a couple injuries of the bat IIRC, which got him off to a slow start. Perhaps, 100TG would be better to speak to this as I believe he watches a good chunk of AHL games, but Huska did have some questionable player usage throughout the year, and Klimchuk very well could have been affected by that as well.

I mainly think he is very undervalued because after one disappointing statistical year, I've seen him described as a bust, scrub, etc, despite showing some other good traits while struggling offensively.

 

[Flames Fanatic]

What's undervalued? (Genuinely asking) His past season in the AHL, at least stat watching was abysmal at best

Keep in mind he was playing bottom six minutes on a team that had 3 guys break 40 points (all AHL vets) and on the team that finished bottom 5 for Goals For and bottom 5 in the league period.

 

[Dertell]

Looking at his stats I agree, it was disappointing from that standpoint, but from what I saw he was better than they would suggest. I also still have a tough time believing his offensive ability would have just dried up after showing gradual improvement in each of his WHL years, which were, at least moderately impressive. Alot of people seem to forget that this was his first professional season, which was also not an easy team to put up numbers on, they scored the 3rd(?) least goals in the AHL, and he suffered a couple injuries of the bat IIRC, which got him off to a slow start. Perhaps, 100TG would be better to speak to this as I believe he watches a good chunk of AHL games, but Huska did have some questionable player usage throughout the year, and Klimchuk very well could have been affected by that as well.

I mainly think he is very undervalued because after one disappointing statistical year, I've seen him described as a bust, scrub, etc, despite showing some other good traits while struggling offensively.

I haven't watched him play in the WHL but he was a super slow player in the AHL. Huska not giving him a whole lot of ice-time per game didn't help but that was his fault for not being good.

 

[MonyontheMoney]

I haven't watched him play in the WHL but he was a super slow player in the AHL. Huska not giving him a whole lot of ice-time per game didn't help but that was his fault for not being good.

By many accounts he got better as the season went along, though, after injuries healed. I'm a big fan of letting Agostino, Grant and those types go so we can actually play our prospects in the roles they should be played in.

 

[SKRusty]

I haven't watched him play in the WHL but he was a super slow player in the AHL. Huska not giving him a whole lot of ice-time per game didn't help but that was his fault for not being good.

With how rushed the move from Adirondack to Stockton was it should not be a big surprise that the younger guys had issues last season.

Klimchuck and Poirier specifically will have much better seasons this year.

Would have preferred Pittis being replaced with a better development coach but the previous season he did well with the younger guys in Adirondack.

New conditioning coach is Alan Selby. Worked with the Hamilton Bulldogs and Hill Performance Training

https://alanselbyhpt.wordpress.com/
http://www.thehillacademy.com/programs/hill-performance/

I really like this move. These young guys need the best trainers to understand the importance of nutrition and to balance their work outs to not sacrifice performance on the ice.

New Goaltending Coach is Colin Zulianello. He has worked with Blackwood, Hutton and Murray. I am looking forward to seeing his influence on Gilles and Rittich.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/thunder-bay/thunder-bay-goalie-zulianello-1.3584090
http://www.zuliesgoalieacademy.com/

So in general I expect the Heat with the talent available to them to be in the uper end of the league.

 

[Lunatik]

Keep in mind he was playing bottom six minutes on a team that had 3 guys break 40 points (all AHL vets) and on the team that finished bottom 5 for Goals For and bottom 5 in the league period.

Yep and the moment he started getting top 6 minutes Raymond was demoted and Shinkaruk was acquired and naturally the idiot coach played Raymond first.

To start the year Klimchuk played with Freddie Hamilton and Blair Riley in a 3rd line role, they did not play alot and when they did it was defensive starts. Hamilton was the only guy getting points because he was on the #1 PP unit as well. Then he missed time with a shoulder injury from a cheap shot by Gormley, when he returned he saw 4th line time with Arnold (yes Huska used Arnold as the #4C for much of the season) and BVB/Smith/Riley again getting minimal ice-time and predominantly defensive zone starts. Then he started getting PK time and worked his way into the top 6 when there was injuries, this was the point in the season where he started to put up points and then Shinkaruk and Raymond were added and he went back down to playing in the bottom 6 with no offensive opportunities. At seasons end he was a top penalty killer.

People also really need to stop perpetrating the work of fiction that Klimchuk is slow. It's been disproved every time someone has the audacity to say it. Actually wait, don't stop it just let's us know that you really haven't seen him play.

 

[Major Happy*]

Kulak

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

Still don't get the Klimchuk love. He's never done anything of note in prospect Camps/Penticton or the AHL. He's average at best in terms of skating. He doesn't produce much. He's not physical. He never stands out in any way. Players that don't stand out in junior/AHL don't make the NHL.

I've been saying for 3 years Klimmer was a bad pick and I stand by that statement.

The whole,'he got stuck on a fourth line blah blah defensive zone starts' just means he's not good enough to play higher on a weak offensive AHL team. You gotta earn your minutes something Morgan has yet to do.

I've been made fun of for this opinion I've had on him for years and I fully expect the Klimchuk defenders to do the same thing now. Doubt he gets another NHL contract unless he takes a big jump. Maybe he could? I mean I never thought of Michael Ferland as an NHLer after his first pro season. Then he took a massive jump and it was painfully obvious he was going to be a pro (and he went on and basically won a series for us that same year). Wouldn't count on it though (Ferland's alcoholism and lack of maturity held him back, don't think Klimmer has those kind of problems/room for growth)

 

[MonyontheMoney]

Still don't get the Klimchuk love. He's never done anything of note in prospect Camps/Penticton or the AHL. He's average at best in terms of skating. He doesn't produce much. He's not physical. He never stands out in any way. Players that don't stand out in junior/AHL don't make the NHL.

I've been saying for 3 years Klimmer was a bad pick and I stand by that statement.

The whole,'he got stuck on a fourth line blah blah defensive zone starts' just means he's not good enough to play higher on a weak offensive AHL team. You gotta earn your minutes something Morgan has yet to do.

I've been made fun of for this opinion I've had on him for years and I fully expect the Klimchuk defenders to do the same thing now. Doubt he gets another NHL contract unless he takes a big jump. Maybe he could? I mean I never thought of Michael Ferland as an NHLer after his first pro season. Then he took a massive jump and it was painfully obvious he was going to be a pro (and he went on and basically won a series for us that same year). Wouldn't count on it though (Ferland's alcoholism and lack of maturity held him back, don't think Klimmer has those kind of problems/room for growth)

Seriously, where does this "Klimchuk is a bad/poor/below average skater" narrative come from? Not just you but it seems to be a very common misperception on here. He doesn't produce much? Talk about premature, he was well over a PPG in the WHL, with the exception of his rookie year. After one disappointing statistical - yes and it was only statistically disappointing - professional season on a team that struggled offensively, where his usage was mind-boggling, he suddenly doesn't produce much? He certainly stands out in many ways, should you watch him closely. He was probably the Heat's best defensive forward, but if not he was certainly their best penalty killer up front, but that's not "flashy" so of course he doesn't stand out. Considering the direct translation on HF of "he doesn't stand out" is "he isn't flashy, but still does other things very well that go unnoticed", there certainly have been some unnoticeable junior/AHL guys who have become NHL'ers.

 

[FLAMESFAN]

Seriously, where does this "Klimchuk is a bad/poor/below average skater" narrative come from? Not just you but it seems to be a very common misperception on here. He doesn't produce much? Talk about premature, he was well over a PPG in the WHL, with the exception of his rookie year. After one disappointing statistical - yes and it was only statistically disappointing - professional season on a team that struggled offensively, where his usage was mind-boggling, he suddenly doesn't produce much? He certainly stands out in many ways, should you watch him closely. He was probably the Heat's best defensive forward, but if not he was certainly their best penalty killer up front, but that's not "flashy" so of course he doesn't stand out. Considering the direct translation on HF of "he doesn't stand out" is "he isn't flashy, but still does other things very well that go unnoticed", there certainly have been some unnoticeable junior/AHL guys who have become NHL'ers.

You're just going to have to accept that after the disappointing season Klimchuk had, he'll be lucky to place in the top 10.

 

[Dertell]

He was probably the Heat's best defensive forward, but if not he was certainly their best penalty killer up front, but that's not "flashy" so of course he doesn't stand out.

Ridiculous. Guys like Hamilton and Arnold were all far better defensively than Klimchuk. Agostino and Shore too. Hamilton was a much better PKer too.

He sucked. If the best thing you can say about a forward is that they're ok defensively, there's a problem.

 

[MonyontheMoney]

Ridiculous. Guys like Hamilton and Arnold were all far better defensively than Klimchuk. Agostino and Shore too. Hamilton was a much better PKer too.

He sucked. If the best thing you can say about a forward is that they're ok defensively, there's a problem.

He was certainly right up there, to say they were far better is even more ridiculous.

So now being good defensively is a problem? For **** sakes now I've heard everything, never change HF.

Being good defensively is the furthest thing from a problem.

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

Seriously, where does this "Klimchuk is a bad/poor/below average skater" narrative come from? Not just you but it seems to be a very common misperception on here. He doesn't produce much? Talk about premature, he was well over a PPG in the WHL, with the exception of his rookie year. After one disappointing statistical - yes and it was only statistically disappointing - professional season on a team that struggled offensively, where his usage was mind-boggling, he suddenly doesn't produce much? He certainly stands out in many ways, should you watch him closely. He was probably the Heat's best defensive forward, but if not he was certainly their best penalty killer up front, but that's not "flashy" so of course he doesn't stand out. Considering the direct translation on HF of "he doesn't stand out" is "he isn't flashy, but still does other things very well that go unnoticed", there certainly have been some unnoticeable junior/AHL guys who have become NHL'ers.

He's never produced at the AHL level, or Prospect tourneys, or anytime he's played at a higher level. Producing at the junior level is meaningless to me. I like to see it translate to the pro game. His production never increased really from his draft year. That's a concern. And yes. He's not at all a great skater. I expect little guys to be fast. He is not a burner. He just isn't. He's not Dillon Dube, Brett Kulak, or Brandon Hickey. Those guys are great skaters, explosive. Klimchuk isn't. He's just not that fast. It's a common misconception people that say he is.

Like I've said he could take a jump, but until he does he's not even a top 15 prospect for this organization right now IMO. He just fails the eye-ball test every time I watch him. That's the worst test to fail.

 

[Lunatik]

He was certainly right up there, to say they were far better is even more ridiculous.

So now being good defensively is a problem? For **** sakes now I've heard everything, never change HF.

Being good defensively is the furthest thing from a problem.

it's not even worth replying, some people have this skewed perception of reality and no matter what you say, what you show them or what happens they cannot accept it.

 

[Skobel24]

There is still time for Klimchuk to rebound, but this season is likely a make or break year for him with the Flames franchise.

 

[Anglesmith]

Andrew Mangiapane (33.33%)
Brandon Hickey (37.50%)

 

[Lunatik]

Hickey whenever the poll is up

 

[Anglesmith]

Lol sorry for locking this.

 

[MonyontheMoney]

it's not even worth replying, some people have this skewed perception of reality and no matter what you say, what you show them or what happens they cannot accept it.

Yeah I'm starting to figure that out. Just about everything can be disproven sometimes, yet things don't change. Most of the dislike for Klimchuk seems to be fabricated and untrue.

 

[Lunatik]

Yeah I'm starting to figure that out. Just about everything can be disproven sometimes, yet things don't change. Most of the dislike for Klimchuk seems to be fabricated and untrue.

It's only a couple posters that make things up, it's easier to make them disappear and never worry about it