Eastside Hockey Manager - Part VIII

[Empoleon8771]

I don't know if it's possible, but I feel like it would be really cool to have the ability to start a game in EHM pre-draft. This would be especially good if the idea is to add Seattle to the DB for the 2020-2021 season, my big concern with doing that is how you'd handle free agency and RFAs in that strategy. Somehow getting the game to start on June 1st may be a way around that.

 

[twentyTwenty]

I would love to help out on a task like this, even if it's with you 2020. Honestly! If someone can show me step by step how to do it, especially with how slow my job is, count me in.

I'll have a look at how possible it is going to be to collaborate. My process as been to start top down, so first i went through every country and added/amended every league in that country to proper name, proepr history, if its playable, and reps colours etc then added/removed the teams from the leagues and all rules/strictures as of the 2019 season. So thats all done so what im currently doing is quite literally going down the list of teams as sorted in the editor and updating every single one, affiliations, arenas, histories rivals and also all the players for that team etc once that is done then its just a case of going through the free agents and either removing them if retired or updating them as well.

I was then possibly going to be looking at updating officials and some other minor stuff.
I have a spreadsheet with all leagues ranked and then a CA based on the 5 scouting stars so for example in the NHL for a CA to be 5 stars (it depends on team reps and pa as well as just ca) its usually at least around 150-160 and all players are rated like this and since all leagues follow the same I can set a PA negatvie or otherwise as to how a players career may turn out based on how the other leagues CA is rated This is based from messing around with the CA, PA, league reps and team rep values in game to see how a player is ranked in all the leagues based on the 1-5 stars.

The problem is, and this is why Im unsure as to whether i would want anyone else to play it is that its all based on my personal preferences, down to the way teams are named, the database size, currently its around 39k i think? mine is likely to be around 50-60k purely because every active team has a full roster, I've just finished doing AZ Havirov u20 team where i added nearly 40 players for them. So if people only play in the NHL etc its unlikely to be any better than any other DB

 

[xECK29x]

I'll have a look at how possible it is going to be to collaborate. My process as been to start top down, so first i went through every country and added/amended every league in that country to proper name, proepr history, if its playable, and reps colours etc then added/removed the teams from the leagues and all rules/strictures as of the 2019 season. So thats all done so what im currently doing is quite literally going down the list of teams as sorted in the editor and updating every single one, affiliations, arenas, histories rivals and also all the players for that team etc once that is done then its just a case of going through the free agents and either removing them if retired or updating them as well.

I was then possibly going to be looking at updating officials and some other minor stuff.
I have a spreadsheet with all leagues ranked and then a CA based on the 5 scouting stars so for example in the NHL for a CA to be 5 stars (it depends on team reps and pa as well as just ca) its usually at least around 150-160 and all players are rated like this and since all leagues follow the same I can set a PA negatvie or otherwise as to how a players career may turn out based on how the other leagues CA is rated This is based from messing around with the CA, PA, league reps and team rep values in game to see how a player is ranked in all the leagues based on the 1-5 stars.

The problem is, and this is why Im unsure as to whether i would want anyone else to play it is that its all based on my personal preferences, down to the way teams are named, the database size, currently its around 39k i think? mine is likely to be around 50-60k purely because every active team has a full roster, I've just finished doing AZ Havirov u20 team where i added nearly 40 players for them. So if people only play in the NHL etc its unlikely to be any better than any other DB

Definitely we could benefit from getting some of this work from you, its exactly what we do!

 

[xECK29x]

I don't know if it's possible, but I feel like it would be really cool to have the ability to start a game in EHM pre-draft. This would be especially good if the idea is to add Seattle to the DB for the 2020-2021 season, my big concern with doing that is how you'd handle free agency and RFAs in that strategy. Somehow getting the game to start on June 1st may be a way around that.

Not technically feasible as the game considers "start of season" as July 1st, it's why its the earliest start date you can choose (without crashing). If we add Seattle we will leave it blank and it will be up to the user to set up the team, I don't see us supporting any offline "draft kit" with import spreadsheets or anything, I know BK got hammered with questions about that and I don't think we want to get into that space.

 

[archibalduk]

Yep I'll try and go through them all again and make a list.

Excellent - thank you so much.

There are also inconsistencies with how players are rated, for example Robert Dowd is given a 60CA yet someone like Victor Laz is given a 70CA, Ive watched Laz play recently and he is nowhere as good as Dowd, even if you forget seeing him and just look at each players stats its clear that Laz should not be rated higher than Dowd. But there seems to be no consistency in how players are rated across different leagues.

I completely agree re Dowd vs Laz. We used to have three of us working on the UK leagues but sadly it has been just me for the past two or three summers. I just don't have the time to look at the ratings as re-doing the league structures takes forever (as you'll know, they have changed for every UK league in most of the recent years), sorting out the player career histories and working on the Editor. Ratings generally in the UK leagues need a lot of work given that it has been a few years since these have been looked at (albeit I *think* maybe somebody has looked at ratings for xECK29x for the Pivot Rosters).

With the TBL Rosters, we had a stringent CA/PA ratings system for each league which worked generally quite well but there were issues with players from the likes of the ECHL and AHL who would be overpowered when compared with their EIHL counterparts. The idea was that ideally the range of ratings for a league would be distributed a bit like a bell curve graph, with the average being near a target Average rating. I don't know what the Pivot Rosters guidelines are but I know they are generally similar to how we used to do it with the TBL Rosters.

As xECK29x says, you're more than welcome to help rate the players and I'd be very happy to see somebody pick up the UK work as I really want to continue with my Editor.

But you are not correct, as such, on the NIHL rules, Birbraer is married to a Brit and now has a British passport in addition to his other ones, the same with Roberts and Sun Yin they all have EU passports.

Check here http://www.icehockeyuk.co.uk/wp-con...-Ice-Hockey-UK-GBE-Requirements-2018-19-1.pdf that shows that work permits would only be given to EIHL teams, therefore anyone from a non eu country being signed for a league below that for any compensation would not be given one. Now obviously there would be exceptions to this i.e even if Sun Yin didnt have an EU passport he would probably still be able to play for Lee Valley as he probably isnt being compensated. But to make the game more realistic I do believe that 0 non eu players should be implemented. It would prevent the teams in all the NIHL leagues being filled with canadians with no eu passports as is what currently happens.

Ask this question on THF and im sure they would explain it the same way. If you go through the stats for these teams and look at anyone from outside the EU you will probably find they have a eu 2nd nationality like Philip Edgar, Tyler VanKleef, RJ Berra, Sean Scarborough, Thomas Stuart-Dant etc While Eliteprospects doesnt always list all the players nationalities, like Roberts, it does get 90% of them right.

This isn't strictly true but ultimately I'd have no objection to stopping non-EU imports from playing in the NIHL. It'll just mean that we need to ensure that those who don't have an EU secondary nationality have one added. Ultimately this is for xECK29x to decide but I'm easy either way. As you say, we don't want to see teams filling up with foreigners albeit I could have sworn this can't happen anyway due to the import rules set up for the league (which limit the number of imports on a roster) - but admittedly it isn't something I have checked for a long while, as I don't think I've touched the import rules for years (aside from changing the threshold figures).

Whilst the Home Office guidance published in the IHUK guidance refers to EIHL only, the NIHL Rules of Competition prohibit professional players (being defined in the rules as "A professional player is defined as one where the club is organised in a business-like manner and the athlete is seriously interested in deriving the majority of their annual income from ice hockey or already derives the majority of their income from ice hockey."). Whilst there are some semi-professional players at some teams, many of the NIHL teams are expenses only or pay to play (i.e. the player pays the team to play). So where a player is already in the UK by virtue of an existing work permit, he can play if he isn't receiving a salary without the need to obtain a further work permit (e.g. at a pay to play team).

 

[archibalduk]

The problem is, and this is why Im unsure as to whether i would want anyone else to play it is that its all based on my personal preferences, down to the way teams are named, the database size, currently its around 39k i think? mine is likely to be around 50-60k purely because every active team has a full roster, I've just finished doing AZ Havirov u20 team where i added nearly 40 players for them. So if people only play in the NHL etc its unlikely to be any better than any other DB

IMO if you've put in tonnes of work and the players perform realistically then I'd love to see your work!

Edit: typo

 

[Kranix]

Not technically feasible as the game considers "start of season" as July 1st, it's why its the earliest start date you can choose (without crashing). If we add Seattle we will leave it blank and it will be up to the user to set up the team, I don't see us supporting any offline "draft kit" with import spreadsheets or anything, I know BK got hammered with questions about that and I don't think we want to get into that space.

Ahgh I was just thinking I wonder if there's a way to orchestrate the 24 team play-off they might do this year, but the July 1 start date answers that...
Although you could change the tournament in pre-game if at all, and have it start at the normal playoff time, but it would be set in stone for the duration of your game.

 

[Beef Cake]

We call it “re-rates”..

Each year as TBL/xECK drop their DB file ... we take the players with thier updated real life ratings and yep, manually move each asset to their current team in our league and generate an updated league file to begin each season...

So each NHL/AHL player is rated annually by an independent third party (TBL/ECK) in our league..

The players’ growth in the SIM means nothing beyond the present season... because of the annual re-rates... one day in real life equals one day in the SIM...

We have daily calculated salary cap exactly matching the NHL’s (which we manage outside of the SIM yet fully enforce).. hell we even have a podcast...

Why? What league are you playing in that doesn’t have this stuff??

So you need the DB structure to be exactly like it will be in 2020-2021? Even if the season is condensed?

 

[WeThreeKings]

Another thing I hope gets fixed in 1.5 --

AGMs putting your injured players on IR during the play-offs, especially 1 week injuries.

1. It's the play-offs, unless they are truly incapacitated, the player will play.
2. There's no cap implications, so it's pointless to do so.

Tired of getting screwed in online play-offs because my best players at 90% injury but on IR for 7 days.

 

[xECK29x]

Another thing I hope gets fixed in 1.5 --

AGMs putting your injured players on IR during the play-offs, especially 1 week injuries.

1. It's the play-offs, unless they are truly incapacitated, the player will play.
2. There's no cap implications, so it's pointless to do so.

Tired of getting screwed in online play-offs because my best players at 90% injury but on IR for 7 days.

If you have a save where this happened we can send it to Riz

 

[WeThreeKings]

If you have a save where this happened we can send it to Riz

It happens in online leagues where you are simming with teams on vacation. I might be able to get the file.

 

[xECK29x]

It happens in online leagues where you are simming with teams on vacation. I might be able to get the file.

Understood, but the only way we can get stuff fixed is with save files being sent to SI games with a description of the issue to debug what happened.

 

[alko]

Question about 1.5 Patch.

Some time ago i posted on SI Message Board (also with saved game) problem with staff people in the game. They somehow disappeared from the game, so my franchise could hire any new ones and the game was almost unplayable any more.
But cant see that in the Fix List mentioned. Is this included in patch?

 

[xECK29x]

Question about 1.5 Patch.

Some time ago i posted on SI Message Board (also with saved game) problem with staff people in the game. They somehow disappeared from the game, so my franchise could hire any new ones and the game was almost unplayable any more.
But cant see that in the Fix List mentioned. Is this included in patch?

We can ask...but do you even have the original database from that save (and the save itself still as the post is over 2 years old)? I mean you are in 2148, I would imagine the game can get really buggy with a save database that large.

 

[alko]

We can ask...but do you even have the original database from that save (and the save itself still as the post is over 2 years old)? I mean you are in 2148, I would imagine the game can get really buggy with a save database that large.

Game save was on FTP uploaded. I could find also the DB, when it is a must.

 

[xECK29x]

Game save was on FTP uploaded. I could find also the DB, when it is a must.

Right, but I'm not sure its still there, do you still have it? That FTP system doesn't exist anymore.

 

[alko]

Right, but I'm not sure its still there, do you still have it? That FTP system doesn't exist anymore.

Im surprised, but i found them. Can i upload them somewhere?

 

[xECK29x]

Im surprised, but i found them. Can i upload them somewhere?

Yes will send you a PM

 

[Treb]

Detroit is pretty fun to build draft only. They pretty much only have Larkin, Mantha, Zadina, Hronek, Cholowski, Seider and Bertuzzi that are NHLer for the medium/long term. Took me until 2029 to get a decent enough goalie through the draft though as I didn't draft Askarov and a few other goalies that ended up as starters.

 

[bashbros32]

Detroit is pretty fun to build draft only. They pretty much only have Larkin, Mantha, Zadina, Hronek, Cholowski, Seider and Bertuzzi that are NHLer for the medium/long term. Took me until 2029 to get a decent enough goalie through the draft though as I didn't draft Askarov and a few other goalies that ended up as starters.

Ottawa is in a similar state with I think 9 players you don't draft yourself being good enough quality to play NHL games.

I'm in 2028 I think and while I have 2 great goalies (Mads Sogaard pre game and Tristan Lennox) I have had an AWFUL time with centers.

Up until this season I could not get a center to post an average rating above like 6.7. Even centers with high faceoffs (16+)

Here is an example:
this player also had 183 hits
26 giveaways with 87 takeaways
73 blocked shots
.48 Face off Percentage

he also finished 3rd! in Selke voting.

6.67 AVR

 

[Treb]

Ottawa is in a similar state with I think 9 players you don't draft yourself being good enough quality to play NHL games.

I'm in 2028 I think and while I have 2 great goalies (Mads Sogaard pre game and Tristan Lennox) I have had an AWFUL time with centers.

Up until this season I could not get a center to post an average rating above like 6.7. Even centers with high faceoffs (16+)

Here is an example:
this player also had 183 hits
26 giveaways with 87 takeaways
73 blocked shots
.48 Face off Percentage

he also finished 3rd! in Selke voting.

6.67 AVR

You missed on Chibrikov in 2021, pretty lethal C even if he is 5'9.

I might be in trouble when Larkin decline though as I don't think I have a blue chip C prospect (Chibrikov is still young, but I will need a 2nd C). Wings are fine for a while (Lafreniere and Zadina still have 5+ years and I have a 24 years old top RW) and D is stacked (traded Hronek as he was getting passed by cheaper options). My goalies are 22 and 25 so that should be good as well (and I have 2 more prospects that are decent as well).

 

[Empoleon8771]

I started up a 1998 game playing as the Jets (who are 1 of 3 teams who only have generated players), and man, I forgot how easy it is to game some of these databases. If you find a player who dislikes the club they're on, you can get them for pennies on the dollar. I got Daigle (disliked Philly) and Boucher from Philly for an auto-gen goalie and an auto-gen LWer, flipped Daigle to Vancouver for Mogilny (disliked Vancouver) and then flipped Mogilny to the NYI for Luongo, Berard (disliked NYI) and a late 1st. I also flipped Boucher to Pittsburgh for a 1st and 3rd, and the 1st ended up 8th overall which I traded for Alex Tanguay (who had a 192 PA). I also acquired Anson Carter (disliked Boston), Brunnette (disliked Nashville), Primeau (disliked Carolina), Poti (disliked Edmonton) and Nylander (disliked Calgary) for auto-gen players, and nearly acquired Savard (disliked NYR) before he was traded in another deal to Montreal. I still like the DB, and you can also argue that gaming the system like that is fair considering how bad the auto-gen teams are, but it feels kinda icky to do that especially when you can get Rafalski, Visnovsky and Thomas in free agency.

I feel like the recent TBL and ECK rosters don't have that issue, you can acquire players for cheaper that way but it's not broken. I can get Puljujarvi for a 2nd and an okay prospect from Edmonton, but I don't think that's as ridiculous as "turn 2 auto-gen players into Luongo, Berard, Tanguay and a 1st"

 

[Treb]

I started up a 1998 game playing as the Jets (who are 1 of 3 teams who only have generated players), and man, I forgot how easy it is to game some of these databases. If you find a player who dislikes the club they're on, you can get them for pennies on the dollar. I got Daigle (disliked Philly) and Boucher from Philly for an auto-gen goalie and an auto-gen LWer, flipped Daigle to Vancouver for Mogilny (disliked Vancouver) and then flipped Mogilny to the NYI for Luongo, Berard (disliked NYI) and a late 1st. I also flipped Boucher to Pittsburgh for a 1st and 3rd, and the 1st ended up 8th overall which I traded for Alex Tanguay (who had a 192 PA). I also acquired Anson Carter (disliked Boston), Brunnette (disliked Nashville), Primeau (disliked Carolina), Poti (disliked Edmonton) and Nylander (disliked Calgary) for auto-gen players, and nearly acquired Savard (disliked NYR) before he was traded in another deal to Montreal. I still like the DB, and you can also argue that gaming the system like that is fair considering how bad the auto-gen teams are, but it feels kinda icky to do that especially when you can get Rafalski, Visnovsky and Thomas in free agency.

I feel like the recent TBL and ECK rosters don't have that issue, you can acquire players for cheaper that way but it's not broken. I can get Puljujarvi for a 2nd and an okay prospect from Edmonton, but I don't think that's as ridiculous as "turn 2 auto-gen players into Luongo, Berard, Tanguay and a 1st"

Problem with retro database is that you have the power of hindsight so you instinctively go for successful NHLer.

In ECK DB, Puljujarvi is very meh as far as I have seen in my games, but yes picks are pretty easy to get for bad prospects. If you want to, you can bulk 2-3 of those bad prospects you wouldn't sign and get a 2nd or even a 1st, especially at game start.

Even if you only get 3rd and 4th, it's pretty easy to pile them up and then trade up to 2nd or 1st at the draft. What I do is trade every one that cannot garner a 2nd or 1st for RFA that I then release. I call this the RFA freeing initiative. Few of them ever sign back with NHL teams, but it facilitates them having their Europe career as they are not waiting for their NHL team offer.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Problem with retro database is that you have the power of hindsight so you instinctively go for successful NHLer.

In ECK DB, Puljujarvi is very meh as far as I have seen in my games, but yes picks are pretty easy to get for bad prospects. If you want to, you can bulk 2-3 of those bad prospects you wouldn't sign and get a 2nd or even a 1st, especially at game start.

Even if you only get 3rd and 4th, it's pretty easy to pile them up and then trade up to 2nd or 1st at the draft. What I do is trade every one that cannot garner a 2nd or 1st for RFA that I then release. I call this the RFA freeing initiative. Few of them ever sign back with NHL teams, but it facilitates them having their Europe career as they are not waiting for their NHL team offer.

I don't actually have a big issue with this when it comes to the 1998 DB. I just did the 1999 NHL draft and it wasn't just a repeat of history, I think the Sedins (2nd and 3rd overall) and Heatley (5th overall) had lower PAs than Stefan (1st overall), Connolly (8th overall) and Saprykin (10th overall). I actually had to bump the Sedin's PA up a little bit, I think Henrik was only at 151 PA which is just way too low and not realistic. At least at the top of the draft, it's not always the same every time around.

It does help in the later rounds in the draft, because you can get 20-22 year old forwards and defensemen out of Europe that are near NHL ready and have fringe 2nd/3rd pair upside with 4th through and 7th rounders. I think I took Zidlicky, Lydman, Fedotenko and Berg in my draft with 4 consecutive picks, and I missed out on some better players (Andrew Ference being the big one, 4th round pick with a 110 CA and 160 PA at the draft). That plus how much power forwards group are 2 things I noticed in that DB when it comes to drafts. Johan Franzen was ranked as a late 2nd rounder in the 1999 draft and I got him in the 7th round, he has a PA in the upper 150s. Joel Ward was rated as a late 1st rounder and I got him late in the 3rd round, he's around the same PA as Franzen.

On Puljujarvi, he's actually been amazing in the saves I've looked at recently. A lot of my -15 prospects have been hits in recent games. I edited the DB to show the Melnichuk signing in San Jose and gave him a -15 PA, I think the 3 games I checked had him at 185, 180 and 165 PA.

 

[Treb]

I don't actually have a big issue with this when it comes to the 1998 DB. I just did the 1999 NHL draft and it wasn't just a repeat of history, I think the Sedins (2nd and 3rd overall) and Heatley (5th overall) had lower PAs than Stefan (1st overall), Connolly (8th overall) and Saprykin (10th overall). I actually had to bump the Sedin's PA up a little bit, I think Henrik was only at 151 PA which is just way too low and not realistic. At least at the top of the draft, it's not always the same every time around.

It does help in the later rounds in the draft, because you can get 20-22 year old forwards and defensemen out of Europe that are near NHL ready and have fringe 2nd/3rd pair upside with 4th through and 7th rounders. I think I took Zidlicky, Lydman, Fedotenko and Berg in my draft with 4 consecutive picks, and I missed out on some better players (Andrew Ference being the big one, 4th round pick with a 110 CA and 160 PA at the draft). That plus how much power forwards group are 2 things I noticed in that DB when it comes to drafts. Johan Franzen was ranked as a late 2nd rounder in the 1999 draft and I got him in the 7th round, he has a PA in the upper 150s. Joel Ward was rated as a late 1st rounder and I got him late in the 3rd round, he's around the same PA as Franzen.

On Puljujarvi, he's actually been amazing in the saves I've looked at recently. A lot of my -15 prospects have been hits in recent games. I edited the DB to show the Melnichuk signing in San Jose and gave him a -15 PA, I think the 3 games I checked had him at 185, 180 and 165 PA.

Never seen him being NHL worthy in the last two ECK DB in 5+ games.