Proposal: Dumba to DET

[Pavels Dog]

Larkin is the only piece that would make us better going forward. Lmao at sheehan

Should we expect the Wild to cruise to the cup next season or something? What did I miss? From what I can see, Nyquist/Tatar would immediately be basically your 2nd best winger after Parise. I'm sure Mrazek wouldn't help either.

 

[rynryn]

Certain he wasn't suggesting a trade around Dums for Larkin, just subtly implying he sees no impactful trades with Detroit whatsoever.

For what it's worth I'd rather just lose a D in expansion for nothing rather than trade two of them for anything other than first line talent. I'd like the best chance to succeed this year.

 

[taylorjonl]

But have to be cap compliant BEFORE LTIR is applied. You would have to send players down until you are cap compliant then submit your rosters then send injured players to LTIR. Assuming you weren't $5M over cap this could involve no waivers but what if Fransen returns? How do you get under cap?

Franzen is never coming off LTIR, the doctors will never allow it. Last season he came back for a few games, then he had to sit in a dark room for weeks and would have concussion symptoms when he played with his kids.

 

[obey86]

But have to be cap compliant BEFORE LTIR is applied. You would have to send players down until you are cap compliant then submit your rosters then send injured players to LTIR. Assuming you weren't $5M over cap this could involve no waivers but what if Fransen returns? How do you get under cap?

No you don't. On the last day of training camp you can place someone on LTIR. Here's a scenario regarding Chris Pronger:http://thehockeyguys.net/timing-is-everything-maximizing-ltir-benefits/

There are two pieces of information that need to be understood before I discuss these two scenarios. The first is that the Flyers currently sit $2,053,522 over the upper limit of the salary cap. The second is that every team must be within the $64.3 million upper limit of the salary cap by last day of the off-season (excluding performance bonuses). That day is the last day of training camp.

On the last day of training camp, the Flyers have a cap payroll of $66,353,522 (excluding performance bonuses). Chris Pronger is placed on LTIR. By doing so, the Flyers will be deemed to have already replaced him and will not be eligible for further relief. This is because the team’s cap payroll exceeded the upper limit. If Pronger stays on LTIR all season, the cap payroll of the Flyers may not exceed $66,353,522.

In layman’s terms, by embarking upon this scenario the Flyers will effectively only be able to exceed the salary cap by $2,053,522 under Chris Pronger’s LTIR exemption.

^As you can read, the salary cap is 64.3M. With Pronger on the books, the Flyers are at 66.4M in the offseason. On the last day of training camp they are allowed to put him on LTIR, to become cap compliant. The way you describe (being cap compliant before putting someone on LTIR) would give the team more cap relief than the scenario above, but it is not required.)



And Franzen won't be returning. His playing career is over and I would imagine everyone within the Red Wings organization knows that.

 

[McOvechking]

As a neutral fan I find this thread hilarious and confusing. Larkin is Detroit's most untradeable asset. And his name is being brought up for a RHD PPQB?

Mantha for Dumba straight across seems like fair value to me. Dumba hasn't proven nearly enough and doesn't even have a contract right now.

 

[AKL]

Certain he wasn't suggesting a trade around Dums for Larkin, just subtly implying he sees no impactful trades with Detroit whatsoever.

For what it's worth I'd rather just lose a D in expansion for nothing rather than trade two of them for anything other than first line talent. I'd like the best chance to succeed this year.

Yeah I don't understand why people think trading one of our defensemen will save us when the draft comes around. We're still losing one for nothing, the only difference is if we don't make a trade, we have 4 top-4 guys, and if we do make a trade, we'll have 3 top-4 guys.

 

[rynryn]

As a neutral fan I find this thread hilarious and confusing. Larkin is Detroit's most untradeable asset. And his name is being brought up for a RHD PPQB?

Mantha for Dumba straight across seems like fair value to me. Dumba hasn't proven nearly enough and doesn't even have a contract right now.

i don't know man. compare his numbers to kronwalls and tell me he wouldn't hold more value to you than what you suggest. especially the points per TOI.

edit: i mean to Detroit.

 

[obey86]

i don't know man. compare his numbers to kronwalls and tell me he wouldn't hold more value to you than what you suggest. especially the points per TOI.

Kronwall was terrible last year FWIW.

 

[Ezekial]

If a piece like Nyqvist goes then yes that could work. I wouldn't have thought Detroit would be ok with that but you never know.

I mean I wouldn't, just threw it in there for cap purposes if Detroit needed to make it work, I don't think the Wings do it at all because of Ken Holland. But, I also don't think he's going to trade for any D this offseason due to the price.

He needs to make a move and take a risk, Dumba is young, right-handed, and the type of player we lack.

You can't look at the Wings D-Core and think that it is going to get you anywhere.

 

[rynryn]

Kronwall was terrible last year FWIW.

yes i know, and Dumba is really young and in ascendance. he is a top 10 pick and has all the potential that comes with his draft position. He's showing it.

 

[Al Lagoon]

Sheahen? Doesn't even start a conversation. Mantha+ or Svechnikov+ would be the starting points as Larkin is most understandably off limits.

Most reasonable post in the thread.

 

[nickschultzfan]

As a neutral fan I find this thread hilarious and confusing. Larkin is Detroit's most untradeable asset. And his name is being brought up for a RHD PPQB?

Mantha for Dumba straight across seems like fair value to me. Dumba hasn't proven nearly enough and doesn't even have a contract right now.

You are not neutral if you think the Wild would trade Dumba for Mantha. Not even close.

 

[AKL]

Kronwall was terrible last year FWIW.

FWIW, Kronwall is 35 and probably isn't getting any better.

 

[AKL]

Dumba is worth more than Mantha and Svechikov, but not quite as much as Larkin.
Tatar and Nyquist would certainly help our team be better, but if we are trading a young player with as much promise as Dumba has and has shown, it should be for a player like Larkin. Otherwise, we're better off keeping Dumba.

It's that simple.

 

[NotYou]

Should we expect the Wild to cruise to the cup next season or something? What did I miss? From what I can see, Nyquist/Tatar would immediately be basically your 2nd best winger after Parise. I'm sure Mrazek wouldn't help either.

That's great and all but it's not worth trading the only guy in the organization that has elite potential. Adding a winger who is slightly better than the second tier guys we have doesn't solve our problem. Dumba might.

As a neutral fan I find this thread hilarious and confusing. Larkin is Detroit's most untradeable asset. And his name is being brought up for a RHD PPQB?

Mantha for Dumba straight across seems like fair value to me. Dumba hasn't proven nearly enough and doesn't even have a contract right now.

It's confusing because you aren't understanding it. There's been two suggestions in here for a Larkin trade. One that was semi serious and another that was just bad. The point is that nothing else from Detroit intrests us. I do not care about value. I care that the trade gets the team closer to winning a cup. Mantha for dumba doesn't

 

[Mancini79]

I'm going to throw this out:

Dumba
Scandella
Haula
Zucker

for

Larkin
Nyquist/Tatar
D prospect

Detroit gets an entirely rebuild blueline with high upside and a young center and winger with offensive upside that would blossom in Detroit.

Wild get a young center with 1st line potential and more polished winger to play with Granlund and Koivu.

Awesome, I'd do it in a heartbeat. Not happening though.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

Sheahen? Doesn't even start a conversation. Mantha+ or Svechnikov+ would be the starting points as Larkin is most understandably off limits.

Svechnikov + 2nd and sproul?

 

[TaLoN]

yes i know, and Dumba is really young and in ascendance. he is a top 10 pick and has all the potential that comes with his draft position. He's showing it.

Which is why we shouldn't be trading him to begin with.

If we HAVE to trade one, I'd rather it be Brodin or Scandella.

 

[gwh]

Svechnikov + 2nd and sproul?

So bag of spares for a player?

Folin for Svechnikov. Or Tuch for Svechnikov. Spares for spares.

 

[Mister Ed]

Detroit needs more D, not necessarily RHD. If Brodin or Dumba is available, I would check both out. And for the right deal, anybody outside of Larkin is available.

 

[nickschultzfan]

Detroit needs more D, not necessarily RHD. If Brodin or Dumba is available, I would check both out. And for the right deal, anybody outside of Larkin is available.

Here is the thing, Wild are looking for very specific pieces, a young NHL center with 1st line upside or a young already established 1st line RW, and they won't trade a Dman otherwise.

Look at Hall for Larsson for the market for a high end young Dman. (Wild just didn't need LWs).

That's why I offered Dumba AND Scandella for Larkin (with Haula and Zucker for Nyquist/Tatar+D prospect for roster consistency).

That's two high end young Dmen who could make a top pairing for the Wings for a decade. For Larkin, who is admittedly at sky high value, but has not yet established himself as a 1st line NHL player.

 

[Mister Ed]

Here is the thing, Wild are looking for very specific pieces, a young NHL center with 1st line upside or a young already established 1st line RW, and they won't trade a Dman otherwise.

Look at Hall for Larsson for the market for a high end young Dman. (Wild just didn't need LWs).

That's why I offered Dumba AND Scandella for Larkin (with Haula and Zucker for Nyquist/Tatar+D prospect for roster consistency).

That's two high end young Dmen who could make a top pairing for the Wings for a decade. For Larkin, who is admittedly at sky high value, but has not yet established himself as a 1st line NHL player.

As much as it seems to be a decent valued trade, trading Larkin, the Red Wings' only true #1C prospect, plugs a hole and leave an even bigger one at C. There doesn't seem to be a fit for a trade here, which disappoints me, Dumba looks like a solid player.

 

[57special]

Here is the thing, Wild are looking for very specific pieces, a young NHL center with 1st line upside or a young already established 1st line RW, and they won't trade a Dman otherwise.

Look at Hall for Larsson for the market for a high end young Dman. (Wild just didn't need LWs).

That's why I offered Dumba AND Scandella for Larkin (with Haula and Zucker for Nyquist/Tatar+D prospect for roster consistency).

That's two high end young Dmen who could make a top pairing for the Wings for a decade. For Larkin, who is admittedly at sky high value, but has not yet established himself as a 1st line NHL player.

That's really fair offer.

As much as it seems to be a decent valued trade, trading Larkin, the Red Wings' only true #1C prospect, plugs a hole and leave an even bigger one at C. There doesn't seem to be a fit for a trade here, which disappoints me, Dumba looks like a solid player.

Totally get that you don't want to trade Larkin. Only way it makes sense is if you had a another high end C.

 

[BinCookin]

That's really fair offer.



Totally get that you don't want to trade Larkin. Only way it makes sense is if you had a another high end C.

True. That offer is legit.

Don't think I as a Red Wings Fan could entertain trading Larkin. If we can't get Dumba with our other assets, I would surrender the "its not happening" stance. Trouble is Minn is strong with wingers. That is our main surplus. Its why aiming at Anaheim for a trade is much more likely than minnesota. We don't have much C depth (blue chip talent).

 

[gwh]

Strong with wingers?

We have 1 mid six RW and a over the hill vet... Tuch is pretty much guaranteed a roster spot in top6, ready or not.