Proposal: Ducks - Devils

[DaDucks*]

Let's just trade him for the first crap deal that comes our way amirite?

Ok, but let's cry first, before we decide what the return is.

 

[Arthuros]

Can we please stop trying to keep Fowler on the team...

Is this your next form, where you argue that Despres is worth keeping over Fowler?

 

[DaDucks*]

Is this your next form, where you argue that Despres is worth keeping over Fowler?

I would keep 5 million in wet, used socks over Fowler... At least the socks have some masculinity,

 

[WhatTheDuck]

For a team that was starving offense, their top offensive prospect did what?

Did he force the Devil's to make a choice?

Boucher put up a half point per game in the NHL, and over a half goal per game in the AHL, which is a pretty good showing. No he didn't set the world on fire, he's still a pretty good prospect. I'm all for the optimism that Despres could fetch more right now but it's debatable for sure . I'd say Zacha is their top offensive prospect btw.

The Devils would be taking the same risks by moving Boucher. That doesn't balance the real risks of taking on a speculative deal that compounded those inherent risks in the signing with injury risks right after the signing - that to date, the player in question has shown no signs of overcoming.

That risk goes with moving any young player with potential. I would say that given the career trajectory of most offensive forward prospects, moving Boucher right now would be selling high. His production dipped in his second pro year before rebounding this past season. At 23 he's in that window where a young winger needs to take a hold of a full-time contributing role in order to maintain value. The trade today leaves the Devils with two proven veterans who would seem to fill the scoring roles at Boucher's natural position, and there's zero doubt "good Despres" fills a much bigger need for them right now. They sell high on a young forward who is now a bit blocked to buy low on a guy who could potentially fill a huge hole.

I won't disagree about Despres failing to recapture form thus far, but I still think there is remaining upside there, more so than a true cap dump.

 

[Exit Dose]

Both sides take on risk at the cost of addressing a major need. I understand your point, but I think heusy has presented a solid justification as to why NJ would consider such a deal. IMO, it's certainly a proposal within the realms of possibility.

Good job heusy.

Both sides aren't taking on the same amount of risk.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Both sides aren't taking on the same amount of risk.

There are varying risk/reward ratios for both sides in every deal. I won't disagree the Devils take more risk here, the upside of the deal also fits a much greater need for them in my opinion.

Both sides take on risk at the cost of addressing a major need. I understand your point, but I think heusy has presented a solid justification as to why NJ would consider such a deal. IMO, it's certainly a proposal within the realms of possibility.

Good job heusy.

Thanks!

 

[HanSolo]

Ok, but let's cry first, before we decide what the return is.

I would keep 5 million in wet, used socks over Fowler... At least the socks have some masculinity,

I can see where continued discussion on this is gonna land, thanks for clearing that up.

 

[DaDucks*]

I can see where continued discussion on this is gonna land, thanks for clearing that up.

It's going to land with Fowler being traded.... Not Despres.


Thx for playin

 

[Exit Dose]

That risk goes with moving any young player with potential. I would say that given the career trajectory of most offensive forward prospects, moving Boucher right now would be selling high. His production dipped in his second pro year before rebounding this past season. At 23 he's in that window where a young winger needs to take a hold of a full-time contributing role in order to maintain value. The trade today leaves the Devils with two proven veterans who would seem to fill the scoring roles at Boucher's natural position, and there's zero doubt "good Despres" fills a much bigger need for them right now. They sell high on a young forward who is now a bit blocked to buy low on a guy who could potentially fill a huge hole.

I won't disagree about Despres failing to recapture form thus far, but I still think there is remaining upside there, more so than a true cap dump.

At no point have I argued that he's a cap dump, though his cap and salary are facets of evaluating his current worth. You're forgetting just how short-lived his stint as 'good Despres' was. When we signed him at 4 million per, it was based on speculation that he'd be able to keep improving. So, what's motivating Jersey to make this trade right now? Even at his best with us, he wouldn't correct New Jersey's problems, and where we left off, he only adds to them.

 

[Arthuros]

It's going to land with Fowler being traded.... Not Despres.


Thx for playin

Would you also happen to think Etem was the next Crosby?

 

[HanSolo]

Would you also happen to think Etem was the next Crosby?

DaDucks may be something or other but he's definitely not DucksGo

It's going to land with Fowler being traded.... Not Despres.


Thx for playin

That's fine. I've accepted the possibility of Fowler getting traded. Could it be for...you know, NOT garbage?

 

[DaDucks*]

Would you also happen to think Etem was the next Crosby?

Much like the majority of our forward prospects, (worst in the league,) I never bought into the Etem hype... You should try reading some of my training camp posts, since I'm there every year...

 

[Exit Dose]

There are varying risk/reward ratios for both sides in every deal. I won't disagree the Devils take more risk here, the upside of the deal also fits a much greater need for them in my opinion.

This isn't true. Both sides don't take on perfectly equal risk, as that's just not possible without a crystal ball, but those risks are nearly always built to be near parity with the perceived risks of the time they were made; outside of the incompetent GM's that occasionally spring up. Finding a few fellow Ducks fans to high-five you for a deal that favors the Ducks doesn't change that anyone from an outside perspective and well appraised of the situations is going to notice the clear discrepancy.

 

[DaDucks*]

DaDucks may be something or other but he's definitely not DucksGo


That's fine. I've accepted the possibility of Fowler getting traded. Could it be for...you know, NOT garbage?

Sure!!! As long as he's off the team, that works for me...

 

[Arthuros]

Sure!!! As long as he's off the team, that works for me...

I was so very certain you'd reply back with something along the lines of "Fowler's garbage, he's worth garbage, so he should get garbage".

 

[DaDucks*]

I was so very certain you'd reply back with something along the lines of "Fowler's garbage, he's worth garbage, so he should get garbage".

And how would you counter that? Would you tell me about his pretty skating, and outlet passes that don't lead to anything?


Looks like spider caught himself a fly

 

[WhatTheDuck]

At no point have I argued that he's a cap dump, though his cap and salary are facets of evaluating his current worth. You're forgetting just how short-lived his stint as 'good Despres' was. When we signed him at 4 million per, it was based on speculation that he'd be able to keep improving. So, what's motivating Jersey to make this trade right now? Even at his best with us, he wouldn't correct New Jersey's problems, and where we left off, he only adds to them.

I think I've laid out my reasoning why Despres makes sense for New Jersey. The issue here is that we don't quite agree on just how low a buy low price would be, which is fine. Maybe I'm just optimistic that today proved teams who need top 4 blueline help will be the ones taking the bigger risks in this market.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

This isn't true. Both sides don't take on perfectly equal risk, as that's just not possible without a crystal ball, but those risks are nearly always built to be near parity with the perceived risks of the time they were made; outside of the incompetent GM's that occasionally spring up. Finding a few fellow Ducks fans to high-five you for a deal that favors the Ducks doesn't change that anyone from an outside perspective and well appraised of the situations is going to notice the clear discrepancy.

I wasn't trying to make any sort of point or suggesting any extra validity by responding to both you and mytduxfan in the same post if that's what you took from it, was honestly just making use of the multi quote feature. I'd love to hear more outside perspectives but unfortunately it seems to mostly be Ducks fans hanging around.

 

[Exit Dose]

I think I've laid out my reasoning why Despres makes sense for New Jersey. The issue here is that we don't quite agree on just how low a buy low price would be, which is fine. Maybe I'm just optimistic that today proved teams who need top 4 blueline help will be the ones taking the bigger risks in this market.

But you're not selling them a top 4 blueliner. You're selling them someone that they would hope would be a top 4 blueliner when development and recuperation finish. He briefly played that role as a compliment to Fowler.

It's more than a buy low price that's at issue. They're a salary team like us, unless there's been a drastic change to Jersey's financial situation in the last few months, and that means that every dollar has to count. The rationale here is not unlike how other teams fans would mistakenly look at us when they saw how much cap space we had during the previous years and assumed that they could just dump whatever contract was inconvenient to them at that time.

Edit: I'd just like to add that I don't think that your proposal(s) are thoughtless, but that in this case there are subtle factors at work that are being glossed over.

 

[Exit Dose]

I wasn't trying to make any sort of point or suggesting any extra validity by responding to both you and mytduxfan in the same post if that's what you took from it, was honestly just making use of the multi quote feature. I'd love to hear more outside perspectives but unfortunately it seems to mostly be Ducks fans hanging around.

I imagine they're all busy with the Hall thread.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

But you're not selling them a top 4 blueliner. You're selling them someone that they would hope would be a top 4 blueliner when development and recuperation finish. He briefly played that role as a compliment to Fowler.

It's more than a buy low price that's at issue. They're a salary team like us, unless there's been a drastic change to Jersey's financial situation in the last few months, and that means that every dollar has to count. The rationale here is not unlike how other teams fans would mistakenly look at us when they saw how much cap space we had during the previous years and assumed that they could just dump whatever contract was inconvenient to them at that time.

Edit: I'd just like to add that I don't think that your proposal(s) are thoughtless, but that in this case there are subtle factors at work that are being glossed over.

I agree that the Devils won't be eating salary for the sake of helping anyone else (I'd be offering Bieksa if that were the case), but like I said I do think there's a degree of upside here for them at a position of great need.

I imagine they're all busy with the Hall thread.

Haha yeah I don't blame them for having their attention focused elsewhere right now.

 

[DeVols]

But you're not selling them a top 4 blueliner. You're selling them someone that they would hope would be a top 4 blueliner when development and recuperation finish. He briefly played that role as a compliment to Fowler.

It's more than a buy low price that's at issue. They're a salary team like us, unless there's been a drastic change to Jersey's financial situation in the last few months, and that means that every dollar has to count. The rationale here is not unlike how other teams fans would mistakenly look at us when they saw how much cap space we had during the previous years and assumed that they could just dump whatever contract was inconvenient to them at that time.

Edit: I'd just like to add that I don't think that your proposal(s) are thoughtless, but that in this case there are subtle factors at work that are being glossed over.

Just as an FYI - we're really not. Our owners have said they are willing to spend to the cap ceiling. Shero started a youth movement where we've gone from one of the oldest teams in the league to one of the youngest. We are building from within and thus, do not have any huge contracts - yet.

As to the thread, obviously Fowler would be the piece the Devils would be looking at to help shore up our defense. I'm just not sure we have the expendable assets that the Ducks would want to acquire him.

 

[xxreact9]

As I said in another thread, it's like if we got Galchenyuk for Fowler.

Somehow that's still a lot closer.

The larsson for hall will never be justified, one of the worst trades in league history by a mile.

 

[Getzmonster]

I'd be down for this one, heusy's proposals are always solid, nice job.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Thought I would give this a bump. Seems as though the the Devils could still use a Dman to slot in their top 4, and the Ducks definitely could use a young NHL ready forward with scoring upside.

Yesterday myself and Zippy came to an agreement on this deal, how do the rest of you feel about it?

To NJD - D Simon Despres

To ANA - LW Reid Boucher, conditional 2018 3rd (becomes a 2nd if Despres plays 140+ games over two seasons)