Rumor: DUCHENE THREAD: Garrioch: Sens "aggressively" pursuing Duchene

[StayAtHomeAv]

you have 10 mil in cap space with several 3 million dollar useless players off the books in 2 years and varly 6M off the books in 2 years and for now Duchene leaving would cancel out Phaneuf. You arent blocking spots for younger options though what LHD do the avs have in their prospect pool that project to be 20 min a game all purpose players in the next 2 years? Phaneuf brings consistency/leadership/stability, which makes the team system better, which makes everyone play on the same page and gives their top end talent a chance to make things happen. It sucks that fans would rather see 56 points and a chance at the lotto rather than watch their team hunt down a wild card spot. its not even about Phaneuf, look im not saying i like Phaneuf but hes better than mark Barberio and if you can get sick prospects and an additional pick for taking him on then i hate the idea that Phaneuf makes the team slightly better and by doing that makes the team worse thats just silly......i feel like it goes without saying that Phaneuf would add negative value to the trade from OTT side but they would compensate by adding a piece to the trade

Unfortuntely, sucking and getting very high picks is the best way to build a cup team. You need superstars, and those guys are rarely traded or hit free agency. I don't just want a mediocre team who fights for the playoffs. I want a team that is in the playoffs constantly and one with the talent to compete for cups.

With the position we are in it makes the most sense to just suck again for 1 more year, draft the best LHD we can, and then start making a push for the playoffs next year after we have stocked our roster with high potential players at every position.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

I would assume this is Botterill doing his due dilligence. With the cap structure involved, it would take moving out one of Evander Kane, Matt Moulson, or Zach Bogosian to make this happen. Not to mention, I just don't see it being that great a fit. He's a fantastic talent coming off a down season. So unless it's at a less than steep cost, I doubt Buffalo would be involved at the finishing line.

There were some other guys on the ice that they might have been scouting. There's no reason to assume that everyone must be looking at Duchene, and no one else. Maybe Buffalo is looking for potentially free veteran depth and wanted to see Umberger in a game. He is a former 5 time 20 goal scorer, even if it's highly unlikely he's anywhere close to the same player after that hit.

 

[trentmccleary]

What's going on with Columbus? They would seem to be the ideal trade partner for this situation.

 

[tucker3434]

See, this is more what I'm getting at. I'm not suggesting Phaneuf has value in some Duchene trade.

I'm asking why, assuming he was on waivers or something. The Avs seem to think he wouldn't help.

Beauchemin, Iginla, and Stuart all signed with the Avs when they were 35+ as I recall. And Beauchemin and Iginala were good for their first years.

That's like arguing you should sign Phaneuf for 5M AFTER his current contract. I'm talking about arguing if he'd improve the Avs for the next 1-3 years.

The Avs are paying Beauchemin 2/3 of his salary and taking his full cap hit to not play. That’s how dedicated they are to ridding themselves of overpriced vets.

It’s not about whether or not these guys improve the team right now. It’s whether or not they fit with the rebuild. We need to do what’s best for the team 3 years from now, not today. Phaneuf doesn’t help with that.

 

[cgf]

hmmm idk im gonna dig in the dumpster and see what i find but CBJ was coming off a 70 point season and had what everyone perceived as crazy turmoil with torts leading the force, i remember majority of websites projecting them last in METRO, if everything goes above par, you stay healthy and you get good goaltending you can do anything if you have NHL skill in your lineup which avs do

The avs would need full healthy seasons from Varly & EJ; Bigras or Lindholm to take over the spot next to Barrie; and for the young forwards to all provide quality depth while the core have bounce back seasons; Bednar doesn't lose the locker room with less NHL vets to deal with; and Bednar learns to adjust quicker than the league adjusts to him.

Even then we'd just be in the mix for the wild card unless Zads took bigger strides than even I hope for, and the MacK-Mikko partnership went full Benn-Seguin.

 

[KCC]

The Avs are paying Beauchemin 2/3 of his salary and taking his full cap hit to not play. That’s how dedicated they are to ridding themselves of overpriced vets.

It’s not about whether or not these guys improve the team right now. It’s whether or not they fit with the rebuild. We need to do what’s best for the team 3 years from now, not today. Phaneuf doesn’t help with that.

What rebuild? sakic hasn't done anything

 

[cgf]

I watched both players as a oiler fan and the oilers missed the boat on both players. Look at us now, we need a scoring RW and a puck moving RD. The problem was they just didn't work out for us and needed a change of scenery to reset in. I am happy Schultz did well and I hope Yakupov turns it around as well. They were good players ruined for us by bad coaches

Yak is so easy to root for that I really hope so, been defending the kid since he became "lol did the oilers really draft another forward 1st OA?"

But I'm not getting my hopes up. If he could be a good sniper for rookie-Jost on the third line I'll be pleased. Regardless of how well he seems to be clicking with Duchene & Kerfoot.

What rebuild? sakic hasn't done anything

He's replaced a significant chunk of the roster with younger players, opened spots for our kids, massively improved the scouting staff, and not moved any kids or picks for NHLers in a year and a half (a big step in Colorado). Plus he seems to be looking for a Duchene return that helps us less in the short run than the long run.

This is no tear down sell off, but for Colorado that qualifies as rebuilding. Especially if Barrie follows Duchene out the door...sad as that is.

 

[Papa Francouz]

Highly unlikely we move our top forward prospect, top defense prospect and 1st round in 2018.

I think

Larsson + 1st + Troy Terry/Nattinen is closer to what wed offer, steel/jones + Larsson and 1st is way too much from anaheims perspective. If they wanted steel or jones, Larsson would have to be off the table.

Not that it matters but I assume the avs have a decent book on terry seeing as he is from Denver, and plays at Denver university.

I can't blame the Ducks for not wanting to move their top prospects in both positions. You guys have a good thing going there with your scouting department, and I imagine Steel and Jones will both be quality NHLers.

I just imagine that's what Sakic will be asking for, though, since there isn't any NHL proven talent coming back in that package. And since Sakic apparently wants at least one NHLer coming back in the Duchene deal, I figure he'll charge a premium if there isn't NHL proven talent in the deal.

 

[cgf]

Here's what I don't get.

Last season when there was Duchene to Ottawa talk, I understood why they didn't want Methot. He was 32 and only signed for two more years at 5M. They were trying to rebuild, etc.. plus, they already had Beauchemin and Methot doesn't put up a lot of points.

Phaneuf though, is exactly what they needed, so why aren't they all over him? A hard-nosed veteran LHD, two-way defense-man signed long-term. He turned Ottawa around from drafting top-10 to game-7 overtime, conference finals with the champs.

I mean, they have 29 yr old Erik Johnson. He's a bit injury prone and making 6M for 6 years. Avs fans call him a core piece and vital to the success of the team. He'll be 35 or so when his contract ends.

Phaneuf is an ironman, arguably a better player, is 32 and signed for 4 years at 7M and most Avs fans seem to think it would be some huge albatross to take on his contract. He'll be 36 when his contract ends. Phaneuf's contract is also back-diving so he isn't even making 7M AND the Avs are nowhere near the cap.

Que?

Check the bolded.

We already have EJ to anchor the d so that our kids aren't thrown to the wolves and Zads is already playing next to him...and a big reason why we don't want to trade EJ is that we suspect his injuries will limit his value too much to make an EJ trade worth it. If Toronto offered us Marner for EJ you'd see a lot of fans change their mind about how important it is to keep him around to shepherd in Meloche / Makar / Timmins.

 

[Foppa]

Dion is not close to a healthy EJ at this point. We don't need him, we don't want him. Yes he'd be a top 4 defender in Colorado easily - that's really irrelevant. We wouldn't be looking to acquire EJ back either at this point in a Duchene trade if EJ was hypothetically on another team.

 

[Hello Johnny]

Varlamov, if he's healthy and on his game, if a Vezina caliber G. There are a lot of unknowns with the forwards, but there are some talented young guys who might be ready to contribute. The left side of the D is really the only hole, but there are some younger guys with long shot potential. If a few things go right, there's no reason the Avs can't surprise people.

If you take out last year's stats, Varlamov's career average numbers with the Avs are as follows:

53GP (avg per season)
GAA 2.68
SV% .916

Those are not Vezina numbers.