GDT: Devils @ Ducks - DAS EUPHORIA PART SIX

[Bleedred]

You really don't get it, so I'll just leave it at that. Do you at least understand the role of a bottom 6 forward? Are you aware that goal scoring isn't their #1 priority? If he sucked away from the puck and wasn't producing offensively, you'd have a point but that isn't the case.

You are obviously not aware that most 3rd liners produce better than 17 points per 82 games over their career.

You need to produce more than what Josefson has produced to play on the 3rd line. You need more offense from your 3rd line that what he produces.

The only year he produced at a 3rd line rate was his rookie year and he only played 28 games.

This is why it's a huge problem when the guy's you called out aren't producing, because you got a player like Josefson to fall back on and he doesn't provide offense. If he plays 4th line, I'd have no issue. But you have to produce much more playing the 3rd line than what he has. Even Pandolfo had better production offensively than that most years.

 

[Bleedred]

In what world is 14 pts as a career high "better" when playing on a stacked offensive team like the Pens? Like I said, we've been ranked dead last offensively, yet you want Josefson to rack up between 20 to 30 pts per year?

You should know better by know and start lowering your expectations. He is a 1st round pick but that doesn't always pan out to a top line talent. Just take a look back at all the picks made in the 1st round over the past several years and you'll see that just making the NHL alone isn't as easy as you might think it is, let alone becoming a top 6 forward.

I don't expect Josefson to produce more than he has, I expect our staff and management to make sure he's playing where he belongs, which is the 4th line.

Hynes is the one who plays him as if he thinks he has more to offer and is still a legit prospect, even though he's long since busted.

And let's not skew the numbers here. Before this year, Bennett produced 29 points per 82 games. Still quite a bit better than Josefson.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

enough with the Jake stuff, Jeez. his faceoff win directly led to one of our goals last night. How about we relax a little bit. Arguably our 2 best forwards are out, of course things are not going to look that great for a bit

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

You are obviously not aware that most 3rd liners produce better than 17 points per 82 games over their career.

You need to produce more than what Josefson has produced to play on the 3rd line. You need more offense from your 3rd line that what he produces.

The only year he produced at a 3rd line rate was his rookie year and he only played 28 games.

This is why it's a huge problem when the guy's you called out aren't producing, because you got a player like Josefson to fall back on and he doesn't provide offense. If he plays 4th line, I'd have no issue. But you have to produce much more playing the 3rd line than what he has. Even Pandolfo had better production offensively than that most years.

Most 3rd liners who are outproducing Josefson aren't playing on a offensively starved team like ours. Pandolfo played on teams that weren't offensively challenged, despite what the mass would say regarding our playing style (aka the trap).

And for umpteen time, who else would you slide instead of Josefson? We have no other options, none.

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

enough with the Jake stuff, Jeez. his faceoff win directly led to one of our goals last night. How about we relax a little bit. Arguably our 2 best forwards are out, of course things are not going to look that great for a bit

But he should've tipped the point shot, hence he should be sent down to Albany

 

[FooteBahl]

Most 3rd liners who are outproducing Josefson aren't playing on a offensively starved team like ours. Pandolfo played on teams that weren't offensively challenged, despite what the mass would say regarding our playing style (aka the trap).

And for umpteen time, who else would you slide instead of Josefson? We have no other options, none.

That kid with cancer that we signed for a day?

 

[Bleedred]

Most 3rd liners who are outproducing Josefson aren't playing on a offensively starved team like ours. Pandolfo played on teams that weren't offensively challenged, despite what the mass would say regarding our playing style (aka the trap).

And for umpteen time, who else would you slide instead of Josefson? We have no other options, none.

Maybe we don't have options now, but Josefson was on the 3rd line when we were fully healthy.

He was a healthy scratch for a bit before that, which was a miracle in itself.

I'd consider moving Zacha back to the 3rd line or reconfiguring things to make Lappin a 3rd liner and push Josefson down to the 4th. At least when Cammalleri gets back.

 

[Cult of Hynes]

JOsefson sucks. Just stop sticking up for him.

 

[Triumph]

C'mon man.

Sorry, it's true. A team cannot reliably generate chances on which they're 50% or higher to score. Teams can't reliably reproduce power play shooting percentages either, not in a given season anyway. You do what you can to set up the best chances possible, but there's not much evidence that teams can set up significantly better chances than another.

As for Josefson on the '3rd line' - guys, look at the ice time. Kalinin-Fiddler-Lappin plays more at ES and will continue to do so.

 

[None Shall Pass]

Any chance we can get a separate Josefson thread that I can ignore and everyone else can keep chasing windmills in?

 

[Emperoreddy]

JJ is the new Gio.

 

[MadDevil]

Any chance we can get a separate Josefson thread that I can ignore and everyone else can keep chasing windmills in?

Just give it a couple days and we'll be arguing about Merrill or Lovejoy or somebody else over and over again.

 

[Bleedred]

JJ is the new Gio.

If only he was actually used like Stephen Gionta.

 

[Triumph]

Yeah, if only the Devils ignored his most valuable attribute and played him where he actually isn't good.

 

[Bleedred]

Yeah, if only the Devils ignored his most valuable attribute and played him where he actually isn't good.

Ummm, what are you referring to as his best asset?

 

[Zippy316]

The funniest thing is that Josefson is being used as a 4C right now with PP time. He's not even in the PK rotation as Hynes has used Zacha and Lappin as the 5th and 6th options there so far. Right now, we are using Fiddler as our 3C, which isn't really much different than using Josefson there. In fact, it's starting to look like Fiddler is actually dragging down Kalinin/Lappin. Lappin has scored 3 of his 4 points since his call-up when Fiddler wasn't even on the ice.

But let's rehash another tired Josefson debate, that'll add something constructive.

 

[Bleedred]

The funniest thing is that Josefson is being used as a 4C right now with PP time. He's not even in the PK rotation as Hynes has used Zacha and Lappin as the 5th and 6th options there so far. Right now, we are using Fiddler as our 3C, which isn't really much different than using Josefson there. In fact, it's starting to look like Fiddler is actually dragging down Kalinin/Lappin. Lappin has scored 3 of his 4 points since his call-up when Fiddler wasn't even on the ice.

But let's rehash another tired Josefson debate, that'll add something constructive.

As long as we don't have a better option for the 3rd line than Josefson, Fiddler, Pietilla, Kalinin, etc, we'll continue to be one of the lowest scoring teams in the league.

If you look at the teams that score the most or even near average, they usually have at least 7 or 8 forwards averaging a 30 point pace (or close enough) per 82 games.

None of those players are capable of that.

And by today's lines in practice, it looks like Pietilla might replace Boucher and now we'll have two 4th lines. Boucher just played his best game of the season, so I'm confused by that move if it actually happens.

 

[MadDevil]

Ummm, what are you referring to as his best asset?

His brilliant vision and passing on the half wall.

I'm not going to deny he was effective on the PP last year, but I'm starting to wonder if maybe that unit's effectiveness was more of a lightning in a bottle situation.

 

[glenwo2]

You guys ruined the Euphoria!

I am so saddened that the train was stopped.

 

[Bleedred]

His brilliant vision and passing on the half wall.

I'm not going to deny he was effective on the PP last year, but I'm starting to wonder if maybe that unit's effectiveness was more of a lightning in a bottle situation.

I'm waiting for the post about how he's good at analytics and pushes the play and is a great possession player. And that he's a better 3rd liner than a 4th liner because of that. Not sure why the hell he's not good in a Gionta role, he'd be much better in that role and much better than Gionta was.

When you've been very bad at offense for about 6 years, those advanced stats don't have a leg to stand on. No offense, but people using advanced stats to justify why Josefson isn't that bad strike me as people who blindly follow them. As if there's no way that there can be an exception to the rule.

Josefson being a good possession player and a dead scorer are the anomaly as far as I'm concerned. How many years do we have to wait for him to break out? I mean, I know he hasn't actually played 6 full NHL seasons worth of games but he's still played coming up on 250 games.

Even Feed Me A Stray Cat (one of the most staunch believers of analytics on this forum) has brought up how Josefson is one of the worst points per 60 players over the last however many years.

 

[thethinglonger]

I am so saddened that the train was stopped.

Next GDT should be something like EL JUBINATION

 

[NJDevs26]

JJ is the new Gio.

I remember the days when we were arguing JJ should be playing over Gio

 

[Bleedred]

I remember the days when we were arguing JJ should be playing over Gio

I admit he's MUCH better than Gionta, at least Stephen Gionta.

But we need for him to be in the same role that Gionta was in, which is 4th line center/wing.

And it's not just Josefson. We can't have Kalinin, Pietila, Fiddler, etc, playing on the 3rd line either and expect to get a decent amount of offense from our 3rd line.

So whether Josefson is a 3rd liner or Fiddler is really the 3rd line center, it's no better.

 

[devilsblood]

The funniest thing is that Josefson is being used as a 4C right now with PP time. He's not even in the PK rotation as Hynes has used Zacha and Lappin as the 5th and 6th options there so far. Right now, we are using Fiddler as our 3C, which isn't really much different than using Josefson there. In fact, it's starting to look like Fiddler is actually dragging down Kalinin/Lappin. Lappin has scored 3 of his 4 points since his call-up when Fiddler wasn't even on the ice.

But let's rehash another tired Josefson debate, that'll add something constructive.

Lappin has perfectly filled the role his resume suggested he would. He plays the game hard, he keeps it simple, he get's shots on goal, he has a good shot.

Wouldn't mind seeing him playing a bigger role.

 

[Zippy316]

As long as we don't have a better option for the 3rd line than Josefson, Fiddler, Pietilla, Kalinin, etc, we'll continue to be one of the lowest scoring teams in the league.

If you look at the teams that score the most or even near average, they usually have at least 7 or 8 forwards averaging a 30 point pace (or close enough) per 82 games.

None of those players are capable of that.

And by today's lines in practice, it looks like Pietilla might replace Boucher and now we'll have two 4th lines. Boucher just played his best game of the season, so I'm confused by that move if it actually happens.

We have six that are basically guaranteed in Hall, Zajac, Parenteau, Cammalleri, Henrique, and Palmieri. Then we have guys like Bennett/Zacha who could easily mess around with that number. The way our fourth line is looking with Kalinin and Lappin it looks like we will finally have a fourth line capable of dominating possession.

This team is so much better and deeper than last year and Josefson is finally nothing more than a depth forward on this team when everyone is healthy and people are still complaining.