Confirmed with Link: Datsyuk Leaving Wings

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

I thought the NHL and KHL had a transfer agreement? How can Datsyuk play in the KHL when he is still under contract with Detroit?

Because Datsyuk is going to retire from the NHL here soon and his contract will be terminated. It's just is Holland going to terminate it or possibly Arizona or Carolina that remains to be seen. But yes Datsyuk is retiring here and his contract will be terminated probably just before free agency starts i would imagine.

 

[Fugu]

Well, after Khan's article today, it's clear that:

- Holland and the Wings are absolved of this fiasco; given that it was the Wings who worked to shorten the deal as much as possible, while Datsyuk wanted FIVE years, and also because Datsyuk didn't bring up the idea of returning to Russia until a year after the contract was signed.

- At best, Datsyuk is naive and Greenstin is one of those agents who works for himself and not his client; given that Holland says he believes Datsyuk didn't understand the 35+ rule.

- At worst, Datsyuk knew (or knew there was a strong possibility) that he was not going to ultimately honor the contract and went for the most amount of money he could get in the shortest period of time as possible anyway; given that Datsyuk says he did understand the 35+ rule yet still signed the contract.


Given that Datsyuk fired Greenstin and hired Milstein last year, I think the "at best" scenario is more likely than the "at worst." But that's based on speculation, since none of us know exactly why Datsyuk switched agents.

Regardless, Datsyuk screwed up here, whether it was born of his own naivety/gullibility, or his own dishonesty. I begrudge no one for looking past that and maintaining their love for the guy (personally, I only begrudge him on principle, I have no ill will towards him), but do only that. Stop trying to spin this as being Detroit's fault. The facts don't support that stance.

I think Dats is trying to be honorable, and probably didn't fully understand the 35+ rule. His agent was trying to get the best payday for himself, in my opinion. Greenstin has always been an ass, and seeing Dats fired him, I'm going to say that's why.


I also forgive him for wanting to go home, and to be closer to his kid. When you're a parent, the years really start flying by and the next thing you know, they're off to school, college, and on with their own lives. He missed a good chunk of that, so citing a family situation is about as honorable as you can get in my book. He split the difference with the team as well. So be it.

He'll remain one of my favorite players ever on the Wings. We won't see another one like him for a very long time, if ever. You younger guys at least have a few more years than I do at this point, so who knows.


This does make me wonder too why so many players wanted to leave, and/or not come back. Some wheel fell off this franchise 4-5 yrs ago, and Holland simply hasn't been aggressive enough with rebuilding. He tried to nurse it along when he should have started a real rebuild after Lidstrom retired.

 

[PuckDynasty]

I thought the NHL and KHL had a transfer agreement? How can Datsyuk play in the KHL when he is still under contract with Detroit?

The Red Wings are terminating Datsyuk's contract as a courtesy.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Do people really think we're too good to draft top 10 though?

-Zetterberg has regressed from a ppg guy to a ~50 point player
-Kronwall has regressed from a serviceable top pairing guy to a -21 black hole.
-We finished last season with Dekeyser and Quincey as our top pairing. Arguably the worst in hockey.
-Our center depth has been the best part of the team for the last 5 years, next year we are probably bottom 1/3 of the league in that department

And solutions?
-Vatanen just re-signed, scratch him off the list.
-Barrie is rumored to command a Trouba-level player, which we don't have
-^Ditto for the idea of getting Trouba
-Stamkos is going to go to the highest bidder, and we are going to struggle to free up cap space

So outside of Mrazek playing like a Vezina candidate all season (which he has only been able to do for stretches of 1-2 months), someone tell me how we are too good for a bad finish?

Who says that, None of us don't think that losing Datsyuk and if Holland does absolutely nothing that this team isn't a lottery team. I still think that this team is to good to finish dead last or any thing like that. But we're definitely going to be a lottery team if we do absolutely nothing and that's what's going to happen if we don't move Datsyuk's contract and add some decent help on the blueline. Holland will probably just eat Datsyuk's cap and sign our RFAs like DeKeyser,Mrazek, Marchenko, Sproul and Pulkkinen and call it a summer and wait to see what Helm and Radulov do.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

Wings were 23rd in offense and 17th in goals allowed with Datsyuk playing 66 games.

Take him away and don't get rid of his cap hit and the Wings are a slam dunk lottery team.

Wings defense will be worse next season, and their offense will be worse too.

If they get rid of his contract and add some more above average role players? Probably draft in the 10-15 range. Seriously doubt they make the playoffs.

The Wings have constructed a deeply flawed roster, and the only way you can address those flaws is with the addition of elite talent.

The Wings and Canucks are two peas in a pod. Look at that team to see where the Wings are headed. They are about a year ahead of the Wings in the race to futility.

 

[Pavels Dog]

The Wings and Canucks are two peas in a pod. Look at that team to see where the Wings are headed. They are about a year ahead of the Wings in the race to futility.

Vancouver's had absolutely nothing happening for them in terms of a youth movement though. The simple fact that we have Larkin/Mrazek/AA/Mantha/Svechnikov/Nyquist/Tatar/etc. means it's hard to see us dropping off as much as the Nucks. They're what our team would have looked like if Z, Dats, Kronner and Howard continued to play a solid level but we had no youth coming up from below.

Datsyuk was, sadly, just a good player last season. Not an elite one. I think we can be a better team next year even without him.

 

[schenneuf]

Because Datsyuk is going to retire from the NHL here soon and his contract will be terminated. It's just is Holland going to terminate it or possibly Arizona or Carolina that remains to be seen. But yes Datsyuk is retiring here and his contract will be terminated probably just before free agency starts i would imagine.

So his contract comes off the books? What's the big deal then?

 

[Ezekial]

So his contract comes off the books? What's the big deal then?

What? No.


Whoever terminates the contract gets the cap hit, whether it be Detroit, Carolina, Arizona or whoever.

 

[Frk It]

Vancouver's had absolutely nothing happening for them in terms of a youth movement though. The simple fact that we have Larkin/Mrazek/AA/Mantha/Svechnikov/Nyquist/Tatar/etc. means it's hard to see us dropping off as much as the Nucks. They're what our team would have looked like if Z, Dats, Kronner and Howard continued to play a solid level but we had no youth coming up from below.

Datsyuk was, sadly, just a good player last season. Not an elite one. I think we can be a better team next year even without him.

Datsyuk still had a big impact on possession even if his pt production dipped.

We had a surge offensively when he came back last year, don't think that was a coincidence.

If we are going to be better next season Holland is going to have to make an impact signing or trade. I'm talking like Stamkos or Shattenkirk level acquisition

Otherwise we would need:
-Nyquist and Tatar to return to their form from 2 years ago
-Kronwall to return to his form from 2 years ago
-Blashill to figure out how to set the lines
-Torchetti to figure out how to fix the PP with a lack of quality defenseman
-Larkin to take another big step, or Mrazek to play at a high level all season

I just have a hard time seeing it right now. I think our center depth is going to look shoddy post-Datsyuk similar to how our defense dos when Lidstrom retired. I love Larkin, but the kid can't even buy a beer yet, and I think he still needs a few years to really hit his stride. By then, not sure if Z is even playing still, or if he could still play center at this point. Dude is a trooper and a
half for playing it with all the mileage on him as it is.

 

[Claypool]

Bad teams in the NHL are not nearly as bad as you think. Winnipeg, Columbus, Edmonton, Vancouver - they all have some good talent, but lack in key areas.

Its pretty funny that you mention players like Athanasiou as if he's too good to tank with.

And the Red Wings aren't as bad as you think.

Mrazek was a vezina candidate for 2/3 of the season. Goaltending is what those teams you mentioned don't have. And yes I think over an 82-game season AA is going to be an impact player.

I'm not saying this team is a lock for the playoffs again but they'll be in the mix until the final 5-10 games.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

So his contract comes off the books? What's the big deal then?

The big deal is? That even if he retires and his contract is terminated, Because it's a 35+ contract Detroit would still be stuck with his $7.5 million cap hit that's what the big deal is carrying dead money for a year and not being able to upgrade the roster.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Otherwise we would need:
-Nyquist and Tatar to return to their form from 2 years ago
-Blashill to figure out how to set the lines
-Torchetti to figure out how to fix the PP with a lack of quality defenseman
-Larkin to take another big step, or Mrazek to play at a high level all season

I think all of the above could happen without it being too much of a wishful thinking scenario.

That's not to say I don't think we need 1 or 2 big additions to the team in order to feel in any way confident about being a playoff caliber team, or that the loss of Datsyuk won't be felt both symbolically and on the ice. But Pavel seemed to have an almost mythological status among the younger members of the team. Like they were only looking to pass the puck to him. Sometimes a team can actually improve when they lose a figure like that. The best hockey we've seen from Nyquist, Sheahan, Jurco and a few others was during stretches of hockey when Datsyuk and/or Z were out of the lineup. Pav always seemed to work the best with guys like Hossa, Richards, Alfredsson, Zetterberg, Bertuzzi, Holmstrom etc., veteran guys that wouldn't just look to Pav 99 times out of 100. Or Tatar, who never looks to defer to someone else. In our current youth movement, it seemed hard to find the right kind of matches for Pavel and it could lead to some unexpected positive results to take the magic man out of the equation and stop having the young players thinking that he'll take care of everything.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

You reasonably think it's possible for Nyquist and Tatar to rebound with Datsyuk now being gone, and you expect the PP to get better with Datsyuk being gone, and you expect Larkin to become significantly better next season even though Datsyuk is gone and that means more attention on him?

Losing Datsyuk is going to cripple an already abysmal offense.

It's just wishful thinking to expect the exact opposite to happen.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

And the Red Wings aren't as bad as you think.

Mrazek was a vezina candidate for 2/3 of the season. Goaltending is what those teams you mentioned don't have. And yes I think over an 82-game season AA is going to be an impact player.

I'm not saying this team is a lock for the playoffs again but they'll be in the mix until the final 5-10 games.

Wasn't Datsyuk the best corsi player in the history of the stat? I think he'll be difficult to replace. This team had a really tough time with puck possession before he came back. I suspect that'll still be the case.

 

[Frk It]

I think all of the above could happen without it being too much of a wishful thinking scenario.

That's not to say I don't think we need 1 or 2 big additions to the team in order to feel in any way confident about being a playoff caliber team, or that the loss of Datsyuk won't be felt both symbolically and on the ice. But Pavel seemed to have an almost mythological status among the younger members of the team. Like they were only looking to pass the puck to him. Sometimes a team can actually improve when they lose a figure like that. The best hockey we've seen from Nyquist, Sheahan, Jurco and a few others was during stretches of hockey when Datsyuk and/or Z were out of the lineup. Pav always seemed to work the best with guys like Hossa, Richards, Alfredsson, Zetterberg, Bertuzzi, Holmstrom etc., veteran guys that wouldn't just look to Pav 99 times out of 100. Or Tatar, who never looks to defer to someone else. In our current youth movement, it seemed hard to find the right kind of matches for Pavel and it could lead to some unexpected positive results to take the magic man out of the equation and stop having the young players thinking that he'll take care of everything.

I like the odds of Nyquist and Tatar rebounding statically next year. Blashill needs to play them more though.

Kronwall's lower body concerns me. Really thought he would look better after surgery, and to me, he really didn't. His game was always centered around mobility as a 5'11/6'0 defenseman, and guy just can't get to pucks like he used to.

I think Blashill will do better with setting the lines and ice time. I mean, I freaking hope so.

Torchetti I don't know a lot about, but I just don't know he has the personnel to work with.

Larkin is a gamer, I bet he works his ass off this summer and comes ready for next season. I could see him taking another step, I'm not really worried about him slumping. I'm curious if he will move to center full time though, and to see who he will line up with. Would love to see Tatar-Larkin-Mantha as a top two line to start the year.

Basically, not that worried about th forwards, very concerned with the defense. Expect us to take a hit down the middle, and not sure how much support our forwards are going to give the defense.

 

[Shaman464]

I think all of the above could happen without it being too much of a wishful thinking scenario.

That's not to say I don't think we need 1 or 2 big additions to the team in order to feel in any way confident about being a playoff caliber team, or that the loss of Datsyuk won't be felt both symbolically and on the ice. But Pavel seemed to have an almost mythological status among the younger members of the team. Like they were only looking to pass the puck to him. Sometimes a team can actually improve when they lose a figure like that. The best hockey we've seen from Nyquist, Sheahan, Jurco and a few others was during stretches of hockey when Datsyuk and/or Z were out of the lineup. Pav always seemed to work the best with guys like Hossa, Richards, Alfredsson, Zetterberg, Bertuzzi, Holmstrom etc., veteran guys that wouldn't just look to Pav 99 times out of 100. Or Tatar, who never looks to defer to someone else. In our current youth movement, it seemed hard to find the right kind of matches for Pavel and it could lead to some unexpected positive results to take the magic man out of the equation and stop having the young players thinking that he'll take care of everything.

The best hockey we saw from Nyquist, Jurco and Sheahan were when they first entered the league and teams were still trying to figure out how to match up against them. All of them have seen regression in their stats and it is pretty unreasonable to believe that any of them are going to take massive steps forward in such a way that they replace lost production from Kronwall, Zetterberg and complete loss of Datsyuk. Seriously, there are 100 points lost from the line up (20 points from Kronwall, 20 from Z, and 60 from Datsyuk). This is further compounded by the regression seen in Nyquist and Sheahan. So, even a return to form would still mean Detroit hasn't replaced what's been lost by the old core aging.

Basically, without a top line center I see Larkin also regressing in his point totals next year (they will rebound in subsequent years). Why? Because he will be asked to center a top line, which means he will have to focus less on his offense and more on playing a complete game. In the end he is very likely going to be a great top 6 center, but the learning curve could easily cause a short term stat regression. That being said, even if he doesn't increase his scoring totals, or even if they modestly decrease, I expect him, as a hypothetical second line center, to be one of the team MVP's at the end of the season.

So end all be all: The defense will continue to regress. The offense will likely also regress. Goaltending will depend on health. How does anyone see, if this team doesn't add, this team not severely regressing next season?

 

[Heaton]

I think there's plenty of concern with the forwards, we lost our best forward and our best wingers had their best seasons when our best centers were playing well. Now that we have zero legit top 6 centers it will take some huge steps forward for Tatar and Nyquist to get close to 30 goals each again.

This season relies on Larkin, Mrazek and whatever Holland can do this offseason. Without some big changes the odds we make the playoffs are weak unless teams like Montreal and Florida fall off the map. I wouldn't be surprised to see Buffalo surpass the Wings this year.

 

[Run the Jewels]

I think there's plenty of concern with the forwards, we lost our best forward and our best wingers had their best seasons when our best centers were playing well. Now that we have zero legit top 6 centers it will take some huge steps forward for Tatar and Nyquist to get close to 30 goals each again.

This season relies on Larkin, Mrazek and whatever Holland can do this offseason. Without some big changes the odds we make the playoffs are weak unless teams like Montreal and Florida fall off the map. I wouldn't be surprised to see Buffalo surpass the Wings this year.

Yep, this current version the Red Wings is gonna get worked HARD this year. Mrazek needs to be an MVP level player for us to be in the playoff hunt. It could happen but this team will struggle to get out of it's end of the ice and he's gonna face a boatload of rubber game in and game out.

 

[Pavels Dog]

The best hockey we saw from Nyquist, Jurco and Sheahan were when they first entered the league and teams were still trying to figure out how to match up against them. All of them have seen regression in their stats and it is pretty unreasonable to believe that any of them are going to take massive steps forward in such a way that they replace lost production from Kronwall, Zetterberg and complete loss of Datsyuk. Seriously, there are 100 points lost from the line up (20 points from Kronwall, 20 from Z, and 60 from Datsyuk). This is further compounded by the regression seen in Nyquist and Sheahan. So, even a return to form would still mean Detroit hasn't replaced what's been lost by the old core aging.

Basically, without a top line center I see Larkin also regressing in his point totals next year (they will rebound in subsequent years). Why? Because he will be asked to center a top line, which means he will have to focus less on his offense and more on playing a complete game. In the end he is very likely going to be a great top 6 center, but the learning curve could easily cause a short term stat regression. That being said, even if he doesn't increase his scoring totals, or even if they modestly decrease, I expect him, as a hypothetical second line center, to be one of the team MVP's at the end of the season.

So end all be all: The defense will continue to regress. The offense will likely also regress. Goaltending will depend on health. How does anyone see, if this team doesn't add, this team not severely regressing next season?

You're ignoring a lot of context in terms of icetime and opportunity. When you remove a guy that plays some of the most minutes on the team, including some of the most o-zone starts and most PP time, that is some very good minutes that other players will get. Yes, sometimes they'll get harder matchups too. More responsibility, more wear and tear.
But we've seen Tatar and Nyquist score close to 30 goals, and the biggest difference between then and this season? Icetime. Plain and simple. And Larkin always proves doubters wrong. That's just a few guys that could easily see a big jump in their numbers next year.

 

[gretskidoo]

No taxes paid over there. Money under the table. The whole thing stinks. Let's quit pretending it's the "daughter" thing. If that was it just bring her over. You think she'd prefer to be in Russia or in a US mall?

Do you actually think she'll be living in a small cabin in the woods or something?

 

[Henkka]

You're ignoring a lot of context in terms of icetime and opportunity. When you remove a guy that plays some of the most minutes on the team, including some of the most o-zone starts and most PP time, that is some very good minutes that other players will get. Yes, sometimes they'll get harder matchups too. More responsibility, more wear and tear.
But we've seen Tatar and Nyquist score close to 30 goals, and the biggest difference between then and this season? Icetime. Plain and simple. And Larkin always proves doubters wrong. That's just a few guys that could easily see a big jump in their numbers next year.

I still think Datsyuk is an impossible loss to replace, but biggest impact will come from Athanasiou. His ice-time will grow most (to the 2nd-3rd liner level) and just wait when the goals will come.

 

[Retire91]

Can't wait for the season to start so I can stop reading the insanity of wasting more early draft picks. If someone wants the contract for free then take it. Otherwise just eat it.

 

[Bench]

Can't wait for the season to start so I can stop reading the insanity of wasting more early draft picks. If someone wants the contract for free then take it. Otherwise just eat it.

The problem is it's a particularly good free agent off-season for the Wings needs. A high scoring center and several possible defensive upgrades. That's likely not the case next year when cap space is available.

 

[NHLNUT04]

Datsyuk to leave NHL, finish career in Russia

What a career

 

[Shaman464]

You're ignoring a lot of context in terms of icetime and opportunity. When you remove a guy that plays some of the most minutes on the team, including some of the most o-zone starts and most PP time, that is some very good minutes that other players will get. Yes, sometimes they'll get harder matchups too. More responsibility, more wear and tear.
But we've seen Tatar and Nyquist score close to 30 goals, and the biggest difference between then and this season? Icetime. Plain and simple. And Larkin always proves doubters wrong. That's just a few guys that could easily see a big jump in their numbers next year.

All the metrics I have seen say that Tatar and Nyquist have regressed. It's not a function of give them more time ???? profit. They are playing against tougher competition and with less talented players around them. Neither have been much of catalysts by themselves. So I am skeptical that they will magically return to career highs. As for Larkin, I am not doubting him, which is amazing you got that out of what I said. I just said that if there is a change in role from wing to center may mean that there could be a down tick in production. That isn't doubting him, as I said he will likely be one of the team's MVPs next season.