OT: Bears & NFL Talk 98

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southsideIrish

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One of Saturn's moons
Not sure how you could dismiss it

They solved QB situation and EDGE is major need for them as they barely had pass rush

The Falcons leading pass rushers from last season both were not re-signed Campbell (6.5 sacks) and Dupree (6.5 sacks). Campbell is 37 and Dupree is 31

Ebiketie showed potential (6 sacks) but is not really a marquee talent at this point. Turner matched with Ebiketie would have potential to be a good young EDGE duo

Turner is best EDGE in draft and coming from Alabama the Falcons scouts likely have seen alot of him
Yeah the feel here in Atlanta is definitely Turner, they've got plenty of offense, but need defense and they haven't addressed that at all it seems in two years.

But - like they say in these parts, Falcons gonna Falcon - they'll probably find a way to eff things up.
 

Romang67

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Turner is also the obvious selection for a team that needs an OLB that can drop into coverage. That might incentivize the Falcons to not trade back. He has experience with that. I don't think Latu or Verse do.

Either way we'll see in a week.
 

StreetHawk

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Right now, just waiting to see which of AZ or LAC trade back and allow another team to come up and grab QB4. No way Pick#3 isn't a QB, be it NE or someone else making the pick.

NYG could take QB4 at 6, so I guess that's the spot to jump to ensure you get QB4. Jones is coming off the ACL so he'll miss the start of the year. Lock/Jones duo probably gets you through the season. But, Giants need to be committed to Dabboll if they are redshirting the QB this year. I wouldn't draft a QB unless I was committed to the HC for 3 years.
 

Blackhawkswincup

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Right now, just waiting to see which of AZ or LAC trade back and allow another team to come up and grab QB4. No way Pick#3 isn't a QB, be it NE or someone else making the pick.

NYG could take QB4 at 6, so I guess that's the spot to jump to ensure you get QB4. Jones is coming off the ACL so he'll miss the start of the year. Lock/Jones duo probably gets you through the season. But, Giants need to be committed to Dabboll if they are redshirting the QB this year. I wouldn't draft a QB unless I was committed to the HC for 3 years.

If the first 3 go QB there is no way Cards are passing up on Harrison Jr or one of the other WR's in that spot

WR is big need in Arizona and they already have another 1st (Late 1st) and early 2nd + other picks so they dont really need trade down assets
 

StreetHawk

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If the first 3 go QB there is no way Cards are passing up on Harrison Jr or one of the other WR's in that spot

WR is big need in Arizona and they already have another 1st (Late 1st) and early 2nd + other picks so they dont really need trade down assets
I only see AZ trading down to NYG at 6, if they want to grab QB4. Ensures AZ gets one of MHJr or Nabers at 6. I don't think they would entertain going down to 11 and missing out on one of the top 3 WR. Murray doesn't exactly scream like a QB who would excel with a top level TE.
 

StreetHawk

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Giants have so many needs trading up for QB#4 doesn't seem worth it given cost
Jones isn’t the answer. So, they need a replacement. Feels like if they sit at 6 QB4 won’t be there. But with jones and lock at QB how good will the giants be next season?

Most QBs for 2025 draft need a big year or were just ok last season like Beck, Allar, even Ewers. But, anything can happen next season.
 

Mrfenn92

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HeisenBaez

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Giants have so many needs trading up for QB#4 doesn't seem worth it given cost
Those other needs do not matter if you don't have a QB. Solve the QB position first and the rest will take care of itself.

So yeah, Daniel Jones is not the future, so I could see NYG trading up to 4 to get JJ McCarthy. ARI could still get their WR in Nabors at 6 (I'm assuming Harrison goes 5, hopefully to the Bears after CHI trades up with Chargers).
 
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Sarava

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I wouldn't be shocked if they passed on Odunze. They already have 2 #1's. 3 might be crowded and considered a luxury. Even if you'll need another top one in a few years.
 

Blackhawkswincup

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I wouldn't be shocked if they passed on Odunze. They already have 2 #1's. 3 might be crowded and considered a luxury. Even if you'll need another top one in a few years.

Allen turns 32 next week and is a FA after 2024 season
Moore turned 27 this month and is a FA after 2025 season

Passing on Odunze (21 yrs old) because we have them would be mistake
 

Idionym

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The more I think about it, the more I'm okay with them building one of the lines instead of going WR. It's just so much more of a winning strategy to take an offensive or defensive lineman. In an ideal world, Caleb is the superstar QB who can win without an elite #1 WR, and you can have an elite offense with an okay pass catching group.
 
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Romang67

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The more I think about it, the more I'm okay with them building one of the lines instead of going WR. It's just so much more of a winning strategy to take an offensive or defensive lineman. In an ideal world, Caleb is the superstar QB who can win without an elite #1 WR, and you can have an elite offense with an okay pass catching group.
You can also get a WR in rounds 2 and 3. I tend to think a top #1WR is more important for QB development than it is for winning in the long term.

I think the issue is that, at least according to various involved people, the value is so much higher for O-linemen than for D-linemen at #9. I'm leaning tradedown even with Odunze on the board, assuming a team (Jags?) want to pay to move up.

Another possibility is getting someone like Fautanu with some position versatility to come in and be the top backup at OL positions except C the first year. It's by no means an exciting pick, and probably doesn't make the team drastically better year 1, but it provides depth on the O-line in case of injury immediately, and puts the team on track to have an strong O-line for the next half decade.

I think the only realistic option that would leave me disappointed is someone like Verse at #9. I just don't think the upside is there for a top 10 pick. I wouldn't be disappointed at all with Odunze. I'd be slightly wary over where the O-line will be in 2 years and how the D-line will improve, but I wouldn't worry about having to overpay for a great receiver any time in the next 5 years.
 

Idionym

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You can also get a WR in rounds 2 and 3. I tend to think a top #1WR is more important for QB development than it is for winning in the long term.
Right, quality WRs are just so much more abundant than quality OL. I also think, by the time DJ Moore is no longer a WR1, that Caleb will be far enough in his development that he won't need a true stud #1 anymore. If he isn't, then we have bigger problems.
I think the issue is that, at least according to various involved people, the value is so much higher for O-linemen than for D-linemen at #9. I'm leaning tradedown even with Odunze on the board, assuming a team (Jags?) want to pay to move up.

Another possibility is getting someone like Fautanu with some position versatility to come in and be the top backup at OL positions except C the first year. It's by no means an exciting pick, and probably doesn't make the team drastically better year 1, but it provides depth on the O-line in case of injury immediately, and puts the team on track to have an strong O-line for the next half decade.

I think the only realistic option that would leave me disappointed is someone like Verse at #9. I just don't think the upside is there for a top 10 pick. I wouldn't be disappointed at all with Odunze. I'd be slightly wary over where the O-line will be in 2 years and how the D-line will improve, but I wouldn't worry about having to overpay for a great receiver any time in the next 5 years.
#9 is an awkward place to be for the lines unless Alt or Turner fall to us, which seems doubtful. I agree that I'd rather trade down to a team in the mid teens who wants to trade up for Odunze.

If we're going by Brugler's The Beast, there's 5 tackles in the 12-19 range (Fashanu at 12, Latham at 13, Fuaga at 17, Mims at 19). He has Byron Murphy and Jared Verse in that range too. I think the mid- to late-first is the sweetspot, because then we are more or less guaranteed one of the tackles or D-linemen.

Looking at potential trade partners, the Jaguars make sense. They could use a stud #1 for Trevor, and the value lines up nicely for the trade to be 9 for 17+48. Brugler has a number of WRs ranked around 48 (Pearsall, Worthy, Corley, Franklin), so we could still come away with a promising WR.

I used to be on the Odunze train, but I now think a trade down is better. That being said, if they stay put and take Odunze as BPA, I don't think it's a bad pick by any means.
 
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