Rumor: Avs Proposals/Rumors/Free Agents 17-18 Part VIII

[Foppa Frossa]

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Assuming there are no side deals, getting and extending a player like Skinner could be interesting on the players being exposed. I expect they’ll choose 7F + 3D + 1G option.

Mack
Landy
Rants
Jost
Compher
Kamenev

Skinner

Exposed: Kerfoot, Soda, Neito, Ghetto or Comeau (extends).

It might not be devastating, but still be a loss.

A loss every other team in the league will also experience.


If you can make a deal to get better now you make the deal plain and simple.

 

[JLo217]

Missed Lou Hire.

 

[UncleRisto]

tampering?

Extension negotiations.

 

[JLo217]

Extension negotiations.

oh shoot! I hadn't seen he was hired by the Islanders yet.

 

[AllAboutAvs]

There is also another solution to the Xdraft issue of 7/3 vs 4/4. The Avs and Barrie could come to a verbal agreement on a contract anytime during Barrie's last year and wait to announce it between the Xdraft and Jul 1st. The Avs wouldn't have to protect him as he would be heading to FA therefore allowing them to go the 7/3 route.

Obviously this would require both parties to trust each other but Sakic is hardly the type to go back on his word and Barrie doesn't strike me like the type as well. A risk of a major injury would be present as well but the team is already facing that risk if they sign the player to an early extension. The risk is obviously bigger for Barrie but he is facing the risk if he goes to UFA anyway. So this shouldn't affect both sides very much in their decision to go with a verbal agreement.

This would give Barrie the opportunity to remain with the team/friend,s especially considering the team could be a SC contender by then, and help the team protecting more players in order to remain strong.

 

[PAZ]

There is also another solution to the Xdraft issue of 7/3 vs 4/4. The Avs and Barrie could come to a verbal agreement on a contract anytime during Barrie's last year and wait to announce it between the Xdraft and Jul 1st. The Avs wouldn't have to protect him as he would be heading to FA therefore allowing them to go the 7/3 route.

Obviously this would require both parties to trust each other but Sakic is hardly the type to go back on his word and Barrie doesn't strike me like the type as well. A risk of a major injury would be present as well but the team is already facing that risk if they sign the player to an early extension. The risk is obviously bigger for Barrie but he is facing the risk if he goes to UFA anyway. So this shouldn't affect both sides very much in their decision to go with a verbal agreement.

This would give Barrie the opportunity to remain with the team/friend,s especially considering the team could be a SC contender by then, and help the team protecting more players in order to remain strong.

While it probably wouldn't come back to bite the Avs in the ass, that's circumvention the expansion draft rules which could results in penalties (most likely in the form of loss draft picks).

 

[Patagonia]

There is also another solution to the Xdraft issue of 7/3 vs 4/4. The Avs and Barrie could come to a verbal agreement on a contract anytime during Barrie's last year and wait to announce it between the Xdraft and Jul 1st. The Avs wouldn't have to protect him as he would be heading to FA therefore allowing them to go the 7/3 route.

Obviously this would require both parties to trust each other but Sakic is hardly the type to go back on his word and Barrie doesn't strike me like the type as well. A risk of a major injury would be present as well but the team is already facing that risk if they sign the player to an early extension. The risk is obviously bigger for Barrie but he is facing the risk if he goes to UFA anyway. So this shouldn't affect both sides very much in their decision to go with a verbal agreement.

This would give Barrie the opportunity to remain with the team/friend,s especially considering the team could be a SC contender by then, and help the team protecting more players in order to remain strong.

Newport is known to play hardball with negotiations and wants to reach UFA to maximize the greatest return. Tremendous gamble to "hope" Barrie won't change his mind, if this does happen the AVs have no recourse and acknowledging such a deal is a clear violation.

Barrie for all intents and purposes is likely to be moved.

 

[Patagonia]

Makar yes but I still think it’s too early to say for Timmins. The 2020-2021 start for Seattle seems too eager to me. Here’s the blueprint for the arena http://bottomline.seattle.gov/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/REVISED-Exhibit-E-Schedule.pdf
If this is accurate (generally projects take longer than initially planned for) the arena wouldn’t even be completely built until a couple of months after the 2020-2021 season begins. Now they can still play in an almost completed arena (or play a lot of road games to start the season) but it muddies the timeline for sure. Add in the possible lockout In 2020 and it gets harder to predict. It is possible Timmins will be exempt, but a definitive statement is nothing more than a guess at this point. A more prudent way of thinking about Seattle in my opinion is to expect a 2021-2022 inaugural season. This way you’re protected even if everything doesn’t go perfectly for Seattle ownership.

Of coarse, Timmins might not even be a factor at that point, he’s not a sure thing. I’m not saying don’t make trades or signings for fear of a possible delayed draft, but speaking in absolutes in a situation like this can get any team into trouble if they don’t properly plan.

Timmins exemption will depend on the Seattle expansion. Sakic offered the deal for Sep 2018, this would protect him from the 2020/21 draft for being 2 years or less, could be problems if they announce 2021/22.

 

[AllAboutAvs]

While it probably wouldn't come back to bite the Avs in the ass, that's circumvention the expansion draft rules which could results in penalties (most likely in the form of loss draft picks).

Is there really a rule against this? If there is, I didn't know. I certainly don't want Sakic to do anything against the rule. It's not like him to do something like that and certainly not needed.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Didn’t we go over the whole Newport thing like 2 weeks ago? Newport isn’t a negotiation bully unless the client wants money over all.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Didn’t we go over the whole Newport thing like 2 weeks ago? Newport isn’t a negotiation bully unless the client wants money over all.

Look at the poster in question.


He doesn't listen. Ever. Just what he wants to hear and whatever helps push his narratives.

 

[hooverdam]

Do other fanbases have exaggerated blood feuds with Newport or are the Avs just special like that?

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

We're certainly a special bunch. No doubt about that.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Look at the poster in question.


He doesn't listen. Ever. Just what he wants to hear and whatever helps push his narratives.

This is a very valid point.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Do other fanbases have exaggerated blood feuds with Newport or are the Avs just special like that?

Of course not. Do you think they’d be basically the biggest hockey agency out there if they went into every negotiation guns a blazing asking for ridiculous contracts? Like has been posted before it’s all about the client, if they client wants $$$$ they’ll definitely play hardball ie. ROR. But it wouldn’t be a good business model for them to ignore the clients wants(assuming they wanted to stay and wilder willing to take a discount) and ruin a relationship to get more money.

 

[Pokecheque]

The "Newport" thing doesn't bother me a bit. People used to talk about how tough a negotiator legendary agent Don Meehan was, and he represented a whole slew of Avs players, including Peter Forsberg and (I think) Milan Hejduk. He also repped Eric Lindros.

In the end, it doesn't matter who the agency or agent is. They do what the player wants. Ryan O'Reilly's agent didn't make things difficult for the Avs at the negotiation table, Ryan O'Reilly did. Conversely, Matt Duchene didn't, because he didn't want to. The only agent or agency who'd give me pause is Scott Boras, because he, at least at one time, seemed like he thought of himself as bigger than the star players he represented.

 

[McMetal]

Of course not. Do you think they’d be basically the biggest hockey agency out there if they went into every negotiation guns a blazing asking for ridiculous contracts? Like has been posted before it’s all about the client, if they client wants $$$$ they’ll definitely play hardball ie. ROR. But it wouldn’t be a good business model for them to ignore the clients wants(assuming they wanted to stay and wilder willing to take a discount) and ruin a relationship to get more money.

What worries people is that Newport has already had a history of playing hardball with Barrie in particular. Maybe Barrie's changed his mind, maybe he hasn't, but it's not like these concerns are being conjured out of thin air. There's history to look at already.

 

[The Abusement Park]

What worries people is that Newport has already had a history of playing hardball with Barrie in particular. Maybe Barrie's changed his mind, maybe he hasn't, but it's not like these concerns are being conjured out of thin air. There's history to look at already.

But wouldn’t that be more of an issue than Barrie than Newport? Hypothetically here, if Barrie wanted to sign a long term deal at $6 instead of the $5.5 he has now I don’t think Newport would come in and say nope there’s absolutely no way we’re doing that, we’re only signing a contract that takes you straight to UFA and you have no say in the matter. I just don’t think that’s how Newport runs, because there’s no way they’d have the level of respect around the league that they do.

Now in saying that, if their client wants to go straight to UFA or wants to maximize their annual salary then Newport will 100% go that route if they have/client wants to.

 

[McMetal]

But wouldn’t that be more of an issue than Barrie than Newport? Hypothetically here, if Barrie wanted to sign a long term deal at $6 instead of the $5.5 he has now I don’t think Newport would come in and say nope there’s absolutely no way we’re doing that, we’re only signing a contract that takes you straight to UFA and you have no say in the matter. I just don’t think that’s how Newport runs, because there’s no way they’d have the level of respect around the league that they do.

Now in saying that, if their client wants to go straight to UFA or wants to maximize their annual salary then Newport will 100% go that route if they have/client wants to.

Saying it's a problem with Barrie more than Newport is splitting hairs. It ultimately doesn't matter, both answers mean Barrie is unlikely to re-sign for a reasonable amount.

Most likely, Barrie told Newport he wanted a big payday, and Newport formulated the strategy to take him to UFA as quickly as possible (it was their exact M.O. during the ROR negotiations). So it's up to you who to blame, but the end result for the Avs is the same.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Saying it's a problem with Barrie more than Newport is splitting hairs. It ultimately doesn't matter, both answers mean Barrie is unlikely to re-sign for a reasonable amount.

Most likely, Barrie told Newport he wanted a big payday, and Newport formulated the strategy to take him to UFA as quickly as possible (it was their exact M.O. during the ROR negotiations). So it's up to you who to blame, but the end result for the Avs is the same.

Exactly my point. Both of them wanted to maximize their earnings and Newport made that happen for the client.

I mean Schwartz, Stamkos, Pietro, Monahan, and Zuccarello are all managed by Newport and are on reasonable deals. There was no contract issues with them.

If Barrie wants to stay, Newport will make that happen. If Barrie wants $$$$ Newport will make that happen.

 

[Foppa2118]

The very first contract extension Newport/Barrie had with the Avs, they threatened to hold out, and signed a week before training camp. The second, they took the Avs to arbitration, and didn’t blink until they went all the way through it.

Twice already Barrie/Newport have had negotiations that were way uglier than most players.

It’s not just Newport that’s hard headed, it’s the Avs as well. Neither side wants to back down. Most teams Newport negotiate with, aren’t as stubborn.

Barrie certainly may push Newport to be more reasonable during the next contract negotiation, but saying the Newport/O’Reilly negotiations were the only rough ones isn’t rooted in reality.

Barrie and Newport have never had as much leverage in negotiations with his 57 point season, and pending UFA status. One side will have to completely change the hard headed stances they employed during the past two negotiations. Maybe that happens, but to act like there's nothing to be concerned about isn't accurate.

 

[Avs71]

The "Newport" thing doesn't bother me a bit. People used to talk about how tough a negotiator legendary agent Don Meehan was, and he represented a whole slew of Avs players, including Peter Forsberg and (I think) Milan Hejduk. He also repped Eric Lindros.

In the end, it doesn't matter who the agency or agent is. They do what the player wants. Ryan O'Reilly's agent didn't make things difficult for the Avs at the negotiation table, Ryan O'Reilly did. Conversely, Matt Duchene didn't, because he didn't want to. The only agent or agency who'd give me pause is Scott Boras, because he, at least at one time, seemed like he thought of himself as bigger than the star players he represented.

Forsberg and Sakic were represented by Don Baizley.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Maybe that happens, but to act like there's nothing to be concerned about isn't accurate.

Which I agree with. I just don’t think all the blame is on Newport. Barrie can make this tough for us if he wants and there’s definitely cause for concern with that.

 

[PAZ]

Is there really a rule against this? If there is, I didn't know. I certainly don't want Sakic to do anything against the rule. It's not like him to do something like that and certainly not needed.

I thought there was, I remember reading someone posted something similar and another poster stated that it's against the spirit of the expansion draft and could incur penalties... but I haven't found anything concrete on it so it might be nothing.