Auston Matthews or David Pastrnak: Who has the better chance at winning the Rocket Richard Trophy?

[danpantz]

As many predicted Matthews is taking over the race. Considering how well him and the team is playing, 60 goals is a realistic expectation at this point.

He was one goal behind when this thread started. Today he is two behind albeit in one fewer game.

 

[LeafsNation75]

He was one goal behind when this thread started. Today he is two behind albeit in one fewer game.

Since some people called the Rocket Richard Trophy race over in October and November at the rate Pastrnak was scoring goals, it's amazing that Matthews is only 2 goals behind him.

 

[LeafsNation75]

All this shows is how little he’s used in defensive positions at the end of the game. Supports the theory that Matthews is more of a stat-padder than a winner

During the Leafs 81st game in the 2017 when the clinched a playoff spot it was Matthews scoring his 40th goal into an empty net that won them that game, when they were up by 1 goal. You can't get into a more defensive position than type of situation.

However I'm willing to bet if Matthews had more than just 2 career empty net goals, you would be the first to say those don't count since he was getting easy goals without a goalie to stop the puck.

 

[danpantz]

Since some people called the Rocket Richard Trophy race over in October and November at the rate Pastrnak was scoring goals, it's amazing that Matthews is only 2 goals behind him.

Very impressive how Matthews has closed the gap for sure. Kid is on fire right now. I thought Pastas hat trick last week would provide a bit of a cushion for longer, but then Matthews goes and matches it.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Very impressive how Matthews has closed the gap for sure. Kid is on fire right now. I thought Pastas hat trick last week would provide a bit of a cushion for longer, but then Matthews goes and matches it.

If the Leafs hadn't let their 6-1 lead become a 6-4 game late in the 3rd period, chances are the Devils never pull Schneider and Matthews doesn't score into the empty net for his hat trick and has another 2 goal game.

 

[Toronto makebeleifs]

If the Leafs hadn't let their 6-1 lead become a 6-4 game late in the 3rd period, chances are the Devils never pull Schneider and Matthews doesn't score into the empty net for his hat trick and has another 2 goal game.

Meh, still counts. Good on Matthews though, still on pace for 50+. Leafs haven't had a 50 goal guy since anderchuck

 

[X66]

Pastrnak has a huge edge on PP goals over Matthews(he has 7 more), and a lot of that has to do with being the main trigger man on the Bruins PP.

If Matthews can bridge the gap there, he can take it.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Pastrnak has a huge edge on PP goals over Matthews(he has 7 more), and a lot of that has to do with being the main trigger man on the Bruins PP.

If Matthews can bridge the gap there, he can take it.

Since Matthews has the edge on Pastrnak on 5v5 goals being 1st in that category with 3 more goals, in my opinion that makes Matthews goal scoring even better. After all it's harder to score at 5v5 compared to 5v4 and 5v3.

 

[X66]

Since Matthews has the edge on Pastrnak on 5v5 goals being 1st in that category with 3 more goals, in my opinion that makes Matthews goal scoring even better. After all it's harder to score at 5v5 compared to 5v4 and 5v3.

Oh, absolutely Matthews is a better goal scorer than Pastrnak, no one in the right mind would ever argue against that(I hope).

One year will never change that.

This thread however is about the hardware this season.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Oh, absolutely Matthews is a better goal scorer than Pastrnak, no one in the right mind would ever argue against that(I hope).

One year will never change that.

This thread however is about the hardware this season.

I'm sure there are some people who might argue against Matthews being the better goal scorer than Pastrnak, even though it wouldn't be correct.

Now if Pastrnak happens to win the Rocket Richard with 53 goals and Matthews ends up 52 goals I can see it happening.

 

[koyvoo]

Oh, absolutely Matthews is a better goal scorer than Pastrnak, no one in the right mind would ever argue against that(I hope).

One year will never change that.

This thread however is about the hardware this season.

If Pasta out scores Matthews this year, it would not be one year though. It would be two years consecutively.

It would actually be three years in a row, but we can give Matthews the benefit of the doubt here in that he played so many games in 17/18.

 

[LeafsNation75]

If Pasta out scores Matthews this year, it would not be one year though. It would be two years consecutively.

It would actually be three years in a row, but we can give Matthews the benefit of the doubt here in that he played so many games in 17/18.

In terms of goals scored the previous 2 seasons, Pastrnak scored a total of just 1 more goal than Matthews.

In 2018 Pastrnak had 35 goals and Matthews had 34 goals.
In 2019 Pastrnak had 38 goals and Matthews had 37 goals.

So it's not like he outscored him by at least 10 or more goals if you get the point I'm trying to make.

 

[koyvoo]

In terms of goals scored the previous 2 seasons, Pastrnak scored a total of just 1 more goal than Matthews.

In 2018 Pastrnak had 35 goals and Matthews had 34 goals.
In 2019 Pastrnak had 38 goals and Matthews had 37 goals.

So it's not like he outscored him by at least 10 or more goals if you get the point I'm trying to make.

Right. Which why anyone saying one guy is clearly a better scorer than the other is out to lunch. Over a season and half it’s extremely close, with a the very slightest of edges to Pasta.

2018 I can give the benefit of the doubt to Matthews for playing many games less.

 

[X66]

If Pasta out scores Matthews this year, it would not be one year though. It would be two years consecutively.

It would actually be three years in a row, but we can give Matthews the benefit of the doubt here in that he played so many games in 17/18.

Pastrnak had more goals last year, but he also benefited from playing way more minutes on the PP than Matthews (nearly 50 minutes more).

In fact, this is actually the only year in Matthews' career that he's received more than 3 minutes of PP time a game, and it's barely over.

Pastrnak has already had three years with 3 minutes or more, and two of those years it was well over 3 minutes.

Last two years, Pastrnak has had 80 more minutes on the PP but only 3 more goals total than Matthews.

That shows how ridiculous Matthews' goal scoring has been.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Right. Which why anyone saying one guy is clearly a better scorer than the other is out to lunch. Over a season and half it’s extremely close, with a the very slightest of edges to Pasta.

2018 I can give the benefit of the doubt to Matthews for playing many games less.

20 Less games to be exact for Matthews in 2018 since he played 62 games and Pastrnak played all 82 games. However that year and even last year, it's not unreasonable to say if Matthews had stayed healthy he scores at least 40 goals in 3 straight seasons.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Pastrnak had more goals last year, but he also benefited from playing way more minutes on the PP than Matthews (nearly 50 minutes more).

In fact, this is actually the only year in Matthews' career that he's received more than 3 minutes of PP time a game, and it's barely over.

Pastrnak has already had three years with 3 minutes or more, and two of those years it was well over 3 minutes.

Last two years, Pastrnak has had 80 more minutes on the PP but only 3 more goals total than Matthews.

That shows how ridiculous Matthews' goal scoring has been.

I would add that alot of that was also Mike Babcock who always took Matthews line off the ice after the first minute in the power play if they never scored, where as Sheldon Keefe let's them stay out longer.

Also the Leafs have ranked towards the bottom of the league in power play minutes the last 2 seasons and I know of 3 games this year where they were given 0 power plays.

 

[koyvoo]

20 Less games to be exact for Matthews in 2018 since he played 62 games and Pastrnak played all 82 games. However that year and even last year, it's not unreasonable to say if Matthews had stayed healthy he scores at least 40 goals in 3 straight seasons.

This is why I said the third year back isn’t a fair comparison. Over the past season and a half they’ve played a similar amount of games and can be compared fairly.

 

[koyvoo]

Pastrnak had more goals last year, but he also benefited from playing way more minutes on the PP than Matthews (nearly 50 minutes more).

In fact, this is actually the only year in Matthews' career that he's received more than 3 minutes of PP time a game, and it's barely over.

Pastrnak has already had three years with 3 minutes or more, and two of those years it was well over 3 minutes.

Last two years, Pastrnak has had 80 more minutes on the PP but only 3 more goals total than Matthews.

That shows how ridiculous Matthews' goal scoring has been.

Totals > hypotheticals. A lot of people discredited Obie’s goal scoring too because of how much app time he’s played over the years too. It’s a bad argument in that case as well.

 

[LeafsNation75]

This is why I said the third year back isn’t a fair comparison. Over the past season and a half they’ve played a similar amount of games and can be compared fairly.

I knew that. My point was despite Pastrnak playing all 82 games in 2018 and Matthews playing only in 62 games, it's remarkable that he finished only 1 goal behind him.

 

[X66]

Totals > hypotheticals. A lot of people discredited Obie’s goal scoring too because of how much app time he’s played over the years too. It’s a bad argument in that case as well.

This thinking is far too primitive though.

You know that, we all do.

 

[danpantz]

I knew that. My point was despite Pastrnak playing all 82 games in 2018 and Matthews playing only in 62 games, it's remarkable that he finished only 1 goal behind him.

You mean 2017-2018 right. 2018-2019 Pastrnak played less games and finished with more goals.

People saying there's no argument are stretching it. They are very close. As shown by the last year and a half where they are neck and neck. And this thread is people arguing it.

 

[Team Cozens]

Voted Eichel.

 

[LeafsNation75]

You mean 2017-2018 right. 2018-2019 Pastrnak played less games and finished with more goals.

People saying there's no argument are stretching it. They are very close. As shown by the last year and a half where they are neck and neck.

I know Pastrnak played less games than Matthews last season, however the stats show he scored 1 more goal than Matthews did.

 

[danpantz]

I know Pastrnak played less games than Matthews last season, however the stats show he scored 1 more goal than Matthews did.

Yep. Wasnt sure if you were talking 2017-2018 or 2018-2019 when you said the 2018 season.

 

[dukeofjive]

So mathews is the best goal scorer that has never been first in the league for goals. And pasta and ovi are just PP specialist, oh and i nearly forgot, its the refs fault.