Player Discussion Artyom Zub (D) [Page 4 Senators sign from KHL]

[DueDiligence]

Zub is a first pair defenseman. If you play Zub with Chabot as a first pair, the rest of the group is just garbage right now. Zub plays leading second pair, because Sens have no choice.

I really have to question your hockey IQ. Down the stretch Mete and Brown were good; Zaitsev was OK and JBD showed well in his audition.

 

[cudi]

I call it pessimism, because while becoming a UFA means he'll have choice, claiming he is gone as soon as the deal he just signed is done and he's told the team as much is ridiculous.

"Reality" is the Sens just signed him to a 2 year deal, and will have the option to try and resign him.

I like to imagine Zub telling them during negotiations that they better not f***ing offer him another contract after this one.

 

[Hutz]

Zub is a first pair defenseman. If you play Zub with Chabot as a first pair, the rest of the group is just garbage right now. Zub plays leading second pair, because Sens have no choice.

Oh ok

Edit: i made a mistake, i read it wrong that's a solid take.... my mistake

 

[Sweatred]

I guess it's because I feel timid from losing Stone and Duchene in what was a cluster f*** and a half, but we're trending the right way and I think we can keep most guys (I hope).

Losing EK, MS, JPG, RD, MD etc was a great thing ... keeping some or parts of them would have sunk this franchise.

Stone hurts but he controlled his own destiny which is part of the league. Most of this board would have gladly kept MD or EK.

 

[DueDiligence]

I think the original post might have been slight hyperbole, but he's one of the better defenders on the team and definitely a calming "glue" guy on defence.

Agree totally that Zub was good this year. But the whole team including the forwards played much better defensively in the second half of the season.

 

[JD1]

well, that was played by the senators

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

For a guy preaching about mental health, Simmer is really going off on people aggressively for saying the Zub deal is good.

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

Why because of intagibles?

Zub was the structure and stabilizing presence of this team. Without him this year everything falls apart imo.

You didn't have to sign that contract if you wanted more money/years.

 

[SENATOR]

The whole too short crowd ignores that the Sens can extend him next off-season. They'll have another year of seeing him the NHL to determine his value. There's risk regardless of which way the Sens approached this because he's played about a half season in the NHL.

Do you think paying him peanuts 2,5 million and low balling him like this will make him happy with the organization? He can not wait to get out from here now. They really, really pissed him off. When they give him an idea they do not see him here long term and do not care investing in him and he is not their future. Also Sens will throw 5 million dollars at Tkachuk on a bridge deal overpaying him, basically taking money from Zub. It is not fair in his eyes. And why Chabot(the give away machine) makes 4 times more money then Zub? For what exactly reason? This is f**king ridiculous.

 

[SpezDispenser]

Losing EK, MS, JPG, RD, MD etc was a great thing ... keeping some or parts of them would have sunk this franchise.

Stone hurts but he controlled his own destiny which is part of the league. Most of this board would have gladly kept MD or EK.

Holy shit, yeah lol. But it's more the point that the management set themselves us to 'negotiate' with Duchene and Stone and flubbed it so bad we almost couldn't trade Stone. Hopefully, like a toddler, they've learned from that.

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

Do you think paying him peanuts 2,5 million and low balling him like this will make him happy with the organization? He can not wait to get out from here now. They really, really pissed him off. When they give him an idea they do not see him here long term and do not care investing in him and he is not their future. Also Sens will throw 5 million dollars at Tkachuk on a bridge deal overpaying him, basically taking money from Zub. It is not fair in his eyes. And why Chabot(the give away machine) makes 4 times more money then Zub? For what exactly reason? This is f**king ridiculous.

How is it a lowball? he signed the contract.

You have no idea what you're watching or thinking if you think Zub is close to Chabot, or basically if you actually believe everything you just wrote there.

 

[SpezDispenser]

Agree totally that Zub was good this year. But the whole team including the forwards played much better defensively in the second half of the season.

For sure that was a big part of it, but you see Zub's IQ on the ice. He made like...15 mistakes all year, if that, under enormous pressure.

For the record, I'm happy it got done so quick. Love this player and happy to have him in the fold!

 

[SENATOR]

For a guy preaching about mental health, Simmer is really going off on people aggressively for saying the Zub deal is good.

Simmer is an endless bullshit talker. I am not putting the guy down, but he just took a vacation. Mental health is not resolved in one month it takes years and years.

 

[SpezDispenser]

For a guy preaching about mental health, Simmer is really going off on people aggressively for saying the Zub deal is good.

Why? Because he thinks it's too short?

 

[Xspyrit]

To be fair, guy signed with a shit team at minimum salary, and then just committed further to another 20% of his career length to this team on a bargain without making a fuss. He really owes the team nothing. As a fan, can just be excited for next year rather than what the team will look like in 3+ years where so many variables will change anyways. For example, in 3 years, Sanderson will hopefully already be a premiere young D heading into his prime.

Imagine if every job you applied for asked for you to commit to 2 versus 4 years. I'd take 2 just about every time.

Don't disagree with any of that but at the same time, in 3 years is when I hope the Sens are ready to make serious noise. Maybe get close to the playoffs next season, make them the following season and after that, serious stuff. IMO and as of now, we'll really need Artem Zub.

And you can't compare a NHL job to any job you know, it's just a very different apple. Players are more like a very specific business.

In the end, maybe Zub didn't give Dorion much choice, and didn't want to commit to years overlaping his free agency, or that would have required a way too risky AAV.

I call it pessimism, because while becoming a UFA means he'll have choice, claiming he is gone as soon as the deal he just signed is done and he's told the team as much is ridiculous.

"Reality" is the Sens just signed him to a 2 year deal, and will have the option to try and resign him.

And where did I claim that exactly? Maybe you didn't like the "writing is on the wall" but I said hopefully that changes between now and then. At the very least, it gives Zub a lot of leverage

Isn't true?

It is well known that teams still have leverage when a guy's contract expires as a RFA. But opposedly, when the contracts expires as UFA, then the player's camp has a lot of leverage. Think Mark Stone among the thousand of examples. That's basically the whole difference between RFA and UFA.

 

[Slippy]

Do you think paying him peanuts 2,5 million and low balling him like this will make him happy with the organization? He can not wait to get out from here now. They really, really pissed him off. When they give him an idea they do not see him here long term and do not care investing in him and he is not their future. Also Sens will throw 5 million dollars at Tkachuk on a bridge deal overpaying him, basically taking money from Zub. It is not fair in his eyes. And why Chabot(the give away machine) makes 4 times more money then Zub? For what exactly reason? This is f**king ridiculous.

Ok, this just seems like trolling, so I shouldn't reply, but here I am.

If he thought $2.5M is peanuts why would he sign a new deal so quickly. Were are you getting the idea that he is "pissed off"? Do you know him personally or something?

And I am not sure why you are a fan if the Sens if you think Brady Tkachuk making $5M is an overpayment. What do you think Tkachuk is worth?

 

[Masked]

Do you think paying him peanuts 2,5 million and low balling him like this will make him happy with the organization? He can not wait to get out from here now. They really, really pissed him off. When they give him an idea they do not see him here long term and do not care investing in him and he is not their future. Also Sens will throw 5 million dollars at Tkachuk on a bridge deal overpaying him, basically taking money from Zub. It is not fair in his eyes. And why Chabot(the give away machine) makes 4 times more money then Zub? For what exactly reason? This is f**king ridiculous.

Your last sentence nicely sums up the rest of your post.

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

Why? Because he thinks it's too short?

Yeah he says it's dumb that it's only two years.

 

[SpezDispenser]

Yeah he says it's dumb that it's only two years.

To get aggressive about it is very odd.

 

[DueDiligence]

Do you think paying him peanuts 2,5 million and low balling him like this will make him happy with the organization? He can not wait to get out from here now. They really, really pissed him off. When they give him an idea they do not see him here long term and do not care investing in him and he is not their future. Also Sens will throw 5 million dollars at Tkachuk on a bridge deal overpaying him, basically taking money from Zub. It is not fair in his eyes. And why Chabot(the give away machine) makes 4 times more money then Zub? For what exactly reason? This is f**king ridiculous.

If Zub hated this deal so much why the heck did he sign it??? This guy has 47 games in the NHL. So you think he should have signed for 6 x $6 ???? Your logic is so flawed it's laughable.

 

[SENATOR]

How is it a lowball? he signed the contract.

You have no idea what you're watching or thinking if you think Zub is close to Chabot, or basically if you actually believe everything you just wrote there.

Chabot can not defend. The same rookie mistakes. Goes too deep into o-zone and lose the pucks dead all the time. Puck moving is not a crazy skill. Chabot is very mediocre on a PP. Creates many turnovers. He is basically Mete with a good shot and better passing skills. The guy though is a huge defensive liability. +/- are horrendous. Points production is just above average. And Mete is way better defensively. What games are you watching exactly?

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

Chabot can not defend. The same rookie mistakes. Goes too deep into o-zone and lose the pucks dead all the time. Puck moving is not a crazy skill. Chabot is very mediocre on a PP. Creates many turnovers. He is basically Mete with a good shot and better passing skills. The guy though is a huge defensive liability. +/- are horrendous. Points production is just above average. And Mete is way better defensively. What games are you watching exactly?

Yikes.

 

[Slippy]

Don't disagree with any of that but at the same time, in 3 years is when I hope the Sens are ready to make serious noise. Maybe get close to the playoffs next season, make them the following season and after that, serious stuff.

And you can't compare a NHL job to any job you know, it's just a very different apple. Players are more like a business.

In the end, maybe Zub didn't give Dorion much choice, and didn't want to commit to years overlaping his free agency, or that would have required a way too risky AAV.



And where did I claim that exactly? Maybe you didn't like the "writing is on the wall" but I said hopefully that changes between now and then. At the very least, it gives Zub a lot of leverage

Isn't true?

It is well known that teams still have leverage when a guy's contract expires as a RFA. But opposedly, when the contracts expires as UFA, then the player's camp has a lot of leverage. Think Mark Stone among the thousand of examples. That's basically the whole differance between RFA and UFA.

You may notice that your post was not the only one I quoted. The other one mentioned that perhaps Zub had said he was leaving when he hits UFA.

I don't disagree that it is better to have to renegotiate with RFAs instead of UFAs, but it is not simply the teams choice. The more that I think about it, the more I think this was likely the plan for Zub and his representation all along. As an older free agent that was still required to sign an ELC, he may have said that after his ELC he'd be seeking to get to UFA ASAP. He doesn't have the luxury of being an 18-19 year old prospect to look at his potential earnings over the course of a long career so need to maximize earnings quickly. Also, with this deal being signed so soon after the season, it seems that player and team were on the same page.

 

[SENATOR]

Chabot 36 points to Zub 14, who did not have a chance to run a PP for some unknown reasons. How 36 points to 14 translate to 4 times more money a year?

 

[Hale The Villain]

2 years takes him right to UFA status

Dorion is an absolute moron