Coach Discussion: All-purpose Coach Discussion Thread II

[surixon]

Maurice needs to bite the bullet and play as many puck movers as possible and live with the uncertainty. His preference to play so called safe defensive vets who can't move the puck is hurting too much of our game.

Can it really get any worse in our end with Niku playing?

 

[JetsUK]

Maurice needs to bite the bullet and play as many puck movers as possible and live with the uncertainty. His preference to play so called safe defensive vets who can't move the puck is hurting too much of our game.

Can it really get any worse in our end with Niku playing?

I agree, but I just don't see him breaking the habits of a (coaching) lifetime without significant pressure on or off him -- the most fluid, puck-moving, creative hockey I've seen the Jets play was when they were at their absolute strongest and in so-called garbage time. It's been in rare supply for a while now.

 

[LowLefty]

Maurice needs to bite the bullet and play as many puck movers as possible and live with the uncertainty. His preference to play so called safe defensive vets who can't move the puck is hurting too much of our game.

Can it really get any worse in our end with Niku playing?

How much better will it get?
Do you think we would be better defensively with Niku out there?
Is there an assumption that he will be the puck mover in this situation?
Our issue in our own end is related to possession - how can you move the puck if you never have it?
Is Niku going to be a good possession D man in his end? No, he won't.

The dialogue around zone exits and "puck mover" is great - I'd love to see our d men move the puck.
But first I'd like to see them retrieve the puck - doesn't that have to happen first?
We don't have too many guys back there that are able to take pucks away and stand up to a team that knows we hate the cycle.

We lost 4 x 200+ lb D men and it shows
We are exposed and Niku is not what is needed.

Our inability to retrieve / strip pucks, knock players off the puck or clear the front (did you see how we all collapsed our our crease last night?) make it very difficult to get anything going in the other direction -in other words, our offense is directly impacted by all of this as well.
What kind of system do you put in place that will allow an inexperienced, mediocre D to step in make it all work - especially the puck moving part.
Our offense is now a direct reflection of our defense - they're chasing dumps and fighting in traffic all night long in an effort to get the puck back - and for the most part, they are not successful. If / when they do get the puck, it's time to get off and we're in the middle of anther line change.
And then it starts all over again - we just had the Sharks put over 50 shots on our net for this very reason - and they are not very good.

What system should we use? But before answering that, tell me how we get the puck back first.
Apologies for the rant - most of this has nothing to do with your post -

 

[GumbyCan2]

If this is a retooling year, maybe we should stick with Maurice.

His dump and chase system, poor deployment, the unending bromance, lack of vet accountability, passive PK and stale/static PP1 will lead us towards a top 5-10 pick in the draft.

Maurice is our qualified tank commander!

A.k.a Commander Tank, leader of all 'Wingless Jets.

 

[stonec]

Care to elaborate?

Well I can't elaborate it other than with my own observations, but the numbers also back it up. WPG ranked 7th in goals for in 2016-2017, 2nd in 2017-2018, 7th again in 2018-2019, 20th so far this season. Those are some very good numbers except for this season, in which the sample size is too small anyway. Over the last four seasons, only Tampa, Pittsburgh, Toronto and Washington have scored more goals, so clearly goal scoring or offensive strategy isn't the issue.

 

[GumbyCan2]

Maurice needs to bite the bullet and play as many puck movers as possible and live with the uncertainty. His preference to play so called safe defensive vets who can't move the puck is hurting too much of our game.

Can it really get any worse in our end with Niku playing?

Niku ( when healthy) , Heinola, Gawanke. Let 'em play & learn & experience gain. Who knows? Maybe they could surprise and bring better opportunity toward winning, not just present, throw out who we choose and pray for success. Our offensive skill should carry us, despite disengaged play, disorientedsystem, little cohesion and confidence and team buy-in commitment showing...until last night in San Jose! A few players stuck withgrindand played off our Goalie's all-world-level stoning play, and there was a unified "keep at it" late in game by a few of our best players this year! Ehlers, Roslo, Copp, even vGustaffson-quietly, steadily held his ground (ice) against some of San Jose's top guns ( in the very limited use until later in the game)

 

[surixon]

How much better will it get?
Do you think we would be better defensively with Niku out there?
Is there an assumption that he will be the puck mover in this situation?
Our issue in our own end is related to possession - how can you move the puck if you never have it?
Is Niku going to be a good possession D man in his end? No, he won't.

The dialogue around zone exits and "puck mover" is great - I'd love to see our d men move the puck.
But first I'd like to see them retrieve the puck - doesn't that have to happen first?
We don't have too many guys back there that are able to take pucks away and stand up to a team that knows we hate the cycle.

We lost 4 x 200+ lb D men and it shows
We are exposed and Niku is not what is needed.

Our inability to retrieve / strip pucks, knock players off the puck or clear the front (did you see how we all collapsed our our crease last night?) make it very difficult to get anything going in the other direction -in other words, our offense is directly impacted by all of this as well.
What kind of system do you put in place that will allow an inexperienced, mediocre D to step in make it all work - especially the puck moving part.
Our offense is now a direct reflection of our defense - they're chasing dumps and fighting in traffic all night long in an effort to get the puck back - and for the most part, they are not successful. If / when they do get the puck, it's time to get off and we're in the middle of anther line change.
And then it starts all over again - we just had the Sharks put over 50 shots on our net for this very reason - and they are not very good.

What system should we use? But before answering that, tell me how we get the puck back first.
Apologies for the rant - most of this has nothing to do with your post -

Well I agree with you that there are so many issues defensively with the team.

For starters puck retrieval would be much easier if our forwards properly applied back pressure through the nz so that our dmen can hard gap at our blue line.

Another issue is that our d as currently deployed aren't that mobile so other teams are able to win more 50/50 races to the puck.

Third our d can't do much with the puck when they get it.

As for The other issue on winning the puck once the other team gets set in our end tends to be largely due to the fact that we collapse on our net and give up the perimiter to the other team. I would like to see a more aggressive approach in our end and that would be helped by speed and puck movement.

Another big issue is it doesn't appear that the players are playing how the coach wants.

We also now have Maurice calling out players so he is clearly getting frustrated.

Might just be time for a new voice if things don't get sorted out soon.

 

[GumbyCan2]

How much better will it get?
Do you think we would be better defensively with Niku out there?
Is there an assumption that he will be the puck mover in this situation?
Our issue in our own end is related to possession - how can you move the puck if you never have it?
Is Niku going to be a good possession D man in his end? No, he won't.

The dialogue around zone exits and "puck mover" is great - I'd love to see our d men move the puck.
But first I'd like to see them retrieve the puck - doesn't that have to happen first?
We don't have too many guys back there that are able to take pucks away and stand up to a team that knows we hate the cycle.

We lost 4 x 200+ lb D men and it shows
We are exposed and Niku is not what is needed.

Our inability to retrieve / strip pucks, knock players off the puck or clear the front (did you see how we all collapsed our our crease last night?) make it very difficult to get anything going in the other direction -in other words, our offense is directly impacted by all of this as well.
What kind of system do you put in place that will allow an inexperienced, mediocre D to step in make it all work - especially the puck moving part.
Our offense is now a direct reflection of our defense - they're chasing dumps and fighting in traffic all night long in an effort to get the puck back - and for the most part, they are not successful. If / when they do get the puck, it's time to get off and we're in the middle of anther line change.
And then it starts all over again - we just had the Sharks put over 50 shots on our net for this very reason - and they are not very good.

What system should we use? But before answering that, tell me how we get the puck back first.
Apologies for the rant - most of this has nothing to do with your post -

You bring some valid points up about what is going on on the ice in many games now. Justifying these points as a result in lack of talent, the roster presented is valid, too. However, excusing a coach who has instituted a system that clearly does not fit his present roster, over half of last year, with a better roster too, misses the point of calling for change in the bench-boss. Look at St.Louis last year. Look at Edmonton this year.
It appears some of leadership and core are more disoriented in Maurices demands than last season, combining that with the loss of experienced, quality Dmen and your results and potential likely diminsh as current state is allowed to continue. Maurice is responsible for identifying key areas of needing work on, guidance and incorporating improvement and getting players to buy-in and apply these. His in-game decisions and player usage are more of a concern and are proving negative to the outlook than the incompetancyof and ability in some of the new roster.
One point you brought up about "collapsing D join front of the net" is a little different now, due to some of the different players this year. But the previousroster of D last season began collapsing on (many times on top of Helly or Brois). None of this form of defending in front of our net appears tobechanging much. Whengiventhe opportunity to face shooters, see the pass to another shooter without your D gliding in front of the goalie, diving into their goalies area, Hellebuyck is making great saves and getting to rebounds to save 2nd shots. We do have a couple Dmen who can handle a puck, quickly move it away from dangerous zone and get to loose pucks before opponent. Just, they are young and inexperienced and now not even on the roster ( due to precious ELC year wasted??). I think our team needs an infusion of "change" in the voice and direction of the coaches. Note the "plural" on coachES.

 

[Teemusalami204]

We have played a consistent game in one and a half years of maurice's tenure here with every excuse in the book.

Is it the system? The moose seem to have the same struggles. Is it the players? We had the same players for the last half of the season last year. Or are the excuses the reasoning?

I personally think its the systems and maurice himself but maybe other reasons due come into play

 

[Evil Little]

I think Paul Maurice should remain the coach of the Winnipeg Jets... until Jon Cooper is fired.

 

[LowLefty]

We have played a consistent game in one and a half years of maurice's tenure here with every excuse in the book.

Is it the system? The moose seem to have the same struggles. Is it the players? We had the same players for the last half of the season last year. Or are the excuses the reasoning?

I personally think its the systems and maurice himself but maybe other reasons due come into play

Maybe our D? You could likely go out on a limb with that assumption.

 

[Teemusalami204]

Maybe our D? You could likely go out on a limb with that assumption.

That covers this year. What about last year after christmas? And the years before our WCF season ?

 

[Ducky10]

We have played a consistent game in one and a half years of maurice's tenure here with every excuse in the book.

Is it the system? The moose seem to have the same struggles. Is it the players? We had the same players for the last half of the season last year. Or are the excuses the reasoning?

I personally think its the systems and maurice himself but maybe other reasons due come into play

Cooper, Babcock, Vigneault, DeBoer and Gabby suddenly seem to have bad systems as well all of a sudden.

 

[Teemusalami204]

Cooper, Babcock, Vigneault, DeBoer and Gabby suddenly seem to have bad systems as well all of a sudden.

All of them have had more then one and a half seasons of good results.

 

[LowLefty]

That covers this year. What about last year after christmas? And the years before our WCF season ?

What about it?
I'm focused on what's happening right now -

 

[Teemusalami204]

What about it?
I'm focused on what's happening right now -

The way maurice coaches in the past has alot to do with what is happening right now

 

[LowLefty]

The way maurice coaches in the past has alot to do with what is happening right now

So what's happening right now and how much of that has to do with coaching?
I see a team with very little to work with in the D zone that is impacting every part of our game, including O.
How does what happened last year or 5 years ago, have any impact on that?

I also see guys like Connor, Ehlers and Laine playing a more complete game - much more complete.
I see Roz making major strides in his game - he's come a long way this year.
I see Little contributing and doing well as a #2 center
I see a Ranger handoff (Pionk) playing major minutes and doing well.
I see an inexperienced group of D players making the best of what they have -in other words, it could be worse.
I see Lowry going to battle with a tank without blinking an eye -

Those are a few things I see - does the coach get any credit?

 

[KingBogo]

All of them have had more then one and a half seasons of good results.

Actually at minimum Maurice has had 3 good seasons. In 2013-14 he came in mid season with a horrible roster and went 18-12-5, the following season he made the playoffs with 99 points with a not very good team. Won't deny last year's team disappointed but Maurice has a .580 points % with the Jets which translates to 95 point seasons. I would guess this season is a make or break one for him. He is on the last year of his current contract, and with the roster upheavals I'd guess he gets extended if he gets this team to the playoffs. If he falls short it is anyone's guess.

 

[Teemusalami204]

So what's happening right now and how much of that has to do with coaching?
I see a team with very little to work with in the D zone that is impacting every part of our game, including O.
How does what happened last year or 5 years ago, have any impact on that?

I also see guys like Connor, Ehlers and Laine playing a more complete game - much more complete.
I see Roz making major strides in his game - he's come a long way this year.
I see Little contributing and doing well as a #2 center
I see a Ranger handoff (Pionk) playing major minutes and doing well.
I see an inexperienced group of D players making the best of what they have -in other words, it could be worse.
I see Lowry going to battle with a tank without blinking an eye -

Those are a few things I see - does the coach get any credit?

Lots of what you stated can be attributed to the players themselves. Players develop all around the league and every coach has players that do so. Giving maurice credit for things that almost every coach does proves your grasping for straws.

Tell you what. When he gets our jets to play consistently for more then a season with no excuses I will be right there with you with optimism

 

[LowLefty]

Lots of what you stated can be attributed to the players themselves. Players develop all around the league and every coach has players that do so. Giving maurice credit for things that almost every coach does proves your grasping for straws.

Tell you what. When he gets out jets to play consistently for more then a season with no excuses I will be right there with you with optimism

What else am I going to give him credit for? I'd think "things that coaches do" would be a good place to look when evaluating a coach

 

[Channelcat]

Maurice needs to bite the bullet and play as many puck movers as possible and live with the uncertainty. His preference to play so called safe defensive vets who can't move the puck is hurting too much of our game.

Can it really get any worse in our end with Niku playing?

Maurice does not know the meaning of defensive hockey.....but I sorta understand where you're going with this. He sends out Bourque, Lowry Little ....whoever and expects them to stop goals somehow, but with no direction. Thank god we at least have some talent on the bench though.

 

[Teemusalami204]

What else am I going to give him credit for? I'd think "things that coaches do" would be a good place to look when evaluating a coach

I would say the things that stand out would be a good place to start.

 

[LowLefty]

I would say the things that stand out would be a good place to start.

And I already gave you a list of several

 

[Teemusalami204]

And I already gave you a list of several

I guess we will disagree on what stands out

 

[PhilJets]

If TNS like Maurice so much they should find him another spot in their company. I probably would he seems to be a good guy.

But
He is nearing or already pass his life expectancy as a coach of this team already.

Need a new voice and new direction.
2 years with super solid line up. Top to bottom. Team got 1 WCF in which they got schooled.

Its a brand new team, good time to get someone in fresh.
Coach had 2 cracks already.