Rumor: All Purpose Anthony Duclair Trade Talk (Duke requested trade, Coyotes trying to grant it)

[hbk]

I will say this. Tocchet is known as the Kessel whisperer. Doyounot think he tried / is trying w Duclair?

 

[BUX7PHX]

It could be Duclair's fault. It's most likely Duclair's fault. Two coaching staffs have chucked him right under the wagon. There's probably a reason for it.

I have fears, though. Reservations. I worry.

Tocchet and Tippet have night and day systems. Their X's & O's are so different. I worry though that their approach and mentality is very much the same. Their preferences.

I suspect (without basis, albeit) that there are more progressive coaching staffs out there that could squeeze some very meaningful production out of this player.

Despite the circumstances, I see a net positive hockey player. I'm no scout. I'm no coach. From my couch, I see a kid who could easily flourish in the right ecosystem. Quite honestly, that environment is the one I wish desperately that we had here. The kind of team that makes Anthony Duclair a successful player is the kind of team I want to be a fan of.

I hoped Tocchet would be that guy. He's not. Most likely it's Duclair's fault. But damn. Damn I'd love to see what Todd Nelson or Sheldon Keefe could have figured out for him. If anything....

Look at it this way - the Rangers were also willing to include him in a deal after he had gone for what, 7 points in 18 games? So right now, we have three different coaching systems where he had success from a points standpoint, and then it petered out. There is something more to this and it probably has to deal with Duclair's understanding of what to do within systems, or there is that perfect system somewhere that works best for him, and now it is a matter of finding that team out of 30 that can capitalize. I put the odds on the team getting Duclair having another situation that has already been seen now 3 times over in 3 different systems.

 

[Matias Maccete]

I will say this. Tocchet is known as the Kessel whisperer. Doyounot think he tried / is trying w Duclair?

He is, and by all accounts kessel really liked him, but how much whispering did kessel really need? Was he a dramatically different player in Pittsburgh with tocchet from Toronto? Or did he finally have a decent team around him?

 

[BUX7PHX]

If your goal scorer is fat but still scores goals, does it matter he's fat?

If it prohibits his ability to play a 200 foot game and it leads to defensive coverage gaffes, mix-ups, or generally working against the team from areas other than producing points, then sure it matters. Point noted, though.

 

[Jamieh]

Look at it this way - the Rangers were also willing to include him in a deal after he had gone for what, 7 points in 18 games? So right now, we have three different coaching systems where he had success from a points standpoint, and then it petered out. There is something more to this and it probably has to deal with Duclair's understanding of what to do within systems, or there is that perfect system somewhere that works best for him, and now it is a matter of finding that team out of 30 that can capitalize. I put the odds on the team getting Duclair having another situation that has already been seen now 3 times over in 3 different systems.

Wasn't there also similar issues in Jr?? Or an I misremembering?

 

[BUX7PHX]

Wasn't there also similar issues in Jr?? Or an I misremembering?

IIRC, he did get suspended from his team in juniors for like 2-3 (?) games, and I am not 100% sure what that was all about, but it sounded as if though there were "attitude concerns." But it also seemed like he got thrown under the bus a little bit by a teammate or two, so I don't know if I can draw a fair conclusion there. Given the scope of this, it sounds more like these "attitude issues" could be manifesting themselves over and over again, though.

Draw your conclusions:

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/duclair-and-erne-suspended-by-the-quebec-remparts.1327541/

 

[Jamieh]

IIRC, he did get suspended from his team in juniors for like 2-3 (?) games, and I am not 100% sure what that was all about, but it sounded as if though there were "attitude concerns." But it also seemed like he got thrown under the bus a little bit by a teammate or two, so I don't know if I can draw a fair conclusion there. Given the scope of this, it sounds more like these "attitude issues" could be manifesting themselves over and over again, though.

Draw your conclusions:

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/duclair-and-erne-suspended-by-the-quebec-remparts.1327541/

Interesting read, Thanks. I would normally give a kid a pass but he seems to be on the outs with several Coaching Staffs now so there might be something to him that we don"t get to see from out couches??

 

[Neighborhood Coyote]

Look at it this way - the Rangers were also willing to include him in a deal after he had gone for what, 7 points in 18 games? So right now, we have three different coaching systems where he had success from a points standpoint, and then it petered out. There is something more to this and it probably has to deal with Duclair's understanding of what to do within systems, or there is that perfect system somewhere that works best for him, and now it is a matter of finding that team out of 30 that can capitalize. I put the odds on the team getting Duclair having another situation that has already been seen now 3 times over in 3 different systems.

Idk, Gretzky was also traded at one point. Doesn't make you a bad player. Maybe the Rangers just wanted to have Yandle and Duclair is what the Yotes wanted at the time? Both teams obviously saw him as having some value. Tippet didn't seem to have a problem with him his first year, either. When his production went down is when Tip seemed to bench him and we all know the story from there.

 

[Jamieh]

He is, and by all accounts kessel really liked him, but how much whispering did kessel really need? Was he a dramatically different player in Pittsburgh with tocchet from Toronto? Or did he finally have a decent team around him?

The other side of this is that Kessel is a proven player in the NHL and with a little coddling you could get an elite player to help your team over the top to win a Cup. AS of right now Duclair has proven nothing and has not demonstrated to any NHL coach that he is worth having to put in the extra effort and coddling for. The two really aren't comparable.

 

[Jamieh]

Idk, Gretzky was also traded at one point. Doesn't make you a bad player. Maybe the Rangers just wanted to have Yandle and Duclair is what the Yotes wanted at the time? Both teams obviously saw him as having some value. Tippet didn't seem to have a problem with him his first year, either. When his production went down is when Tip seemed to bench him and we all know the story from there.

In fairness Gretzky was sold from Edmonton. If the Coyotes could actually sell players for cash you and I might get a game soon!!!

 

[KG]

Where there is smoke, there is fire.

Benched by two coaching staffs.

Traded by a primere org, the Rangers.

Known attitude issues in juniors.

Rumors on this board from posters that Duclair leads the party squad.

Supposedly on the block by Chayka, who may be the most analytics inclined GM in the league. So he would know about the points per 60.

Not saying Duke is unsalvageable, but at this point I'm willing to put more blame on player than org.

 

[AZviaNJ]

Duclair for Aberg. Get er done Chayka.

 

[Neighborhood Coyote]

In fairness Gretzky was sold from Edmonton. If the Coyotes could actually sell players for cash you and I might get a game soon!!!

Haha thats true!

Idk, I just want this team to finally do well developing our players into first line or elite players for once.

 

[Jamieh]

Haha thats true!

Idk, I just want this team to finally do well developing our players into first line or elite players for once.

It always seems like a snowball effect in regards to development, Once you get that first line center and number 1 D the other guys seem to develop better under them as the pressure just isn't there and the shelter is in place. It's just so GD hard to get that Center. Look at the Leafs, they all look a lot better when Matthews arrived and solidified that number 1 spot. We have the number 1 D but he's kinda not the prototypical one as he just plays extremely well but doesn't seem to elevate other and take charge. Not really a complaint on OEL but he doesn't exactly exude Leadership IMO.

 

[Jakey53]

Interesting read, Thanks. I would normally give a kid a pass but he seems to be on the outs with several Coaching Staffs now so there might be something to him that we don"t get to see from out couches??

I agree. Where there is smoke there is fire.

 

[rt]

Duclair for Aberg. Get er done Chayka.

He's two years older and accomplished absolutely nothing at the NHL level. Why would we even consider that?

 

[AZviaNJ]

I agree. Where there is smoke there is fire.

There's more to the story with Duclair, which we may never know.

 

[Mosby]

This was obvious, not only from the 10 benchings this year but also as far back as when we tried to trade him to Calgary last season.

 

[BUX7PHX]

Idk, Gretzky was also traded at one point. Doesn't make you a bad player. Maybe the Rangers just wanted to have Yandle and Duclair is what the Yotes wanted at the time? Both teams obviously saw him as having some value. Tippet didn't seem to have a problem with him his first year, either. When his production went down is when Tip seemed to bench him and we all know the story from there.

Obviously, none of us were privy to trade talks regarding Yandle, but I imagine that there was enough chatter within the Rangers organization to where Duclair hadn't necessarily worn out his welcome, but the team was okay with including him as a piece to balance the deal out while ridding itself of a player that could be perceived as having attitude issues. Much like the Ribeiro situation, we see something, but maybe don't have the entire story behind it, so we bite the bullet and see what happens. Paid dividends early, but then you see where things go from there and it becomes a little less rosy.

This is pure speculation on my part, but here is how I think things played out: his attitude probably has him borderline cocky, as opposed to confident in abilities. He comes back from New York to Quebec and immediately has the urge to get back in to the league right away, so he does things for himself, and that led to the suspension and whatnot. Rumors are in the background of NY, but remember, we don't have quite the rapport that other teams probably have with their own draft picks or others. So he is getting a slightly bad name for himself, and becomes the perfect player for NY to push to us. If he succeeds, then Arizona gets the better end of the trade. If he fails, the Rangers likely get the better end. It's all good b/c he is also now with his boy Domi, so he is at his best, and probably getting put in his place properly. Now, as things start to shift and we get younger, Duclair probably thought he had locked up a spot and didn't prep himself the best for last year. Now, the same things that apparently surfaced in juniors (leadership, challenging authority, and attitude) come back at the NHL level. Same thing this year, except maybe his attention to detail isn't as focused, and he is back into this "funk" that people put on the coaches, but maybe he has to take a step back and look at what will give his career longevity.

 

[AZviaNJ]

He's two years older and accomplished absolutely nothing at the NHL level. Why would we even consider that?

Aberg had moments of brilliance during the playoffs last year and Chayka was interested in Aberg during the offseason (per Morgan).

Aberg > late 2nd Rd pick.

 

[RABBIT]

The more i think about this, the more i'm okay with it. He doesn't seem to be motivated and there has to be something we don't know.

 

[ParisSaintGermain]

I wish him to succeed, I like him, but I am not that convinced he will ever be more than a fringe guy in the longer run. It makes sense to try to trade him now if the franchise - for good or bad- does not see him featuring in the long term picture at all.

 

[mpir3]

I follow a few of these guys on instagram ( Duclair, Strome...) I've seen more than a few times less than 10 minutes after some pathetic loss they are on instagram "liking" or "following" some girl or joking around. I get it they are young, professional hockey players with the world at their fingertips but their heads are clearly else where. I think there's quite a few guys on this time just happy to be cashing an NHL paycheck and living an NHL lifestyle.

 

[rt]

I follow a few of these guys on instagram ( Duclair, Strome...) I've seen more than a few times less than 10 minutes after some pathetic loss they are on instagram "liking" or "following" some girl or joking around. I get it they are young, professional hockey players with the world at their fingertips but their heads are clearly else where. I think there's quite a few guys on this time just happy to be cashing an NHL paycheck and living an NHL lifestyle.

There are worse ways to unwind and blow off steam after a terrible day at work than goofing around on social media.

 

[ParisSaintGermain]

I follow a few of these guys on instagram ( Duclair, Strome...) I've seen more than a few times less than 10 minutes after some pathetic loss they are on instagram "liking" or "following" some girl or joking around. I get it they are young, professional hockey players with the world at their fingertips but their heads are clearly else where. I think there's quite a few guys on this time just happy to be cashing an NHL paycheck and living an NHL lifestyle.

I was going to like your post then I realised I am a professional HFboarder and probably should not do that so quickly.

Joking aside, as Duclair was probably scratched during many of those games, I will give him credit for not liking any Instagram girls activity whilst watching the atrocity on the ice unravelling in front of his eyes.