Rumor: All Purpose Anthony Duclair Trade Talk (Duke requested trade, Coyotes trying to grant it)

[XX]

You do realize they fitness test players at the start of camp.

Yes, and I'd be floored if Derek Stepan did any better than Duclair. What odds do you give Stepan being criticized by the coaches?

If Duclair gave them an ultimatum last season or this summer, showing up out of shape is fine. Young players have one tool at their disposal to protect their career. He knows he'll get a shot somewhere else. It is what it is at this point - the organization failing another young player.

 

[Plub]

I don't know what it could be that we are not seeing. The players seem to love him. Nash always earnestly wants him to do well. Bizz was relieved for him when he scored after being scratched.

People around the team seem to genuinely love the dude. So what gives?

 

[hbk]

Yes, and I'd be floored if Derek Stepan did any better than Duclair. What odds do you give Stepan being criticized by the coaches?

If Duclair gave them an ultimatum last season or this summer, showing up out of shape is fine. Young players have one tool at their disposal to protect their career. He knows he'll get a shot somewhere else. It is what it is at this point - the organization failing another young player.

Its not fine. You are being ridiculous. Previous coach doesn't like your work ethic so when you get a new coach your reaction is to defeat this notion by not working. It doesn't scream great character to me. Most people would work their ass off to take advantage of the fresh start. That was the expectation.

Duclair showed up to camp out of shape and has rightly been punished for it. Tocchet isn't a great coach. Both can be true factual statements.

 

[XX]

Its not fine. You are being ridiculous.

Duclair showed up to camp out of shape and has rightly been punished for it. Tocchet isn't a great coach. Both can be true factual statements.

It's not punishment if it's what the player wants. I was pretty clear with that.

The way he has been treated despite his play tells me all I need to know. It's not congruous with the story they're trying to spin. I look forward to more info after his inevitable exit.

 

[Matias Maccete]

f*** this team man.

 

[Jamieh]

It's not punishment if it's what the player wants. I was pretty clear with that.

The way he has been treated despite his play tells me all I need to know. It's not congruous with the story they're trying to spin. I look forward to more info after his inevitable exit.

Seems this story keeps repeating with this player, It's way too easy to just keep blaming the team.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Seems like a trade would be best for both sides. Hopefully Chayka can get some value.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

Please don't. Even if it were that reason, is this the group of people you really want to discuss that with?

Nope, don’t see it. Attitude and not in hockey shape, nothing more.

 

[RABBIT]

Well this f***in sucks. I'm going to play the devil's advocate here and assume that Duclair is not making this easy on the Coyotes. Chayka has always been pretty high on him. In every interview he has grouped Duclair's name in with Clayton Keller, Max Domi, and other youngsters. There has to be something behind the scenes that we don't know about. There's no way a player that has that kind of speed and talent should be benched multiple nights. I'm going to hope that this franchise isn't shitting away talent for the f*** of it.

And if we are...then no matter how much I like Chayka, he needs to be canned along with Tocchet.

 

[RABBIT]

Also, I mentioned this in another thread before, but I think we need to do whatever we can to send him home to Quebec for Alex Galchenyuk. Even if it means adding another piece we don't necessarily want to get rid of, like Merkley of MacInnis.

I think someone else had mentioned that as well earlier in this thread

 

[DoanStopBelievin]

This is fine. If we combine the production we will get from our skilled young guys with potential like Rinaldo, Cousins, Archibald, Martinook, Rieder, Richardson, and Kempe for the next 5 years we will be able to replicate Duke’s 2017-18 second half production with his new team.

 

[rt]

My point is if you struggled badly and you have a fresh start why poison the relationship at the start of next season by not properly training? Like it or not it screams volumes about a lack of work ethic and character about a player.

Its not fine. You are being ridiculous. Previous coach doesn't like your work ethic so when you get a new coach your reaction is to defeat this notion by not working. It doesn't scream great character to me. Most people would work their ass off to take advantage of the fresh start. That was the expectation.

Duclair showed up to camp out of shape and has rightly been punished for it. Tocchet isn't a great coach. Both can be true factual statements.

It could be Duclair's fault. It's most likely Duclair's fault. Two coaching staffs have chucked him right under the wagon. There's probably a reason for it.

I have fears, though. Reservations. I worry.

Tocchet and Tippet have night and day systems. Their X's & O's are so different. I worry though that their approach and mentality is very much the same. Their preferences.

I suspect (without basis, albeit) that there are more progressive coaching staffs out there that could squeeze some very meaningful production out of this player.

Despite the circumstances, I see a net positive hockey player. I'm no scout. I'm no coach. From my couch, I see a kid who could easily flourish in the right ecosystem. Quite honestly, that environment is the one I wish desperately that we had here. The kind of team that makes Anthony Duclair a successful player is the kind of team I want to be a fan of.

I hoped Tocchet would be that guy. He's not. Most likely it's Duclair's fault. But damn. Damn I'd love to see what Todd Nelson or Sheldon Keefe could have figured out for him. If anything....

 

[Murf]

We can't seem to do right by him, so let him go somewhere else. Our people are too dumb to utilize his talents.

Wherever he ends up will be better for his presence.

 

[rt]

This is fine. If we combine the production we will get from our skilled young guys with potential like Rinaldo, Cousins, Archibald, Martinook, Rieder, Richardson, and Kempe for the next 5 years we will be able to replicate Duke’s 2017-18 second half production with his new team.

Good post.

 

[DoanStopBelievin]

Good post.

Just tryin’ to keep it positive like the post-game interviews.

“I liked how sticky the boys were tonight. We almost showed enough hockey skill to look competent out there”

 

[Sinurgy]

Of course they are...of f***ing course they are.

 

[Kaibur]

I'd sooner see Rieder or Martinook moved.
I get the idea of him coming into camp out of shape looking like a bad omen and maybe landing him initially in the dog house. But he's producing. He's one of the few. He shouldn't be in the dog house mid-season for something that happened in September when there are plenty of other guys that deserved to be benched right now. It's time to move on, one way or the other.
Maybe something around Duclair for Athanasiou?

 

[Jakey53]

You have a horrific season last year and your response is to come into training camp out of shape. Think about the message Duclair sent about how much he cares about his career with that statement. I loved the dUclair acquisition his hands and speed were enticing but it's tough love or get him the **** out of town time for him. Especially given how ****ty he was last year.

True, if he was out of shape, which I find hard to believe living with Domi and all, but still if it's true he has some growing up to do. If you want to discipline him fine, but do it to all the players, vets included.

 

[Jakey53]

My point is if you struggled badly and you have a fresh start why poison the relationship at the start of next season by not properly training? Like it or not it screams volumes about a lack of work ethic and character about a player.

Lack of work ethic which has resulted with inconsistency the last two years. There is something wrong with Duke that we as fans do not or can not see.

 

[Jakey53]

He doesn't seem out of shape to me. That seems like cover for the player wanting out and the coach using him as an excuse for his strange lineup decisions. Smoke to cover up the staff's inability to get guys to play on the same page. "It's not us, players are showing up out of shape/not sticky enough"

As if you can tell by sitting on your coach who is out of shape.

 

[Jakey53]

Yes, and I'd be floored if Derek Stepan did any better than Duclair. What odds do you give Stepan being criticized by the coaches?

If Duclair gave them an ultimatum last season or this summer, showing up out of shape is fine. Young players have one tool at their disposal to protect their career. He knows he'll get a shot somewhere else. It is what it is at this point - the organization failing another young player.

This is BS. Players like Duke with two years experience don' give teams ultimatums. They are in no position to do so, and if you think coming to camp out of shape is fine you are totally wrong.

 

[Jakey53]

Seems this story keeps repeating with this player, It's way too easy to just keep blaming the team.

Exactly. We all can see Duke's inconsistency with his play. I guess the question is why. Is he out of shape? Doesn't follow the system? Lack of effort to improve his over all play?

 

[Jakey53]

I don't know what it could be that we are not seeing. The players seem to love him. Nash always earnestly wants him to do well. Bizz was relieved for him when he scored after being scratched.

People around the team seem to genuinely love the dude. So what gives?

Your right, but players stick together thru thick and thin.

 

[rt]

I'd sooner see Rieder or Martinook moved.
I get the idea of him coming into camp out of shape looking like a bad omen and maybe landing him initially in the dog house. But he's producing. He's one of the few. He shouldn't be in the dog house mid-season for something that happened in September when there are plenty of other guys that deserved to be benched right now. It's time to move on, one way or the other.
Maybe something around Duclair for Athanasiou?

If your goal scorer is fat but still scores goals, does it matter he's fat?

 

[Neighborhood Coyote]

Exactly. We all can see Duke's inconsistency with his play. I guess the question is why. Is he out of shape? Doesn't follow the system? Lack of effort to improve his over all play?

Well, also to be fair, the whole team has been inconsistent. Name one player who HAS been consistent in his play besides Connauton with his play being bad. So why single out one guy for being inconsistent when pretty much everyone on the team is that way? Especially when the one guy is a young third year player and some of the others are vets who should know better. BUT, even with that inconsistency, he's producing better than most on this team.

Tocchet was the one who said Duke came into camp out of shape right? If so, I am not going to trust his word at it. He has reason to not be honest about that because he's the one responsible for a bad start. Also, how do we know that he can accurately judge that? His track record as a head coach is garbage. Plus, if it was true that Duke didn't show up in shape, others ALSO didn't show up in shape as well but here we are and he's the one that on the trade block while others get the ice time game after game.

All that doesn't matter much though. I agree with rt, if your goal scorer is fat but still scores goals, does it matter? One could argue about the attitude... but it comes down to producing. And, right now, Duke is one of the few producing on this team. He's doing better than last year and if he actually got all the ice time some other players get and the leash to go with it, he could have more.

I also agree with someone's point about what Duke has been asked to do. They keep asking him to do more defensively and put him on the checking lines. That's not his game. He's not your Selke winning forward and he never will be. Let the kid do what he does best and score goals/create offense. This team just takes what he's best at and tells him to focus on the opposite and then says "Oh look at how inconsistent he is and he's not doing a good job!". Just seems like bad talent management to me. I'd understand wanting him to round out his game more, of course... but you also have to play to his strengths. That's what a good coach would do.

As a fan it's frustrating. I see a player that the Yotes can really use and grow to be even better. However, it feels like this team is wasting it again. This team hasn't shown that it knows how to develop players at all (except into bottom 6 players maybe). It looked like maybe it was starting to get it with Domi and Duke's first year but look how they have been crushing that. Let's just hope this team doesn't ruin Keller.