Player Discussion: 2023 Vezina Finalist Connor Hellebuyck

[Huffer]

Helle + 2nd? for Swayman and DeBrusk?

Is this coming with the expectation that we extend Debrusk?

Not great value for Boston IMO.

 

[Joe Hallenback]

If I was Buffalo I would trade a non roster top prospect for Helly. Kulich or Savoie for Helly. Maybe UPL comes back to clear some room for Buffalo but that is all I think It would take. They are also at that point where they could offer up some conditional picks or some of their B prospects to get it done. They don't lose anyone off their roster and they still would have a ton of room to either sign him for 5 or 6 years at a high price while letting Lind develop in the AHL for a season or two. There top 4 D is set for a number of years and they still have a lot of quality forward prospects to work in the lineup for a number of years

I can't think of a better goalie for the way they play right now but the fan base seems really reluctant to do anything and they 100 percent believe some goalie coach guy on twitter that Helly wouldn't be good for them. Can you imagine them going another year and missing the playoffs? Maybe they leap frog over someone but until they show they can do it that will be one long playoff drought

 

[Jets4Life]

All Buffalo is lacking is a goalie and a little PO experience. If they had a goalie like Helle they would be ahead of Wpg, even if Wpg still had Helle.

lol.


Buffalo has not made the playoffs in over a decade, and finished well behind Winnipeg.

Winnipeg are not condensers.

What cup potential does Winnipeg have, please enlighten me because I am a fan and would love to have a glimmer of your hope?

Where did I say anything about Winnipeg being Stanley Cup contenders? You are claiming I said something that I never did.

 

[ps241]

lol.


Buffalo has not made the playoffs in over a decade, and finished well behind Winnipeg.



Where did I say anything about Winnipeg being Stanley Cup contenders? You are claiming I said something that I never did.

Correction. You said Winnipeg is ahead of Buffalo for "cup potential".

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

lol.


Buffalo has not made the playoffs in over a decade, and finished well behind Winnipeg.

lol yourself

That was then, this is now.
91 pts to 95 is not that far behind.

Look at the goaltending they had to get that 91 pts with.
If they have Helle and we don't, they are in and we are out.

 

[Jets4Life]

Correction. You said Winnipeg is ahead of Buffalo for "cup potential".

Technically, they are, so what is your point?

Buffalo have been doormats since 2011. Aside from Arizona, Buffalo has arguably been the most inept teams in the NHL, for the last decade. Winnipeg may not be in striking distance of a run at the cup, but to say Buffalo has a better shot at the Stanley Cup in 2023 is simply not true. Not to mention there was a period of time (2017-19), where many were saying that Winnipeg was one of the favourites to win the cup. The last time that happened in Buffalo was in 2007.

lol yourself

That was then, this is now.
91 pts to 95 is not that far behind.

Here is a math lesson: 95 points is greater than 91 points.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Here is a math lesson: 95 points is greater than 91 points.

Sure it is. But not by much.
Swap goalies and the difference is more than 4 pts and it is in Buffalo's favour.

 

[ps241]

I think he knows the Jets are not contenders

Buffalo???

Devils reach the contender dream with him IMO.

So NJ > Buffalo >>> Winnipeg (cup potential wise)

I have zero Idea if team Helle sees it that way.

This was my original post on this topic and it was in regards to Helle picking a team to sign with. As I stated here I think Connor knows the Jets are not a contender. I put a question mark beside Buffalo because I don't know how Hellebuyck would view them "going forward" as stated.

Technically, they are, so what is your point?

Buffalo have been doormats since 2011. Aside from Arizona, Buffalo has arguably been the most inept teams in the NHL, for the last decade. Winnipeg may not be in striking distance of a run at the cup, but to say Buffalo has a better shot at the Stanley Cup in 2023 is simply not true. Not to mention there was a period of time (2017-19), where many were saying that Winnipeg was one of the favourites to win the cup. The last time that happened in Buffalo was in 2007.



Here is a math lesson: 95 points is greater than 91 points.

I finished off with my rating of how I guessed Helle might see it IN MY OPINION. I believe NJ would reach his threshold since they are really young and ended up 3rd in the NHL regular season with 113 points. I think he would prefer Buffalo to Winnipeg since they are young and on the rise and I don't think he has any interest in extending in Winnipeg.

I have heard your take on Buffalo and agree on their past but moving foward I see a team that is really young, talented, with a very good prospect pipeline, that has been trending up sharply in the standings and I like where their current team is headed.

 

[Buffdog]

Technically, they are, so what is your point?

Buffalo have been doormats since 2011. Aside from Arizona, Buffalo has arguably been the most inept teams in the NHL, for the last decade. Winnipeg may not be in striking distance of a run at the cup, but to say Buffalo has a better shot at the Stanley Cup in 2023 is simply not true. Not to mention there was a period of time (2017-19), where many were saying that Winnipeg was one of the favourites to win the cup. The last time that happened in Buffalo was in 2007.



Here is a math lesson: 95 points is greater than 91 points.

You have to look at trajectories. Buffalo is rising, we're flat or falling

Next year isn't last year

 

[Jets4Life]

You have to look at trajectories. Buffalo is rising, we're flat or falling

Next year isn't last year

Want to place a wager on which team will perform better in 2023-24?

 

[Jets4Life]

So NJ > Buffalo >>> Winnipeg (cup potential wise)

This was your original post, Skippy...

I finished off with my rating of how I guessed Helle might see it IN MY OPINION. I believe NJ would reach his threshold since they are really young and ended up 3rd in the NHL regular season with 113 points. I think he would prefer Buffalo to Winnipeg since they are young and on the rise and I don't think he has any interest in extending in Winnipeg.

Why even bring up Buffalo in the first place. Hellebuyck has stated he wants to play for a team that is contending for the Stanley Cup.

 

[DRW204]

Last time I saw goal-posts being moved this much was when Tennessee beat Alabama

 

[JetsUK]

This was your original post, Skippy...



Why even bring up Buffalo in the first place, Skippy. Hellebuyck has stated he wants to play for a team that is contending for the Stanley Cup.

Who is Skippy?

I think we may be overselling the whole "Helle wants to play for a team that's contending for a Cup" vs the "Helle doesn't want to be part of a Jets rebuild" comments that were actually part of his exit media.

Helle's time to win the Cup is limited, and he has no appetite for a rebuild here. I don't see anywhere that he's limited his options to teams with immediate (and plausible) Cup pretensions and since he has no trade protection he's going wherever the Jets send him, if they send him.

IMO, the Jets are going to push the boat way, way out to sign him, even if it means throwing $$$$$ at him. Failing that, he's going to whomever offers the best return, whether that's with or without an extension.

I can see Helle okaying a trade to BUF, if he likes what he sees there and the money and term work. Or DET. Or most places, so long as they ain't ANA, SJ, AZ or the other certain bottom-feeders. But a team with top-end prospects and all kinds of firepower that lacks tending equal to the rest of the group -- AKA, the 2016-19 Jets -- yeah, I can see him being happy to sign on there, especially given his self-confidence and experience willing the Jets to wins year and out.

But I can easily see the org welcoming him back as a rental and letting him walk to FA. There will be reasons "We didn't like what we saw coming back in a trade / Blah blah blah" but if they win enough games and a round maybe they'll call it a win, as will many fans.

Whatever happens, it's likely last-minute, experience suggests.

 

[SLAYER]

Last time I saw goal-posts being moved this much was when Tennessee beat Alabama

I thought this was going to be a Matt Murray joke, I was pleasantly surprised.

 

[bennylundholm]

Hows about Helle and Big Stan to NJ for Vanacek, Marino and Holtz?

 

[Huffer]

Hows about Helle and Big Stan to NJ for Vanacek, Marino and Holtz?

Marino plays too important of a role (on the right), and at such a good contract for them to think about moving IMO. Adding Hellebucyk makes sense for them IMO, but losing Marino isn't a smart play for them when they are trying to win.

 

[bennylundholm]

Marino plays too important of a role (on the right), and at such a good contract for them to think about moving IMO. Adding Hellebucyk makes sense for them IMO, but losing Marino isn't a smart play for them when they are trying to win.

Good point.

 

[ps241]

This was your original post, Skippy...



Why even bring up Buffalo in the first place. Hellebuyck has stated he wants to play for a team that is contending for the Stanley Cup.

Yes I just quoted that exact op?

Not really sure this subject rises to the level of needing the snark?

Your opinion of Buffalo and mine differ.

 

[TommyKillian]

If I was Buffalo I would trade a non roster top prospect for Helly. Kulich or Savoie for Helly. Maybe UPL comes back to clear some room for Buffalo but that is all I think It would take. They are also at that point where they could offer up some conditional picks or some of their B prospects to get it done. They don't lose anyone off their roster and they still would have a ton of room to either sign him for 5 or 6 years at a high price while letting Lind develop in the AHL for a season or two. There top 4 D is set for a number of years and they still have a lot of quality forward prospects to work in the lineup for a number of years

I can't think of a better goalie for the way they play right now but the fan base seems really reluctant to do anything and they 100 percent believe some goalie coach guy on twitter that Helly wouldn't be good for them. Can you imagine them going another year and missing the playoffs? Maybe they leap frog over someone but until they show they can do it that will be one long playoff drought

The Sabres kind of remind me of the 2016-17 Jets. This may get convoluted, BUT if we had the option to trade for a goalie that is the equivalent of present-day Hellebuyck to mentor rookie-Hellebuyck for one year, and the cost was Jack Roslovic and a 2nd round pick, you do that all day long even without an extension. Looking back, 2016-17 was a mess with Pavelec playing for the Moose and getting called up to poop the bed for a few games, the Hutchinson drama, and then Helley struggling mightily all season long (after a very solid 26 game stretch in 2015-16, showing far more than Levi has to date). I think the Sabres are heading for something like that if they think Levi will magically be ready to lead their team to the playoffs.

I still look at 2016-17 as a bit of a lost season, because we had substantially the same team that made the conference finals the following year. With stable goaltending, that team could have made noise in those playoffs and had even more experience for the conference finals run. I feel the same about the Sabres this upcoming season. Given how strong their prospect pool is, Savoie or Kulich are not huge losses.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Want to place a wager on which team will perform better in 2023-24?

Depends which of the 2 Helle is playing for. If it is Buffalo, I bet on them. If it is neither, all bets are off. Can't pick a winner.

 

[DRW204]

The Sabres kind of remind me of the 2016-17 Jets. This may get convoluted, BUT if we had the option to trade for a goalie that is the equivalent of present-day Hellebuyck to mentor rookie-Hellebuyck for one year, and the cost was Jack Roslovic and a 2nd round pick, you do that all day long even without an extension. Looking back, 2016-17 was a mess with Pavelec playing for the Moose and getting called up to poop the bed for a few games, the Hutchinson drama, and then Helley struggling mightily all season long (after a very solid 26 game stretch in 2015-16, showing far more than Levi has to date). I think the Sabres are heading for something like that if they think Levi will magically be ready to lead their team to the playoffs.

I still look at 2016-17 as a bit of a lost season, because we had substantially the same team that made the conference finals the following year. With stable goaltending, that team could have made noise in those playoffs and had even more experience for the conference finals run. I feel the same about the Sabres this upcoming season. Given how strong their prospect pool is, Savoie or Kulich are not huge losses.

one of the funnier things (well, in hindsight) of 16-17 was laine comes in, scores a bunch of PP goals, says he's here to fix the PP then his PP TOI gets cut but still leads the team in PP goals lol.

anyway

the contrast i see w/ BUF is vs us in 16-17 is they do not need 920 goaltending to make the POs right now (given their offense is more or less in the same tier as 22-23). they missed the POs by 1 point with the 24th best team-SV%. they got 52 games out of UPL+Comrie with 888 combined SV%. Merely a 900 in those games - which would be roughly league average - is a diff. of 18 less GA.... probably comfortably in a PO position.

imo im surprised they didn't do essentially what we tried to do in 17-18 with Mason (atleast by my interpretation), or what NYI did with Sorokin/Varlamov, or DAL with Oettinger/Khudobin....get a low-term vet back-up that can play a good chunk of games games to help get the youngster acclimated.

it's easy to say in hindsight just at the cost of roslovic+2nd... but folks on this forum were scoffing at including roslovic for stone in 2018-2019 when roslovic actually showed something in the nhl. no one was going to do that deal for a 1 year goalie imo.

 

[10Ducky10]

Who is Skippy?

I think we may be overselling the whole "Helle wants to play for a team that's contending for a Cup" vs the "Helle doesn't want to be part of a Jets rebuild" comments that were actually part of his exit media.

Helle's time to win the Cup is limited, and he has no appetite for a rebuild here. I don't see anywhere that he's limited his options to teams with immediate (and plausible) Cup pretensions and since he has no trade protection he's going wherever the Jets send him, if they send him.

I can see Helle okaying a trade to BUF, if he likes what he sees there and the money and term work. Or DET. Or most places, so long as they ain't ANA, SJ, AZ or the other certain bottom-feeders. But a team with top-end prospects and all kinds of firepower that lacks tending equal to the rest of the group -- AKA, the 2016-19 Jets -- yeah, I can see him being happy to sign on there, especially given his self-confidence and experience willing the Jets to wins year and out.

But I can easily see the org welcoming him back as a rental and letting him walk to FA. There will be reasons "We didn't like what we saw coming back in a trade / Blah blah blah" but if they win enough games and a round maybe they'll call it a win, as will many fans.

Whatever happens, it's likely last-minute, experience suggests.

Chevy can trade Helle anywhere he wants. He has no NMC or NTC on his contract.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Hows about Helle and Big Stan to NJ for Vanacek, Marino and Holtz?

I would add a bit to that for that return.

NJD fans say flat absolute NOto Marino and some would reluctantly give up Holtz. Most would not and that is still without Marino. They only want to pay for Helle if we can make him 5 years younger. And extended.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Marino plays too important of a role (on the right), and at such a good contract for them to think about moving IMO. Adding Hellebucyk makes sense for them IMO, but losing Marino isn't a smart play for them when they are trying to win.

You sound like a Devils fan.

It makes more sense for them to try to win with Helle and without Marino than it does for them to try to win with Marino and without Helle. IMO, of course.

If Marino is gone they have Nemec. Its not like they would have a big hole on RD. The hole would be filled by a rookie, but a very talented one.

 

[KingBogo]

You sound like a Devils fan.

It makes more sense for them to try to win with Helle and without Marino than it does for them to try to win with Marino and without Helle. IMO, of course.

If Marino is gone they have Nemec. Its not like they would have a big hole on RD. The hole would be filled by a rookie, but a very talented one.

Nemec is a great prospect but he is still a few years away from being anywhere close to Marino and they are now in their contention window. I've read enough NJ fan posts by now to realize they regard Marino maybe a shade less than we feel about JoMo around here. No way you will ever get them to agree trading Marino is a good idea.