Prospect Info: 2018 Draft Thread (STL #1 via WPG is 29th OA)

[Halak Ness Monster]

Ive always been a BPA guy, but im getting a little concerned about the D depth in the organization. Can you find me Parayko or Edmundson’s twins in rd 1? Or Dunn? Id take all three of those guys in rd 1 this year....obviously.

You've got Petro, Parayko, Edmundson, Dunn in the top 4 for hopefully the next 5 years or so. That's why I'm not too concerned about it right now. That's one of the better top 4's in the game and 3 of the 4 aren't in their prime yet.

Then you've got Walman, Schmaltz, Mikkola, and now Reinke in the system to help fill out. That's not an eye popping group but I bet we can find at least one quality d-man in that group.

Plus 3rd pairing signings aren't too costly.

I still don't think there is an urgency to grab a 1st round d-man. If one is BPA then take him.

I would like to see us come away with at least 2 d-men if we have 7 picks. Continue to build up the depth.

 

[Evocable Manager]

We're going to lose Edmundson in the next expansion draft. Because I can't imagine Petro, Parayko or Dunn won't be protected.

Hopefully Walman/Mikkola will have developed by then.

 

[wannabebluesplayer]

The Blues don't necessarily have to lose anyone they don't want to, because much like with Vegas, the Blues could offer a trade. I'm not super worried about the next expansion draft. Several of the younger players will be exempt.

 

[LetsGoBooze]

Ive always been a BPA guy, but im getting a little concerned about the D depth in the organization. Can you find me Parayko or Edmundson’s twins in rd 1? Or Dunn? Id take all three of those guys in rd 1 this year....obviously.

How about McIsaac or Samuelsson? Although i really believe we won't be using our (Winnipeg) 1st this year, it'll be gone in a trade.

 

[Alklha]

We're going to lose Edmundson in the next expansion draft. Because I can't imagine Petro, Parayko or Dunn won't be protected.

Hopefully Walman/Mikkola will have developed by then.

2020 is a long way away in terms of guessing what our roster will look like.

Right now it looks pretty likely that we'd be protecting 8 skaters rather than 7 forwards & 3 defensemen. A lot can change though.

How about McIsaac or Samuelsson? Although i really believe we won't be using our (Winnipeg) 1st this year, it'll be gone in a trade.

I'd tend to agree that we'll likely trade the pick. I do think that moving Berglund or Sobotka will see us move into the early/middle second round though. That seems to be where a lot of defensemen are getting projected to go.

 

[Halak Ness Monster]

We're going to lose Edmundson in the next expansion draft. Because I can't imagine Petro, Parayko or Dunn won't be protected.

Hopefully Walman/Mikkola will have developed by then.

Minnesota traded Alex Tuch to Vegas in order to convince the Golden Knights to draft Erik Haula instead of Matt Dumba.

The Blues could be in position to make a similar move at the next expansion draft in order to protect their, then, 26 year old top pairing lefty d-man.

 

[BleedBlue14]

We're going to lose Edmundson in the next expansion draft. Because I can't imagine Petro, Parayko or Dunn won't be protected.

Hopefully Walman/Mikkola will have developed by then.

I don't think we can realistically let Eddy go. Look I'm a huuuge fan of Dunn but who else on our team/in our system is capable of playing 25 minutes a night with Petro? It's hard to project what our signings look like this offseason or next but I would much much rather lose a first and a decent prospect if we could do so to retain our defensemen and most of our forwards to have them not select one of our top 4/ or one of our top 6 forwards. Now will they take that who knows... I hope so though. These expansion drafts are getting annoying from a fans perspective.

 

[MissouriMook]

We're going to lose Edmundson in the next expansion draft. Because I can't imagine Petro, Parayko or Dunn won't be protected.

Hopefully Walman/Mikkola will have developed by then.

I agree. The only other way around that is to protect only 8 skaters, which would mean only protecting 4 forwards and I think there is a less than zero chance that happens.

The only other potential solution I have been able to come up with is only offering Edmundson a 2 year deal this off-season, maybe at a little higher AAV, to where he will be a UFA at the next expansion draft. We do that with the commitment of offering a long-term deal after the ED. I think we almost 100% lose him at the draft if we sign him to a longer term now. The risk then becomes, what are the odds you lose him in free agency anyway -in addition to- the player/prospect we lose in the ED?

 

[execwrite1]

First two picks - Left-hand d-men. Big need to fill this on organizational depth chart.

1st round - K'andre Miller
2nd round - Kevin Bahl

 

[stl76]

Why are we talking about losing Edmundson in the 2020 expansion draft in the 2018 NHL draft thread?

Bigger question: why the hell are we talking about losing Edmundson in the 2020 expansion draft at all? I would be shocked if the team didn't find a way to lock Ed up long term and keep him. Ed is not a player you let go in an expansion draft...he is worth trading a pick or prospect to keep.

 

[Evocable Manager]

2020 is a long way away in terms of guessing what our roster will look like.

Right now it looks pretty likely that we'd be protecting 8 skaters rather than 7 forwards & 3 defensemen. A lot can change though.

I'd tend to agree that we'll likely trade the pick. I do think that moving Berglund or Sobotka will see us move into the early/middle second round though. That seems to be where a lot of defensemen are getting projected to go.

Why would we protect less players than we're able too? We don't know what will happen with our forwards but two seasons from now I doubt that our defense will change much outside of Bouwmeester and Gunnarsson being gone with internal replacements. I'd be surprised if it did look much different.

It's not out of the question. Edmundson is a quality player but he isn't completely irreplaceable. So I don't see why we would protect him over our better defenseman especially if Walman is ready to go.

It's entirely possible we have an overload of young forwards and can package some of our lower end talented forward prospects (Blais, Barbashev, etc) in a deal to keep Edmundson.

 

[Mike Liut]

Why are we talking about losing Edmundson in the 2020 expansion draft in the 2018 NHL draft thread?

Bigger question: why the hell are we talking about losing Edmundson in the 2020 expansion draft at all? I would be shocked if the team didn't find a way to lock Ed up long term and keep him. Ed is not a player you let go in an expansion draft...he is worth trading a pick or prospect to keep.

if you can only protect 3 dmen, you’ll have to choose between Petro, Parayko, Dunn and Edmundson.

 

[stl76]

if you can only protect 3 dmen, you’ll have to choose between Petro, Parayko, Dunn and Edmundson.

The rules are going to be the same as last time, we can choose to protect 4 dmen if we want. Or we can trade picks/prospects to Seattle in return for them not taking Edmundson.

Not directing this at you necessarily Mike, but it is stunning to me how underrated Edmundson still is around here.

 

[Alklha]

Why would we protect less players than we're able too? We don't know what will happen with our forwards but two seasons from now I doubt that our defense will change much outside of Bouwmeester and Gunnarsson being gone with internal replacements. I'd be surprised if it did look much different.

It's not out of the question. Edmundson is a quality player but he isn't completely irreplaceable. So I don't see why we would protect him over our better defenseman especially if Walman is ready to go.

It's entirely possible we have an overload of young forwards and can package some of our lower end talented forward prospects (Blais, Barbashev, etc) in a deal to keep Edmundson.

You are viewing it from the wrong perspective. It doesn't matter that we'd be protecting less players than we're able to.

There is only one question that matters... is your fourth defenseman more valuable to your roster than your fifth forward? If the answer to that question is yes, then you protect 8 skaters. Seattle can still only select one player.

The forwards that would require protection are: Tarasenko, Steen, Schwartz, Schenn, Berglund, Jaškin, Fabbri, Thompson, Stevens, Barbashev, Soshnikov, Sundqvist, Sanford & Blais. Plus any established NHL players we add between now and the expansion draft.

We don't know if there will be 5 guys who are unquestionably more valuable in 2020. We can safely say that 3 will. If Thomas and Kyrou/Kostin/Foley develop as we hope, then the 5th guy could be a third liner on our roster. It's far easier to replace a good winger than it is to replace a quality defenseman that works well on your team. Schenn is a UFA in 2020, our roster composition might mean we can wait to sign him until after the expansion draft. Most other teams are protecting 7 forwards, it makes it easier to trade a high value forward before the draft and get a good return. Etc.

There are way too many variables between now and then to know what's going to happen. Protecting 8 skaters could make the most sense, like it did for Nashville last year.

 

[Mike Liut]

The rules are going to be the same as last time, we can choose to protect 4 dmen if we want. Or we can trade picks/prospects to Seattle in return for them not taking Edmundson.

Not directing this at you necessarily Mike, but it is stunning to me how underrated Edmundson still is around here.

I definitely don’t underrate big nasty Ed. I’m as old school as it gets when it comes to physicality. I want a mean ass team and he fits my mold perfectly. Also, I forgot you can protect 4 dmen if you go that route. Going to be very interesting to say the least when it comes down to the expansion draft. As some said, trades/draft picks could happen too. Probably going to lose somebody though.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Petro and Schenn are UFA after the 2019-2020 season. We could leave them exposed and resign them after the draft. Letting us protect Ed, Colt, and Dunn.

 

[Alklha]

So this is why we want to add some defensemen in the draft?

We can just sign Fabbro as a college FA in 2020, right?

 

[stl76]

I definitely don’t underrate big nasty Ed. I’m as old school as it gets when it comes to physicality. I want a mean ass team and he fits my mold perfectly. Also, I forgot you can protect 4 dmen if you go that route. Going to be very interesting to say the least when it comes down to the expansion draft. As some said, trades/draft picks could happen too. Probably going to lose somebody though.

For sure, very likely we will end up losing someone we would rather not. That's just the way it goes for teams with good depth tho. It'll definitely be interesting to see how DA and management handles the expansion draft this time around, but I'm not really too worried right now.

Petro and Schenn are UFA after the 2019-2020 season. We could leave them exposed and resign them after the draft. Letting us protect Ed, Colt, and Dunn.

This is a really good point. Not sure I would really feel 100% comfortable leaving those guys as UFAs, especially Pietrangelo, but that is definitely an option.




All in all, I hope we lock Ed up for as long as possible at around 4 million and worry about the expansion draft later. The Blues have played 13 games without Ed this season; they are 4-7-2 in those games. Yikes.

Is it too early to start a 2020 Expansion Draft thread for this convo so we can leave this thread to 2018 Draft talk?

 

[Linkens Mastery]

For sure, very likely we will end up losing someone we would rather not. That's just the way it goes for teams with good depth tho. It'll definitely be interesting to see how DA and management handles the expansion draft this time around, but I'm not really too worried right now.


This is a really good point. Not sure I would really feel 100% comfortable leaving those guys as UFAs, especially Pietrangelo, but that is definitely an option.




All in all, I hope we lock Ed up for as long as possible at around 4 million and worry about the expansion draft later. The Blues have played 13 games without Ed this season; they are 4-7-2 in those games. Yikes.

Is it too early to start a 2020 Expansion Draft thread for this convo so we can leave this thread to 2018 Draft talk?

The past expansion draft was before July 1st, so we could come to agreement on deals beforehand then sign them the day after the expansion draft.

 

[Alklha]

This is probably best directed at @Ranksu, but does anyone see much of Jesperi Kotkaniemi? Half the time I've seen him it looks like he is looks very good for a 17 year old playing in Liiga; decisive, big body, skates well and seems to read the game reasonably. The other half he looks like he can't make the simple play to save his life.

 

[Ranksu]

This is probably best directed at @Ranksu, but does anyone see much of Jesperi Kotkaniemi? Half the time I've seen him it looks like he is looks very good for a 17 year old playing in Liiga; decisive, big body, skates well and seems to read the game reasonably. The other half he looks like he can't make the simple play to save his life.

I think you sum up perfectly what Kotkaniemi is. 17-year kid who is stellar at mens league. His physical form has taked biggest grow in this year and when add there nasty edge on his game, he loves to play hard (hits) and 1on1 battles he's for sure ready for NA rink in his rookie year. Maybe add he's strong with puck and doesn't afraid to hard on net, only negative value has been that he kind of tries too hard to 'dangle' himself and won't give up the puck easily to other teammates, but he normally carry on the line where he's playing. When games are on the line he plays shows best performance.

Last sentence I guess its from that he doesn't want to give up the puck when needed.

If Kotkaniemi falls #20-31, he's steal. I think he'll go #10-15 spot, so we don't have any change to get him with Jets pick.


Short search, somebody has already done preview of him. Have to watch it before can say is that vid legit.



If you like to compare something, his gamestyle looks so much what Mikko Rantanen has, minus his shot.

 

[OSA]

I think you sum up perfectly what Kotkaniemi is. 17-year kid who is stellar at mens league. His physical form has taked biggest grow in this year and when add there nasty edge on his game, he loves to play hard (hits) and 1on1 battles he's for sure ready for NA rink in his rookie year. Maybe add he's strong with puck and doesn't afraid to hard on net, only negative value has been that he kind of tries too hard to 'dangle' himself and won't give up the puck easily to other teammates, but he normally carry on the line where he's playing. When games are on the line he plays shows best performance.

Last sentence I guess its from that he doesn't want to give up the puck when needed.

If Kotkaniemi falls #20-31, he's steal. I think he'll go #10-15 spot, so we don't have any change to get him with Jets pick.


Short search, somebody has already done preview of him. Have to watch it before can say is that vid legit.



If you like to compare something, his gamestyle looks so much what Mikko Rantanen has, minus his shot.

I heard Craig Button compare him to Kopitar today

 

[Alklha]

I think you sum up perfectly what Kotkaniemi is. 17-year kid who is stellar at mens league. His physical form has taked biggest grow in this year and when add there nasty edge on his game, he loves to play hard (hits) and 1on1 battles he's for sure ready for NA rink in his rookie year. Maybe add he's strong with puck and doesn't afraid to hard on net, only negative value has been that he kind of tries too hard to 'dangle' himself and won't give up the puck easily to other teammates, but he normally carry on the line where he's playing. When games are on the line he plays shows best performance.

Last sentence I guess its from that he doesn't want to give up the puck when needed.

If Kotkaniemi falls #20-31, he's steal. I think he'll go #10-15 spot, so we don't have any change to get him with Jets pick.


Short search, somebody has already done preview of him. Have to watch it before can say is that vid legit.



If you like to compare something, his gamestyle looks so much what Mikko Rantanen has, minus his shot.

Do you think it is just that he is only 17 and playing against men?

My main concern with him is his overall awareness of what is around him as a play develops. That might just be him being young and trying to do too much. He is currently reading the game much better without the puck than he does with it on his stick.

He clearly has a game for the NHL, it's just whether he'll be closer to a Berglund or a Kopitar.

 

[Ranksu]

I heard Craig Button compare him to Kopitar today

Is there link?

Do you think it is just that he is only 17 and playing against men?


He clearly has a game for the NHL, it's just whether he'll be closer to a Berglund or a Kopitar.

Hard to say is it from he's just 17 which would be ofc be easiest to say, but I think there lies some truth about his game what need to develope. One is that In Liiga he has time and space for it, but in NA rink is totally different. Like compare to Puljujärvi who has all the skill, but doesn't have yet physically there yet what need to be in NHL level. So with Kotkaniemi he might be ready for NHL level with his physical form, but his game speed and learning fast pace game is what could take time to transition to NHL level and knowing he likes to hold on the puck it could be problematic.

Compare to Berglund or Kopitar, I stay silenced.

 

[DatDude44]

I know RD is by no means a need but you still want to have quality defensemen despite handedness in the cup board down the road.(I'm still not sold on schmaltz) I think Calen Addison has gostisbehere level of offensive abilities and intangibles and can skate well too. would love to see us snag him in the 2nd rd w/ a pick maybe from moving berg/soby. Just projecting 2 years after this draft when he'd most likely be turning pro having a potential high end puck mover and d-man that creates alot of offense on an ELC on our 3rd pair behind Petro and parayko could be a big help down the road.


This is of course if all of Bokk, denisenko, kravtsov and olofsson are off the board at this point. I recommend looking into this olofsson kid, his stats don't jump off the charts for you, but just give him the eye test, I really think he could be very similiar to a viktor arvidsson.