Prospect Info: 2016 Marlies and Prospects Thread

[Joey Hoser]

He was almost ppg in a league where players with offensive skills light it up.

You don't see many q players that go on to be top-6ers put up low numbers like that. Gauthier was always seen as a defense first player, which is why I was disappointed when they drafted him.

The Q isn't the a higher-scoring league anymore and hasn't really been for over a decade, if that was what you were trying to imply about the Q.

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[topched]

At age 17 that's just not true.

This exactly.

Gauthier draft year: 60 points in 62 GP, drafted 21st in 2013

Player B draft year: 62 points in 64 GP, drafted 24th in 2014

Very similar production in their draft years, both Centres. Player B had a nice jump in production in his Draft + 1 year.

If you haven't hit hockey db yet, played B is Jared McCann.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Kinda depends.

Is Gauthier just a replaceable fourth liner guy, or somebody who can actually be relied on to shutdown high-end players?

Is Johnson an offensive catalyst who can score 30 by himself? Or is he a 20 goal scorer if you put him in all the right situations?

I have a lot more confidence in Gauthier being an important player than Johnson, though that will be partly because I'm not as high on Johnson as many people seem to be.

It's hard to say for me. It may come down to a matter of opinion, and that's what being a fan is all about.

Andreas Johnson is pretty polished, he's had a steady slow development, seems more about seeing him adapt to a faster game on a smaller ice surface.

Ya I would imagine if Andreas Johnson makes it he will be a more valuable player than Gauthier. Again nothing necessarily wrong with the Gauthier pick as the Leafs did expect him to becomes likely a #2 C which isn't a bad ceiling (I would argue that it wasn't the best expectation even when you get rid of hindsight).

I still think taking a player like Shinkurak is probably the better player to take. He without a doubt has the higher upside. I would mention others but I remember for a fact that there was debate on whether to take Shinkurak or Gauthier amongst Leaf fans.

My choices for that draft were Rychel (taken), Burakovsky, and Shinkaruk.

I was really cheesed at the time of the draft/free agency - Trading 3 picks for Bolland, drafting Gauthier, and then re-signing Bozak, along with getting Clarkson.

I was wrong with Bozak, but everything else I feel pretty vindicated.

 

[Stand Witness]

This exactly.

Gauthier draft year: 60 points in 62 GP, drafted 21st in 2013

Player B draft year: 62 points in 64 GP, drafted 24th in 2014

Very similar production in their draft years, both Centres. Player B had a nice jump in production in his Draft + 1 year.

If you haven't hit hockey db yet, played B is Jared McCann.

Easy to say that looking at just the numbers but anyone who has watched the two would know that McCann has a waaaay higher offensive ceiling.





And here is Horvat as well:

 

[topched]

Easy to say that looking at just the numbers but anyone who has watched the two would know that McCann has a waaaay higher offensive ceiling.

Oh I agree. I was just trying to illustrate that point production isn't everything.

Also, McCann was higher ceiling but lower floor. Gauthier with a 6'4 body and maybe the best defensive instincts in the draft (according to reports) is probably higher floor. That was the rationale for the ranking. It's looking to come true, given that Gauthier hasn't produced the offense but can still be a good and useful NHLer, which I'm not sure would have been true with McCann

 

[thewave]

Oh I agree. I was just trying to illustrate that point production isn't everything.

Also, McCann was higher ceiling but lower floor. Gauthier with a 6'4 body and maybe the best defensive instincts in the draft (according to reports) is probably higher floor. That was the rationale for the ranking. It's looking to come true, given that Gauthier hasn't produced the offense but can still be a good and useful NHLer, which I'm not sure would have been true with McCann

Goat is the prototypical Canadian shutdown C. His entire grooming has been for this from CHL up to now. Big enough to play against PFs and fast enough to get back in most situations. I would say they are trying to make an elite shutdown guy out of him.

I don't worry about the Goat at all. Important cog.

 

[sommervr]

Gauthier Gauthier Gauthier. The guy is a bust get over it. He won't be a leaf past the summer.

 

[thewave]

Gauthier Gauthier Gauthier. The guy is a bust get over it. He won't be a leaf past the summer.

.

We'll just have to wait and see.

 

[showtime8]

Gauthier Gauthier Gauthier. The guy is a bust get over it. He won't be a leaf past the summer.

Do you think that Andreas Johnson and Connor Brown are busts?

 

[mikebel111*]

Gauthier Gauthier Gauthier. The guy is a bust get over it. He won't be a leaf past the summer.

Cognitive dissonance look it up. You guys have the self-awareness of fruit flies.

Actually your favorite Rupert is a bust. The better awareness you get on that, the better

Gauthier beats out Rupert for a spot.

See that?

the state of having inconsistent thoughts, beliefs, or attitudes, especially as relating to behavioral decisions and attitude change.

I think thats a accurate word for your false beliefs

 

[deletethis]

Gauthier Gauthier Gauthier. The guy is a bust get over it. He won't be a leaf past the summer.

Okay, you're probably right. Such is the nature of sports fanaticism to override the logic center of our brains.

There is a legit chance that the Leafs may find someone who will try him out since there were these guys at Hockey Canada who chose him twice for Team Canada at the World Juniors. Maybe Edmonton?

 

[mikebel111*]

Okay, you're probably right. Such is the nature of sports fanaticism to override the logic center of our brains.

There is a legit chance that the Leafs may find someone who will try him out since there were these guys at Hockey Canada who chose him twice for Team Canada at the World Juniors. Maybe Edmonton?

More like he is probably wrong, and the way Gauthier has played this season. Impressive season for him. Basically the anti bust. It looks like he is wrong

 

[showtime8]

More like he is probably wrong, and the way Gauthier has played this season. Impressive season for him. Basically the anti bust. It looks like he is wrong

I think the biggest thing is that you people should realize that you build a team with a variety of different players.

Not every player has to play the same and not every player has to have the same level of where he projects to be.

 

[deletethis]

More like he is probably wrong, and the way Gauthier has played this season. Impressive season for him. Basically the anti bust. It looks like he is wrong

You have a loose definition of the word impressive.

 

[mikebel111*]

You have a loose definition of the word impressive.

Not really. Watching him play I know he has looked good.

 

[mikebel111*]

I think the biggest thing is that you people should realize that you build a team with a variety of different players.

Not every player has to play the same and not every player has to have the same level of where he projects to be.

Exactly. Gauthier isnt my favorite but he has a skill that every team needs. Sure not much offense but the elite defence, I will take it.

 

[deletethis]

I think the biggest thing is that you people should realize that you build a team with a variety of different players.

Not every player has to play the same and not every player has to have the same level of where he projects to be.

I think the bigger thing to note is that Gauthier has to have a lot more success at the AHL level before getting into that conversation. Fans have been through these same prospect discussions before about Biggs, about Finn, about Blacker, about Ryan, about Ross, about Percy whose time to advance is fleeting. I remember reading that Biggs and Ryan were going to become great defensive wingers. Finn, Blacker, Percy will become 3rd pairing guys, they just need a little time to adjust to pro hockey. Fan optimism. I know I suffer from it too.

 

[Tigerarmy]

Gauthier Gauthier Gauthier. The guy is a bust get over it. He won't be a leaf past the summer.

Your wrong buddy, i'm not a big fan of Gauthier but he will be a useful nhl player. He's just not gonna be a top 6 guy but all his coaches will love him. Keefe enjoys coaching him and remember he is still 20 and far from a developed prospect. Gauthier is certainly not the type of first rd pick the new regime would have picked but you need many different types of players to have a successful franchise We all have our opinion
so we will see what happens

 

[showtime8]

I think the bigger thing to note is that Gauthier has to have a lot more success at the AHL level before getting into that conversation. Fans have been through these same prospect discussions before about Biggs, about Finn, about Blacker, about Ryan, about Ross, about Percy whose time to advance is fleeting. I remember reading that Biggs and Ryan were going to become great defensive wingers. Finn, Blacker, Percy will become 3rd pairing guys, they just need a little time to adjust to pro hockey. Fan optimism. I know I suffer from it too.

As much as we've had those talks before, how many of them actually had the clear path as to what to expect from them and a spot to play in the line-up.

For the longest time, the Leafs have had prospects just go to the Marlies and let them fade out to go somewhere else.

Think about it. How many guys can you name where they were actually developed with the Marlies and then brought up to the Leafs and sustained a full-time role?

It was either you were coming right into the line-up or thats it.

 

[topched]

I think the bigger thing to note is that Gauthier has to have a lot more success at the AHL level before getting into that conversation. Fans have been through these same prospect discussions before about Biggs, about Finn, about Blacker, about Ryan, about Ross, about Percy whose time to advance is fleeting. I remember reading that Biggs and Ryan were going to become great defensive wingers. Finn, Blacker, Percy will become 3rd pairing guys, they just need a little time to adjust to pro hockey. Fan optimism. I know I suffer from it too.

The difference is that Biggs, Ryan, Finn and Blacker never actually put together even half a good Ahl season. Gauthier is getting rave reviews from coaching and mgmt about his play that were never there with those other prospects. Better yet, he's doing it while not putting up gaudy offensive numbers.

I get the guarded nature some will have after years of prospects flaming out at the Ahl level or earlier, but I think everyone will come around on Gauthier when he starts playing for the Leafs (he'll get there long before he puts up anywhere near ppg in the A).

You can chalk up the talk from Dubas and Keefe on Gauthier to tire pumping, but we were in a place with those other prospects where things were very thin. We had loud GMs in Burke and Nonis who said far less about those players than has been said about Gauthier

 

[Rielly4]

Soshnikov and Johnson should find spots on the leafs soon enough if they can play a solid two way game.

 

[Menzinger]

Gauthier Gauthier Gauthier. The guy is a bust get over it. He won't be a leaf past the summer.

I'm definitely not very high on the guy compared to others - but I do see value here.

He can't really put the puck in the net - but he is good at defensive play particularly at shut suppression and at using his large frame to protect the puck (kind of we wished Colbourne played while he was here).

So I see him potentially being a useful utility forward who can excel on the penalty kill.

 

[showtime8]

Soshnikov and Johnson should find spots on the leafs soon enough if they can play a solid two way game.

I believe Soshnikov is the next guy to be called up.

And although a lot of people think Johnson has a good chance to make the team next year out of training camp, I believe he'll have at least 1/2 a season with the Marlies before he gets called up.

 

[BertCorbeau]

I think Gauthier will actually do quite well going forward. For his lack of offensive creativity and skill, he should be able to play quite effectively in Babcock's system and should be good on the cycle. Give him and his line a simple offensive game to execute in the offensive zone and I think they'll get the job done. His output will heavily depend on the quality of his linemates. The kind of player that can look better than he actually is (offensively speaking) and may garner some good trade value.

 

[showtime8]

I think Gauthier will actually do quite well going forward. For his lack of offensive creativity and skill, he should be able to play quite effectively in Babcock's system and should be good on the cycle. Give him and his line a simple offensive game to execute in the offensive zone and I think they'll get the job done. His output will heavily depend on the quality of his linemates. The kind of player that can look better than he actually is (offensively speaking) and may garner some good trade value.

To be honest, I'm not concerned about his offensive output and I don't think the Leafs should be either.

You want him to be responsible and do all the work for the guys around him and let them score. Kind of like what Bozak did for Kessel.

If Gauthier can go into the corners, set up the cycle and retrieve the puck and also be the first guy back to take the 3rd man in, then I'd consider that a win.