Rumor: 2014/2015 Season Trade Rumours and Proposals VII - and a title to be named later

[Benjamin]

Neil to NSH for a 2nd.

I hate posts like this.

 

[Sens Mile]

He certainly could be valuable to a few teams looking to have a tough guy

I doubt we'd get much of anything in return, probably a 3rd

We need picks, a 3rd is a legitimate prospect we can add to our development system. I think it would be a 3rd and a 6th type deal instead of a 2nd round pick

 

[Burrowsaurus]

When did this mercenary attitude suddenly become more valuable than loyalty to an organization?

Bourque and Alfie both tarnished their reps a little wanting to chase a cup. Riding on another team's coattails for a championship win is NOT something to be held in high regard, it is what it is, nothing more.

Winning is priority number 1. Should be for players. Should be for teams.

 

[operasen]

Neil and Phillips have made millions as professionals in the NHL. Part of that routine is understanding that you may be moved. Now, when the end is so clear, they are stating they do not wish to honour that part of the deal.

Its time these guys were thanked profusely for their long-term service and shown the door to the next step in their professional career - while continuing to make millions and millions of dollars.

We've all appreciated what they brought back in the day. Right now they are in the path of developing new, younger, more adaptable (for the future) stars.

And while we are at it. Smith, Michalek and maybe Legwand should be evaluated against who's spot they are taking. Prince, Puempel, Grant, Robinson, etc say hello.

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

Which is why bertuzzi is no longer a red wing. They cut him loose. Maltby and draper were good fourth liners that played massive roles in cup wins and finals. And they were still serviceable.

And even so. Zetterberg datsyuk were the priorities there. Not maltby and draper.

We have let stars go. In pretty embarrassing fashion. Yet Chris Neil is dotted over. We essentially have the guy a full no movement clause lol.

Chris Neil is still servicable, but he's really going to shine in the playoffs. Something he's not going to see in Ottawa this season. Maltby, Draper and Clearly weren't head and shoulders superior players to chris neil, they were aging, decent grinders that filled a niche, like Neil.

Im not against trading Neil, for the record. Given the state of the franchise, and the stage of his career it could be a beneficial move for both sides. There is going to be interest in him from playoff teams that need a boost of grit and ferocity on the forecheck. The potential return could very well surprise a lot of people around here, especially those predicting that a 3rd or a 4th is the best Neil would fetch.

Also star players leaving Ottawa has absolutely nothing to do with who is playing on the fourth line.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

It's not always about maximizing the product on the ice. Sometimes, just doing the right thing for the player involved is simply the right thing to do.

I'd rather be a fan of an organization (or part of a workplace) that wins a bit less, or makes a bit less profit, but treats its people like human beings instead of pieces of meat.

Define "treating players like pieces of meat" does that mean trades?

 

[Micklebot]

About Fisher, nobody knows what the difference was, just Murray's own words that better offers were turned down. If it was an extra 5th or a spot or two higher then I agree with trading him to Nashville, otherwise it's not a wise move.

I can also get behind your take on the Phillips situation, at the very least I don't understand how a two year extension was given instead of a one year deal. Even at the time that contract was a little too long.

A couple possibilities come to mind:

1. They thought he had more left in the tank, and that he would bounce back.
2. They fully expected it to be a retirement contract, and the extra year didn't really matter to them. My guess is they have plans for Phillips after he's no longer playing (kinda like Richards). Cap space isn't an issue, so the extra year is just money that they may have been willing to at least in part pay him for other services (player coach transition, or otherwise).
3. Embarassing pictures.

 

[Benjamin]

We turned Alex Auld into Mark Stone. It was "only a 5th".

Phillips and Neil should have no more say in if they are trading then there contract allows.

Theres gotta be a limit on being nice. This is still a business and organization trying to win a cup.

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

We turned Alex Auld into Mark Stone. It was "only a 5th".

Phillips and Neil should have no more say in if they are trading then there contract allows.

Theres gotta be a limit on being nice. This is still a business and organization trying to win a cup.

This isn't trading Pokemon cards. These are people. Business or not, gotta treat them with respect. There is more to it than just business.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

We turned Alex Auld into Mark Stone. It was "only a 5th".

Phillips and Neil should have no more say in if they are trading then there contract allows.

Theres gotta be a limit on being nice. This is still a business and organization trying to win a cup.

Your second paragraph is exactly it.

Nice was even giving them that much money and restrictions.
I mean. How many seventh d man and fourth line wingers get paid that much and have the priviledge of any form of NTC's. (I'm actually curious).

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

Murray admitted that he turned down better offers in the Fisher deal so he could trade him to Nashville, not sure I'd use that as a good example. I really can't think of one visible benefit that has come from Murray's player loyalty so far. We got extra multiple years out of Chris Phillips and Chris Neil.. yay? Both of those guys should of been traded 4 years ago when we could actually get good value for them while we were rebuilding (I'd include Spezza in that list too). Not related, but more example of wasted assets were all those UFA's we never traded and had allowed to walk away for nothing, so much wasted assets. That's basically how I could summarize the Sens for the past 7 years.

Results should be what earns loyalty, and when the results clearly stop, the loyalty goes with it. That's the way championship teams do things.

It's a great accomplishment that Phillips is about to break the franchise GP record, but he really shouldn't have come close to it if we're being real here.

That's why I used Fisher as an example. Didn't a player we acquired or resigned specifically ask Fisher about Ottawa and he had nothing but great things to say? I forget the player but I'm pretty sure I read an article on it.

Was it Legwand?

 

[Do Make Say Think]

We need picks, a 3rd is a legitimate prospect we can add to our development system. I think it would be a 3rd and a 6th type deal instead of a 2nd round pick

We need picks as much as any team that isn't spending to the cap

What we need is top end talent, a 3rd isn't likely to turn into that and in the off-chance it does it will take probably around 3 years

 

[Burrowsaurus]

This isn't trading Pokemon cards. These are people. Business or not, gotta treat them with respect. There is more to it than just business.

Okay well we didn't treat rundblad with respect. We hyped him constantly. And then poof. Traded.

Silfverberg the same.

We are a team in transition. And assets have to be used to help our future. We have allowed them to chose teams they won't go to. They can automatically tick off the 15 worst teams in the entire NHL. Quite the thigh to do for them. They don't even have to play for a bad team if they don't want to. How many players are afforded that luxury? Phillips and Neil have been coddled for too long. And now they are just takin advantage.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

That's why I used Fisher as an example. Didn't a player we acquired or resigned specifically ask Fisher about Ottawa and he had nothing but great things to say? I forget the player but I'm pretty sure I read an article on it.

Was it Legwand?

It was

 

[Ice-Tray]

So much bitterness here. Often I am disgusted by some of the attitudes shown here by some fans, and this is yet another example, especially given that it is all based on speculation and rumour.

Neither Neiler nor Phillips control if Murray trades them or not, they do have every right to answer honestly though when asked if they would like to be moved. Wanting to stay with the only team you have played for until the end, is a much stronger and more courageous stance to take, then to jump ship to the best team possible in hopes of winning a championship with a team you have nothing to do with. The fact that some of you can see that is beyond sad, for you. Winning is not actually the first and only priority for people, and nor should it be.

They have played here long enough to be afforded that respect, by our GM, who seems to value the interpersonal relationships that are formed between people.

The excitement shown here by people drooling over trading legacy players for 3rd round picks is astonishing, though it seems to fit with the increased role that video games play in people's lives, and with current entitled generation. Big on opinions, small on wisdom.

So many so quick to put their own entertainment in front of the lives and livelihoods of others, willing to toss away good people when they feel they are no longer good enough to satisfy whatever standards they have set.

The "hockey is a business" crowd that is so ready to adopt this mantra, the same ideals that lead banks and financial institutions to screw millions of people without and sense of moral obligation. Hockey is a big family, and a community, and yet some posters here demand that it become something colder, less loyal, less respectful. When did these become admirable traits?

Personally I despise people who force others to operate under those conditions, and I feel sorry for those who celebrate them as though they are something to aspire to.

There's my rant of the day, flame away...

 

[Burrowsaurus]

So much bitterness here. Often I am disgusted by some of the attitudes shown here by some fans, and this is yet another example, especially given that it is all based on speculation and rumour.

Neither Neiler nor Phillips control if Murray trades them or not, they do have every right to answer honestly though when asked if they would like to be moved. Wanting to stay with the only team you have played for until the end, is a much stronger and more courageous stance to take, then to jump ship to the best team possible in hopes of winning a championship with a team you have nothing to do with. The fact that some of you can see that is beyond sad, for you. Winning is not actually the first and only priority for people, and nor should it be.

They have played here long enough to be afforded that respect, by our GM, who seems to value the interpersonal relationships that are formed between people.

The excitement shown here by people drooling over trading legacy players for 3rd round picks is astonishing, though it seems to fit with the increased role that video games play in people's lives, and with current entitled generation. Big on opinions, small on wisdom.

So many so quick to put their own entertainment in front of the lives and livelihoods of others, willing to toss away good people when they feel they are no longer good enough to satisfy whatever standards they have set.

The "hockey is a business" crowd that is so ready to adopt this mantra, the same ideals that lead banks and financial institutions to screw millions of people without and sense of moral obligation. Hockey is a big family, and a community, and yet some posters here demand that it become something colder, less loyal, less respectful. When did these become admirable traits?

Personally I despise people who force others to operate under those conditions, and I feel sorry for those who celebrate them as though they are something to aspire to.

There's my rant of the day, flame away...

I laughed at "toss people away" yeahh trading a veteran who has never won top team so they he may win. And continue to make millions of dollars.
Quite the tossing away.

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

So much bitterness here. Often I am disgusted by some of the attitudes shown here by some fans, and this is yet another example, especially given that it is all based on speculation and rumour.

Neither Neiler nor Phillips control if Murray trades them or not, they do have every right to answer honestly though when asked if they would like to be moved. Wanting to stay with the only team you have played for until the end, is a much stronger and more courageous stance to take, then to jump ship to the best team possible in hopes of winning a championship with a team you have nothing to do with. The fact that some of you can see that is beyond sad, for you. Winning is not actually the first and only priority for people, and nor should it be.

They have played here long enough to be afforded that respect, by our GM, who seems to value the interpersonal relationships that are formed between people.

The excitement shown here by people drooling over trading legacy players for 3rd round picks is astonishing, though it seems to fit with the increased role that video games play in people's lives, and with current entitled generation. Big on opinions, small on wisdom.

So many so quick to put their own entertainment in front of the lives and livelihoods of others, willing to toss away good people when they feel they are no longer good enough to satisfy whatever standards they have set.

The "hockey is a business" crowd that is so ready to adopt this mantra, the same ideals that lead banks and financial institutions to screw millions of people without and sense of moral obligation. Hockey is a big family, and a community, and yet some posters here demand that it become something colder, less loyal, less respectful. When did these become admirable traits?

Personally I despise people who force others to operate under those conditions, and I feel sorry for those who celebrate them as though they are something to aspire to.

There's my rant of the day, flame away...

Solid post

My stance has always been that the Senators should allow both players to play out their contracts if thats what they want. However, if either guy wants to be moved, the team should do so. If i were Neil or Phillips, I'd be rather tempted to go to a team that has a legit shot at a cup. Both players have always upped their game when it really matters.

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

So much bitterness here. Often I am disgusted by some of the attitudes shown here by some fans, and this is yet another example, especially given that it is all based on speculation and rumour.

Neither Neiler nor Phillips control if Murray trades them or not, they do have every right to answer honestly though when asked if they would like to be moved. Wanting to stay with the only team you have played for until the end, is a much stronger and more courageous stance to take, then to jump ship to the best team possible in hopes of winning a championship with a team you have nothing to do with. The fact that some of you can see that is beyond sad, for you. Winning is not actually the first and only priority for people, and nor should it be.

They have played here long enough to be afforded that respect, by our GM, who seems to value the interpersonal relationships that are formed between people.

The excitement shown here by people drooling over trading legacy players for 3rd round picks is astonishing, though it seems to fit with the increased role that video games play in people's lives, and with current entitled generation. Big on opinions, small on wisdom.

So many so quick to put their own entertainment in front of the lives and livelihoods of others, willing to toss away good people when they feel they are no longer good enough to satisfy whatever standards they have set.

The "hockey is a business" crowd that is so ready to adopt this mantra, the same ideals that lead banks and financial institutions to screw millions of people without and sense of moral obligation. Hockey is a big family, and a community, and yet some posters here demand that it become something colder, less loyal, less respectful. When did these become admirable traits?

Personally I despise people who force others to operate under those conditions, and I feel sorry for those who celebrate them as though they are something to aspire to.

There's my rant of the day, flame away...

I think you need to establish yourself as a bread winner franchise if you want to treat your players cold hard and calculated. You have to have a reason to do it. The Patriots run this model because they built themselves up and they're also upfront, we're here to win and if you don't help you're gone.

Imagine the Oakland Raiders having this same attitude in their current state.

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

I laughed at "toss people away" yeahh trading a veteran who has never won top team so they he may win. And continue to make millions of dollars.
Quite the tossing away.

*whoosh*

 

[Ice-Tray]

Okay well we didn't treat rundblad with respect. We hyped him constantly. And then poof. Traded.

Silfverberg the same.

We are a team in transition. And assets have to be used to help our future. We have allowed them to chose teams they won't go to. They can automatically tick off the 15 worst teams in the entire NHL. Quite the thigh to do for them. They don't even have to play for a bad team if they don't want to. How many players are afforded that luxury? Phillips and Neil have been coddled for too long. And now they are just takin advantage.

You've taken leave of your senses.

This post is ridiculous.

Rundblad and Silverberg disrespected?

Every player with a limited NTC submits a list in October, every year. Shame on those terrible people for using the contract they signed to their advantage!!!

Coddled? Kids these days....

 

[Ice-Tray]

I laughed at "toss people away" yeahh trading a veteran who has never won top team so they he may win. And continue to make millions of dollars.
Quite the tossing away.

The organization wouldn't consider "tossing away" Neil or Phillips, there is too much respect there, and it's the real world.

Obviously I was referring to you and your ilk.

Reading comprehension is key...

 

[h2]

That's why I used Fisher as an example. Didn't a player we acquired or resigned specifically ask Fisher about Ottawa and he had nothing but great things to say? I forget the player but I'm pretty sure I read an article on it.

Was it Legwand?

Gotcha, I misunderstood the example. But yes, it was Legwand.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Solid post

My stance has always been that the Senators should allow both players to play out their contracts if thats what they want. However, if either guy wants to be moved, the team should do so. If i were Neil or Phillips, I'd be rather tempted to go to a team that has a legit shot at a cup. Both players have always upped their game when it really matters.

I agree, and maybe they both will, but it won't be an easy choice.

In addition, when you have a family, you no longer have the luxury of making these types of decisions on your own. There is your partner's needs/wants, and those of your children to consider.

Chasing a childhood dream doesn't always stack up when considering one's partner and children.

 

[Bileur]

I think you need to establish yourself as a bread winner franchise if you want to treat your players cold hard and calculated. You have to have a reason to do it. The Patriots run this model because they built themselves up and they're also upfront, we're here to win and if you don't help you're gone.

Imagine the Oakland Raiders having this same attitude in their current state.

You've got it twisted around. The Pats built themselves into winners because they had this attitude. They didn't wait to win and then become business-like.

Neither Neiler nor Phillips control if Murray trades them or not, they do have every right to answer honestly though when asked if they would like to be moved. Wanting to stay with the only team you have played for until the end, is a much stronger and more courageous stance to take, then to jump ship to the best team possible in hopes of winning a championship with a team you have nothing to do with. The fact that some of you can see that is beyond sad, for you. Winning is not actually the first and only priority for people, and nor should it be.

That’s your interpretation of their decision.

Rather than a “stonger and more courageous stance” of wanting to stay with the only team they played for it could just as easily be a decision motivated by complacency and the desire to stay with a team in a town where their post-hockey livelihoods are located (their respective restaurants/bars). They surely are more likely to attract business to their restaurants if they keep playing in Ottawa. (I’m not saying this is what their motivation is at all, just that it’s another possible interpretation)

I don’t think it’s “more courageous” to want to stay with a team with no prospect of winning than for instance uprooting your family and moving them to a different city, at the risk of tarnishing your reputation in a city you have called home for 20 years, for a chance at a cup. Alfredsson’s decision took a ton of courage. It takes real confidence to know what is important to you and to make a difficult decision to move if you don’t think your current situation allows you the opportunity to get there.

They have played here long enough to be afforded that respect, by our GM, who seems to value the interpersonal relationships that are formed between people.

They could have negotiated a full NMC if that’s what they wanted.

They would have likely have had to take a pay cut to do so. There’s no way that was lost on their agents or themselves during negotiations. They have partial NMC’s that means that it was always foreseen, by the team and the player, that the time may come when the team decides to trade them.

The excitement shown here by people drooling over trading legacy players for 3rd round picks is astonishing, though it seems to fit with the increased role that video games play in people's lives, and with current entitled generation. Big on opinions, small on wisdom.

Honestly, if anything, I think your post is the best example of the entitled generation in this thread.

Phillips and Neil have given a ton to this team and this community. I’m sure they’re great guys and I respect them for their contributions.

At the same time, the team has also done a ton for both players. Developing them, giving them the opportunity to play, and giving them several multi-year multi-million dollar contracts which has given both the opportunity to be set for life. Murray has even gone further and (according to rumors) at several points respected their wishes when it comes to trades.

These two players have earned respect, but they are not entitled to advantages they were free to negotiate into their contracts and chose not to.
There is no “right” to play professional sports, and certainly to “right” to play for a particular team.

So many so quick to put their own entertainment in front of the lives and livelihoods of others, willing to toss away good people when they feel they are no longer good enough to satisfy whatever standards they have set.

Professional sports are an entertainment industry. If fans aren’t entertained and don’t buy tickets, there is no team. Nobody is entitled to be paid millions of dollars to play a game if there aren’t any fans willing to pay to see them play.

Nobody is saying that Neil and Phillips should be shipped to some other team with no hopes of winning so I don’t understand your “toss away good people” point. They would be going somewhere else to be paid millions of dollars to play hockey. They’ll be fine.

Besides, there’s nothing in trading someone like Neil or Phillips which makes it impossible for them to return to Ottawa when they’re done playing. There’s also nothing that should stop the organization from honouring these players with, for instance a plaque, or keeping them involved in alumni activities after their retirement.

The "hockey is a business" crowd that is so ready to adopt this mantra, the same ideals that lead banks and financial institutions to screw millions of people without and sense of moral obligation. Hockey is a big family, and a community, and yet some posters here demand that it become something colder, less loyal, less respectful. When did these become admirable traits?

Professional sports has always been a business. Look no further than lockouts and work stoppages. If they players and owners don’t agree on how to split the millions, they refuse to play. Pure business decision.

You’re romanticizing the reality that there is a bottom line and there is an entertainment objective to sports.

There is nothing wrong with a team making a move to improve itself. It’s not cold, less loyal or less respectful, it’s a business decision.

 

[Benjamin]

This isn't trading Pokemon cards. These are people. Business or not, gotta treat them with respect. There is more to it than just business.

Those poor 35 year old millionaires might have to play for a Stanley Cup instead of going on vacation for a few months. So disrespectful.