McKenzie: “More likely than not” that Hoffman gets traded this season

[JustaFinnishGuy]

No chance in hell

You seriously wouldn't?

 

[Jean Luc Discard]

GMs really seem to be failing to understand that the reason "the team who gets the best player wins the trade" is because they never get enough in return for the player they are giving up.

Tim Murray was really on the high horse after getting Kane and Lehner for two first round picks 'n misc stuff. That "accelerated rebuild" turned out to be a postponed rebuild in the end.

 

[lanceuppercut75]

The Senators have a 68 million dollar budget for player salaries.

They have around 67M committed to 18 players next season.

They have to pay Mark Stone, and then if they keep Ceci and Claesson both of them as well.

They also then have to fill out their roster with another 2-4 skaters depending on who they keep out of those players.

It may not be the entire reason they are trying to trade Hoffman, but the numbers are far too coincidental for this not to be a salary oriented move. Hoffman is one of the only players the Senators have that would clear enough salary to pay Mark Stone (at least his 1st year if the contract is backloaded), and actually bring them value back in the deal.

Ahh. So basically Karlsson is super super loyal, probably too loyal, or he's leaving.

 

[HawkeyTalkMan]

Fabbri+ a little extra?

Fabbri is great, but his injuries are obviously a concern. It’s a calculated gamble for Ottawa as he will be cheap as an RFA this offseason and has proven he can play in the NHL, but back to back ACL injuries are clearly a big red flag.

No way Ottawa take Fabbri and his twice blown out knee as the main piece of a return for Hoffman, they could easily wind up with nothing and even when he does come back, he will hardly be the player he once could have been

 

[The Note]

No way Ottawa take Fabbri and his twice blown out knee as the main piece of a return for Hoffman, they could easily wind up with nothing and even when he does come back, he will hardly be the player he once could have been

I mean yeah it’s possible, also possible he comes back fine. In a previous thread there was some interest in Fabbri+Kyrou so that’s where I was coming from. I’d offer a Barbashev+Kyrou or something but Ottawa is completely devoid of Russians. Since Dorion passed on a futures offer I’m trying to come up with something that could work from the Blues that is young and close to, or is, playing in the NHL right now.

 

[Jumptheshark]

No chance in hell

you could have had fun with this statement

IE--Not a chance in HALL! or something like that

 

[StoneHoffs129]

I think ottawa looks to trade someone else now that Hoffman is building chemistry with Duchene. Maybe look at giving up a prospect and a pick with Phaneuf. burrows Thompson and Dumont (not sure of Dumont contract status tbh) will be off the books after next year. Trade smith. And that opens a decent amount of cap.

 

[Colt55]

I mean yeah it’s possible, also possible he comes back fine. In a previous thread there was some interest in Fabbri+Kyrou so that’s where I was coming from. I’d offer a Barbashev+Kyrou or something but Ottawa is completely devoid of Russians. Since Dorion passed on a futures offer I’m trying to come up with something that could work from the Blues that is young and close to, or is, playing in the NHL right now.

The best thing the blues could do is not deal with OTT and not get a person who doesnt fill a positional need by giving up players. (kyrou, Thompson, Dunn, Kostin, Thomas) who actually fill our teams positional needs. JUst that simple

 

[MasterMatt25]

Because our owner cannot afford to own an NHL team. When a season is lost, and playoffs are out of the picture, he gives the GM Order 66: destroy salary by any means necessary.

Get a new owner pls

 

[SladeWilson23]

He's definitely a player the Devils need to pursue. We need a pure goal scorer, and we really don't have one. Palmieri is the closest thing we've got to that.

 

[The Note]

The best thing the blues could do is not deal with OTT and not get a person who doesnt fill a positional need by giving up players. (kyrou, Thompson, Dunn, Kostin, Thomas) who actually fill our teams positional needs. JUst that simple

I mean if you can get a legitimate top 6 forward for Kyrou as a base I think that’s a need. If you’ve not noticed the Blues need someone else who can put the puck in the net. Hoffman has played the RW effectively and even if he plays LW, that’s still an upgrade.

 

[End of Line]

Fabbri+ a little extra?

Fabbri is great, but his injuries are obviously a concern. It’s a calculated gamble for Ottawa as he will be cheap as an RFA this offseason and has proven he can play in the NHL, but back to back ACL injuries are clearly a big red flag.

I'd have a hard time seeing Hoffman being traded for Fabbri for said knee issues along with Fabbri being cost controlled. RFA after this season. There's the Melnyk factor in this as well.

 

[Colt55]

I mean if you can get a legitimate top 6 forward for Kyrou as a base I think that’s a need. If you’ve not noticed the Blues need someone else who can put the puck in the net. Hoffman has played the RW effectively and even if he plays LW, that’s still an upgrade.

Have you not followed Tage Thompson, Then you have Kostin, Kyrou and Thomas that are right around the corner. Hoffman is lh lw and so far there are no good rh 2rw to be had. Just stay the course. Tage has some sick hands and he is only 20yrs old, Kostin is 18 yrs old tore up WJC, Kyrou is 19yr old tearing up OHL. Thomas is 18 and is the best 2way 1c in the OHL right now. Kostin and Thompson, Thomas made it to last cut during training camp. With fabbri back next year in addition to 2 of the four we will be fine. No sense in trading great prospects for a middle 6 winger. Next year we will be better if we just stay the course

 

[Zaddy]

"More likely than not", lol...I've heard that one before.

 

[Colt55]

I'd have a hard time seeing Hoffman being traded for Fabbri for said knee issues along with Fabbri being cost controlled. RFA after this season. There's the Melnyk factor in this as well.

I honestly would rather hope fabbri returns to form not worth selling him at an all time low due to health.

 

[DANTHEMAN1967]

Hoffman will be traded to save Melnyk money this year and free money up for Stone to be signed next year.
I expect a Trade Deadline Day deal (hoping to get the highest return) and settling for a 2nd round pick, the Senators currently don't have their 2nd in 2018, and a prospect either in the League already or on the cusp.

Hoffman's contract (and almost every contract the Sens sign players to) is back loaded.
Once the team has had the "cheap" first year(s) the player is definitely at risk to be moved.
The problem is it's a downward spiral because the other team will either offer inferior player(s) due to the premium (higher salary than cap hit) they have to pay the player they are getting or will demand a pick in the deal to even things out (the Brassard/Zibanjad deal).
Draft picks are the life blood of a team that is unable/unwilling to pay to the cap and should be jealously guarded.
The way to recoup lost picks is by trading players like Hoffman for high picks and/or promising "cheap" prospects (maybe a goalie?) and ensuring that the Scouting Department is top notch.

I also predict that Karlsson will be traded in the Summer to maximize the teams who will be interested. subject to his No-trade clause (a very good move!).
The worst move they could make would be to resign Karlsson to a mega $11+/8 year deal.
With Phaneuf's and Ryan's albatross contracts going nowhere the last thing a budget team needs is another.

 

[Colt55]

Hoffman will be traded to save Melnyk money this year and free money up for Stone to be signed next year.
I expect a Trade Deadline Day deal (hoping to get the highest return) and settling for a 2nd round pick, the Senators currently don't have their 2nd in 2018, and a prospect either in the League already or on the cusp.

Hoffman's contract (and almost every contract the Sens sign players to) is front loaded.
Once the team has had the "cheap" first year(s) the player is definitely at risk to be moved.
The problem is it's a downward spiral because the other team will either offer inferior player(s) due to the premium (higher salary than cap hit) they have to pay the player they are getting or will demand a pick in the deal to even things out (the Brassard/Zibanjad deal).
Draft picks are the life blood of a team that is unable/unwilling to pay to the cap and should be jealously guarded.
The way to recoup lost picks is by trading players like Hoffman for high picks and/or promising "cheap" prospects (maybe a goalie?) and ensuring that the Scouting Department is top notch.

I also predict that Karlsson will be traded in the Summer to maximize the teams who will be interested. subject to his No-trade clause (a very good move!).
The worst move they could make would be to resign Karlsson to a mega $11+/8 year deal.
With Phaneuf's and Ryan's albatross contracts going nowhere the last thing a budget team needs is another.

Yeah i bet someone will sign Karlson to 11-13 a year Unless he goes to a cup contender for around 9 ish. Could go either way. If i was Ott i would sell at trade deadline try to get 2 first or something. Unless they can sign extension before deadline. Hate to see someone of his value walk away from a team and they get nothing.

 

[End of Line]

I honestly would rather hope fabbri returns to form not worth selling him at an all time low due to health.

Absolutely, and with the prospect pool the Blues have again, I wouldn't deal Fabbri for Hoffman because you'd be getting pennies on the dollar like you said.

 

[Colt55]

Absolutely, and with the prospect pool the Blues have again, I wouldn't deal Fabbri for Hoffman because you'd be getting pennies on the dollar like you said.

Yeah i think the blues should just stick with what they got we got plenty of capable 2lw on team and a possible great 2lw if fabbri returns to form. He is only 21. With that Thompson, Thomas and Kyrou are potential future centers with Thompson and Kyrou perfectlty capable of playing the 2rw role (which thompson is playing now) very soon. Thomas is to good not to play center. Kostin is a LH RW with a hell of a shot and power forward typ physicality. With Dunn, Walman and Schmaltz on D blues pretty much have a great set of youth ready to take over. Making Schwartz, Tarasenko, Petro, Parayko, and Schenn (possibly statsny) Great to elite Vetetran Leadership. I am super excited for this team. Just hope we dont get trigger happy and waste a great prospect on Players we dont need

 

[The Note]

Have you not followed Tage Thompson, Then you have Kostin, Kyrou and Thomas that are right around the corner. Hoffman is lh lw and so far there are no good rh 2rw to be had. Just stay the course. Tage has some sick hands and he is only 20yrs old, Kostin is 18 yrs old tore up WJC, Kyrou is 19yr old tearing up OHL. Thomas is 18 and is the best 2way 1c in the OHL right now. Kostin and Thompson, Thomas made it to last cut during training camp. With fabbri back next year in addition to 2 of the four we will be fine. No sense in trading great prospects for a middle 6 winger. Next year we will be better if we just stay the course

I’ve seen Thompson have a stretch of good games which is great. He looks much better than the first go round. But it’s also a very small sample size. I wouldn’t trade Thomas unless it’s a package trade for a top 6 center with term so I get it. If Kostin or Kyrou produce Hoffman’s numbers at any point in their career I’ll be ecstatic. I hope you and the other Blues fans that think we have 4 sure fire top 6 forwards on the horizon are correct. Because if that’s the case then even the Blues couldn’t f*** up having nearly an entire productive top 6 locked up on ELC’s. But it’s just not likely.

I don’t see any harm in -hypothetically not saying the Sens would take it- dealing one of Kyrou/Kostin as the main piece in a deal to get a guy who can help now and is locked up for a little bit.

 

[Whileee]

Because our owner cannot afford to own an NHL team. When a season is lost, and playoffs are out of the picture, he gives the GM Order 66: destroy salary by any means necessary.

Too bad they have to trade a good player with a bargain contract instead of crappy players with bad contracts.

 

[End of Line]

Yeah i think the blues should just stick with what they got we got plenty of capable 2lw on team and a possible great 2lw if fabbri returns to form. He is only 21. With that Thompson, Thomas and Kyrou are potential future centers with Thompson and Kyrou perfectlty capable of playing the 2rw role (which thompson is playing now) very soon. Thomas is to good not to play center. Kostin is a LH RW with a hell of a shot and power forward typ physicality. With Dunn, Walman and Schmaltz on D blues pretty much have a great set of youth ready to take over. Making Schwartz, Tarasenko, Petro, Parayko, and Schenn (possibly statsny) Great to elite Vetetran Leadership. I am super excited for this team. Just hope we dont get trigger happy and waste a great prospect on Players we dont need

Is Stastny expected to return next year at a lower cost?

 

[tfong]

You also have to say weird old-timey sounding things about how he has salt, or gumption, or moxie. Moxie is a great one.

Just say he'll be cheaper.

 

[derriko]

No sense in trading great prospects for a middle 6 winger. Next year we will be better if we just stay the course

In what world is Hoffman a “middle 6” player? I am not a Blues fan, but I agree with the rest of your post. They have a great prospect group they should just let develop and integrate into the team over time. There is no window closing anytime soon.

But name me one third liner that is good for 25-30 goals a year. There’s not a team in the league with 6 better forwards. On average teams, he’s probably the 3rd best, and on great teams he’s a 4 or 5. Great contract too and he’s got term.

Moving back to the Blues specifically, he’s probably not a great fit. He is average defensively and that wouldn’t work under Yeo just like it wouldn’t under Hitchcock, and arguably doesn’t work under Boucher.

 

[Vincenzo Arelliti]

Hoffman is a top-6 winger, and probably a legitimate 1st line winger. Look at his point totals over the last 3 years - he's top-40.