Confirmed with Link: Zadorov + Anton Lindholm traded to Chicago for Saad ($1M retained) + Dennis Gilbert

[AegonLeConqueror]

Welp. Big Z not endearing himself to the fans.

BTW - What the heck kind of noise is the announcer making?

Typical Benn, starting the fight before Z barely has his glove off.

 

[Foppa2118]

Dayyyyum. Not anything we didn't already know. Wheres that dude telling us this was the Saad effect after we lost the first game of the season?

That was pretty obvious to me even before the trade, that it was a false narrative that gained traction and stuck with some Chicago fans. That guy had probably been one of the leading promoters of that narrative on the Chicago board, and tried to play the I told you so game, one game into the season.

Saad's possession game, along with being a Cup winner and playing on a bad rebuilding team had more to do with how he looked, then the idea he was a shell of his former self who didn't care anymore.

We have our own false narratives though and probably every team does. It's just the nature of how people can be convinced of untruths now through repetition on the internet.

 

[Richard88]

That was pretty obvious to me even before the trade, that it was a false narrative that gained traction and stuck with some Chicago fans. That guy had probably been one of the leading promoters of that narrative on the Chicago board, and tried to play the I told you so game, one game into the season.

Saad's possession game, along with being a Cup winner and playing on a bad rebuilding team had more to do with how he looked, then the idea he was a shell of his former self who didn't care anymore.

We have our own false narratives though and probably every team does. It's just the nature of how people can be convinced of untruths now through repetition on the internet.

What are our false narratives?

 

[Foppa2118]

What are our false narratives?

Do we really want to get into that? EJ, Makar and Byram had multiple false narratives themselves.

Like I said, every team and every subject does now.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Welp. Big Z not endearing himself to the fans.

BTW - What the heck kind of noise is the announcer making?

Benn has wanted Zadorov dead for years lol.

Man, Z gotta learn to defend in a fight. We all know he’s not much of a fighter but he needs to at least learn to protect himself. He was wide open for those lefts but Benn just missed a few.

 

[UncleRisto]

I now need to make another stupid bet to get a new avi....

I could just make you a stupid avi, if you have any stupid ideas. I only take stupid commissions, though.

 

[Hasbro]

I could just make you a stupid avi, if you have any stupid ideas. I only take stupid commissions, though.

I’ve got a few.

 

[PAZ]

Once Timmins establishes himself in the top 6 Graves will likely be gone, either to Seattle or via trade before or after the expansion draft.

Toews --- Makar
Byram --- Timmins
Girard --- Johnson

Either that or Johnson will be gone.

Toews -- Makar
Byram -- Girard
Graves -- Timmins

I think Timmins will be traded and Graves will be expansion draft fodder.

Think we'll start next season with:

Byram - Makar
Toews - Girard
X - Johnson
Gilbert

X* - Another PMD, wouldn't be surprised to see if MacDonald cements himself as our #6 if he continues to improve. Seems like Bednar has a preference for PMD and also seems to really like a top 4 of Byram, Makar, Toews, and Girard. If we didn't have Helleson and Barron coming up I could see Sakic being more inclined to keep Timmins, but it's close to perfect timing for one of those two to take over EJ's spot when his contract is done.

Plus Timmins is our most valuable trade chip that's expendable.

 

[Richard88]

I think Timmins will be traded and Graves will be expansion draft fodder.

Think we'll start next season with:

Byram - Makar
Toews - Girard
X - Johnson
Gilbert

X* - Another PMD, wouldn't be surprised to see if MacDonald cements himself as our #6 if he continues to improve. Seems like Bednar has a preference for PMD and also seems to really like a top 4 of Byram, Makar, Toews, and Girard. If we didn't have Helleson and Barron coming up I could see Sakic being more inclined to keep Timmins, but it's close to perfect timing for one of those two to take over EJ's spot when his contract is done.

Plus Timmins is our most valuable trade chip that's expendable.

MacDonald has been good, but let's not get carried away. He's been heavily sheltered with 85% OZ starts, and that's the precise opposite of what Bednar wants from his 3rd pairing.

 

[PAZ]

MacDonald has been good, but let's not get carried away. He's been heavily sheltered with 85% OZ starts, and that's the precise opposite of what Bednar wants from his 3rd pairing.

Unless he really dislikes Pateryn and Gilbert, he has the opportunity to have a 3rd pairing that would be similar to Graves - Johnson when healthy.

MacDonald has been heavily sheltered, but I don't think it's a huge concern considering Bednar isn't traditional on set defensive pairings. MacDonald still has plenty to prove, but his playstyle and tools fit the Avs. Regardless, wehther it's Macdonald or another UFA that fills the 3rd pairing LHD, I think Timmins is better served as a trade chip to fill another gap than as our #5/6 defenseman.

 

[McMetal]

I'm rooting for MacDonald, I love that he gets to put on an Avs sweater finally and play for his childhood team, but let's not get carried away after one alright game and one solid game in the NHL. He's a great AHL defenseman but he hasn't taken the next step yet for a reason, I don't want to use him for any longer than we have to, and I doubt he's going to stick outside of a miracle somehow.

 

[Pokecheque]

So long as Pateryn stays on the taxi squad I’m fine with whatever they do for that depth spot.

Glad MacDonald showed up and didn’t disappoint. I don’t think he’s a long-term solution but I hope he stays with the organization. I was guessing he’d be the next Eagles captain.

 

[Ceremony]

That fight's the first I've seen of him in a Chicago jersey. Nope. Not having it. Change it back.

 

[Pokecheque]

That was pretty obvious to me even before the trade, that it was a false narrative that gained traction and stuck with some Chicago fans. That guy had probably been one of the leading promoters of that narrative on the Chicago board, and tried to play the I told you so game, one game into the season.

Saad's possession game, along with being a Cup winner and playing on a bad rebuilding team had more to do with how he looked, then the idea he was a shell of his former self who didn't care anymore.

We have our own false narratives though and probably every team does. It's just the nature of how people can be convinced of untruths now through repetition on the internet.

I don't think it's completely false, at least as far as the ding on Saad being somewhat disengaged on the odd shift. I did mention that he had a rep for that and prior to the trade that's why I opposed him being on the Avs. I was wrong.

But even if he was a poor-man's Alexei Kovalev, I do that deal every time, especially with Chicago facilitating it by eating a not-insubstantial portion of the salary.

I try to avoid the pitfall of calling a player lazy, or at least to the point where it creates a somewhat false narrative (obviously I failed with Saad). The aforementioned Kovalev, Heatley, Jagr early in his career, and so on. Not every player is a machine like MacKinnon. Hell, Brett Hull was one of the greatest pure scorers the game has ever seen, and I'm not sure he was ever truly in shape at any given point of his career. I'd say Alex Tanguay suffered from similar stretches where he was insanely frustrating, but I never got the impression that he was being lazy, rather that his confidence was rather delicate. I get the same impression with Zadorov.

Bottom line, Saad is an immensely talented player who can really complement a line well, just don't expect him to be that type of player who can carry a line on his own. And yes, he will have the occasional game or shift where he just doesn't look like he's into it. You just take the good with the bad and surround him with as much talent as you can. The Blue Jackets bet on him being a franchise forward, and that ended up being a mistake. At least in that case they dealt Saad back to the Hawks for a legit franchise forward.

Instances where I think a player's wonky work ethic is so pronounced it actually works against the team are players like Wojtek Wolski, Vladimir Malakhov, and Max Domi. Wolski would have been a superstar had he cared enough. When he was on, he flat-out took over games.

 

[Foppa2118]

I don't think it's completely false, at least as far as the ding on Saad being somewhat disengaged on the odd shift. I did mention that he had a rep for that and prior to the trade that's why I opposed him being on the Avs. I was wrong.

But even if he was a poor-man's Alexei Kovalev, I do that deal every time, especially with Chicago facilitating it by eating a not-insubstantial portion of the salary.

I try to avoid the pitfall of calling a player lazy, or at least to the point where it creates a somewhat false narrative (obviously I failed with Saad). The aforementioned Kovalev, Heatley, Jagr early in his career, and so on. Not every player is a machine like MacKinnon. Hell, Brett Hull was one of the greatest pure scorers the game has ever seen, and I'm not sure he was ever truly in shape at any given point of his career. I'd say Alex Tanguay suffered from similar stretches where he was insanely frustrating, but I never got the impression that he was being lazy, rather that his confidence was rather delicate. I get the same impression with Zadorov.

Bottom line, Saad is an immensely talented player who can really complement a line well, just don't expect him to be that type of player who can carry a line on his own. And yes, he will have the occasional game or shift where he just doesn't look like he's into it. You just take the good with the bad and surround him with as much talent as you can. The Blue Jackets bet on him being a franchise forward, and that ended up being a mistake. At least in that case they dealt Saad back to the Hawks for a legit franchise forward.

Instances where I think a player's wonky work ethic is so pronounced it actually works against the team are players like Wojtek Wolski, Vladimir Malakhov, and Max Domi. Wolski would have been a superstar had he cared enough. When he was on, he flat-out took over games.

Yeah I know he had that rep before the trade. I don't recall who I discussed it with, but I had a few conversations about Saad and his reputation in the past, and basically said what I said about it now.

I was pushing for a Saad trade the last couple years, because I had a feeling he'd be a great fit on this team, both on and off the ice, and would take a lot of pressure off Landy playing a similar role.

So far he's fitting in well. He's starting to form some real good chemistry with Kadri too. Bura as well. I always thought the Bura-Kadri-Donskoi line would work well and it did last year when they reunited it. This is basically an upgrade of that line with Saad instead of Donnie.

I think Saad will be even more beneficial to the team in the playoffs too.

 

[Richard88]

Brandon Saad this season is tied-7th in 5v5 goals, and he's 5th in 5v5 goals/60 (minimum of 300 mins played). He's pacing for 31.5 goals in an 82 game season.

He's shooting 23.08% at 5v5 and 24.4% overall which is 4th in the league and double his career average, so that production probably isn't sustainable, but it's nonetheless hard not to be extremely pleased with how he's done, especially considering that he was a -8 with only 1 goal in his first 6 games this season.

 

[TruePowerSlave]

Great trade once again by Sakic. We probably don't have the cap space to keep Saad but, getting him for a meh 3rd pairing guy is still wonderful.

 

[Tommy Shelby]

It usually takes new forwards a bit of time to get the knack for Bednar's system, but once they do, they put up pretty good numbers.

 

[Garavar]

It usually takes new forwards a bit of time to get the knack for Bednar's system, but once they do, they put up pretty good numbers.

What exactly is Bednar's system have you figured it out?

 

[AvsWraith]

Great trade once again by Sakic. We probably don't have the cap space to keep Saad but, getting him for a meh 3rd pairing guy is still wonderful.

Unless the cap goes up, I don't even see how we can keep Landy, Gruuu, and Makar next year.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

Unless the cap goes up, I don't even see how we can keep Landy, Gruuu, and Makar next year.

I know how...

 

[Foppa2118]

What exactly is Bednar's system have you figured it out?

In its simplest form, it involves constantly pressuring puck carriers in the O zone and neutral zone, instead of coasting to block passing lanes like many other teams do. They're trying to force turnovers or rush them into less accurate passes that can stunt a team's transition game.

This, and their preferred off the rush style when they're healthy and on their game, require a ton of skating.

So not only do you have to be a good skater to fit in Bednar's system well, you have to be in great condition. I think the condition aspect is why we've seen guys like Comeau and Calvert take a year to find their game with the Avs.

I also think all the skating and potential fatigue are a factor in why they have so many injuries.

 

[The Kingslayer]

I didnt even realize Saad has 10 goals. What the. Looking at the stats all the forwards in the top 6 are the top 6 forwards in points on the team. Then theres Donskoi who somehow has 16 points producing like a top 6.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

I didnt even realize Saad has 10 goals. What the. Looking at the stats all the forwards in the top 6 are the top 6 forwards in points on the team. Then theres Donskoi who somehow has 16 points producing like a top 6.

Yeah, the bottom-6 still has pretty bad production outside Donskoi and Nuke is coming around.

On the bright side though, the second line is actually starting to approach first line level production because they’ve been so hot of late.

 

[S E P H]

I didnt even realize Saad has 10 goals. What the. Looking at the stats all the forwards in the top 6 are the top 6 forwards in points on the team. Then theres Donskoi who somehow has 16 points producing like a top 6.

Saad has been great at scoring those "insurance" goals to put us up by two, but isn't necessarily good at scoring those "GWG" when the game is tied.