GDT: Worst Case Ontario | Game 60: Canucks @ Leafs - Sat. Feb.8th, 3 PM [Mod Note Post 45]

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Bro Horvat

2011 Truther
Mar 20, 2013
1,219
0
Vancouver
The Way of the Road: Toronto Park Boys

Saturday February 8th, 3 PM PST
Air Canada Center, Toronto, Ontario
TV: CBC | Radio: TEAM 1040

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PS, I'll be at the this game so all you kids watching at home keep an eye out for the drunk in the Hank Millionaires jersey and Seahawks bucket.​
 
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Mr. Canucklehead

Kitimat Canuck
Dec 14, 2002
40,593
31,619
Kitimat, BC
Burrows' Career Stats vs. Toronto: 11GP, 8G, 7A, 15PTS

Come on, Burr. If there's a game to get the piano, elephant, monkey and humpback whale off your back, this is it.
 

MikeK

Registered User
Nov 10, 2008
10,760
4,372
Earth
Best GDT to date. Nice job.

I want this game badly but I just don't see it happening. I think T.O. wins this one. Would love to be wrong though.
 

Balls Mahoney

2015-2016 HF Premier League World Champion
Aug 14, 2008
20,402
1,922
Legend
This GDT is awesome. :clap:

I'm hoping the Canucks get blown out tonight and go into the Olympic break in panic mode. It's clear our Olympic players are completely mentally checked out and trying not to get injured. Our non-Olympic players are expecting to be traded soon and don't care. Tortrella is screaming while fighting doors (the mental image of that cracks me up everytime :laugh: ) and there's still Zack Mother****in' Kassian turning into a superstar before our very eyes.

I think that's where the team is at. If they Die Hard tonight, it's going to force massive pressure for change and for Mike Gillis to get even more schwety.

For the love of Christ, don't get injured Kesler.
 

Wetcoaster

Guest
There seems to be a lot of wonderment on the part of Leafs fans as to why there seems to be anti-Toronto feelings amongst Canucks Nation.

Leaving aside the feelings based on political matters, there are historical hockey roots for the anti-Toronto feelings in Vancouver. And it also involves Buffalo our expansion cousins.

I am speaking as former Leafs fan (from the late 1950's to the Ballard era) who was born and raised in BC.

Historically there is good reason for Vancouver fans disliking the Leafs due to Stafford Smythe's deep-sixing the Canucks' entry to the NHL in 1967 with the help of Clarence Campbell when Vancouver rejected Smythe's attempts to build and control a new arena in Vancouver. He vowed to block any Vancouver entry to the NHL:
Back in the middle of 1964, Toronto Maple Leafs’ president Stafford Smythe, seeking new ways to increase his cash inflow, mused that he might, just might, consider building an NHL-sized arena in Vancouver, if Vancouver would grant him free prime property in the downtown area. Smythe and his assistant, Harold Ballard, came to Vancouver to promote his plan.

Reaction in the city was split down the middle. Rabid hockey fans felt that no concession was too great if it meant an NHL franchise. But others differed. Some people were turned off by Smythe’s patronizing attitude. Others felt that the granting of free land was a blatant give-away to eastern interests.

There were even rumors, never confirmed, that Smythe planned to build a hotel complex and a dog-racing track on the site of the proposed rink.

At any rate, Smythe’s proposal was put to the public and was rejected. Smarting with indignation, Smythe said that he doubted if Vancouver would ever get into the NHL in his lifetime.​
From The History of Hockey in B.C. by Denny Boyd

Smythe and Clarence Campbell worked hard to ensure that Vancouver's bid for a team in the 1967 expansion was defeated and then had the temerity to try to blame the lack of success on the Vancouver bidders. Talk about outraged fans in Vancouver.

Subsequently, the NHL granted expansion franchises to St. Louis, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Minnesota, Oakland and Los Angeles. Vancouver was left out.

Campbell said, “It would have been in the best interests of the NHL to have another Canadian franchise. It’s too bad Vancouver fumbled the ball so badly when they had it in the first place.â€

The Vancouver ownership group then made an attempt to relocate an existing team that was experiencing financial and attendance problems to Vancouver (there is nothing new, eh?) . They aligned themselves with Labatts and they had an agreement in principle with the Seals owner Barry Van Gerbig to purchase 49% of the team but they were rejected as owners by the NHL as it was feared that they were going to move the team to Vancouver. The NHL vetoed the deal and made it clear that there was no way there decision to place a team in the Bay Area was going to be second guessed and move to Vancouver no matter how poor the attendance might be ( averaged 4,960).

The Seals ownership group then filed an antitrust action against the other NHL owners (it had been an 8-4 vote at the BOG against) and it took until 1974 for a decision. The court would surprisingly rule that the NHL teams was not in economic competition (a single entity). That ruling would be rejected shortly in the Raiders case which ruled the NFL teams were in economic competition but it did not help the Seals who continued to hemorrhage money on a scale at least equal and probably greater than the Coyotes.

BTW at that time a young guy joined the Van Gerbig ownership group, George Gillett, who would later own the Habs and has just sold.

An attempt was also made to sell the team to the Knox brothers who wanted to re-locate the the seals to Buffalo.

Eventually after the NHL put several hand-picked owners in place such as TNC (and who all withdrew or ran out of money) and put the team back in Van Gerbig's hands. GM Frank Selke Jr would later say that TNC was "cruel hoax" foisted upon them by the NHL who had no real financial backing and "further proof the NHL would try anything to keep up appearances without any consideration for the fans, the players, their families and the organization."

The team went into bankruptcy but the the bankruptcy judge did not want to make a decision and asked the NHL to find yet another owner. I guess this was because the NHL had shown such expertise in the past.

The choice would come down to the Bay Area based Roller Derby tycoon Jerry Seltzer (roller derby was the next big thing in those days and was outdrawing hockey in the Bay Area) and the eccentric Charles O. Finley. Finley was the handpicked choice of Clarence Campbell who because Finley had not clue about hockey personally presented Finley to NHL power brokers Bruce Norris and Bill Wirtz.

Seltzer would put together a very good ownership group including AFL owners Lamar Hunt (KC Chiefs), Bud Adams (Houston Oilers) and Ralph Wilson (Buffalo Bills). Seltzer had a local TV deal in place and all the Bay area media backing his bid as he was local boy considered to be a good corporate citizen. It was very solid professional presentation running some 120 pages with financials, projections, marketing plans, etc. His group bid $4.3 million for the team.

Finley basically did a back of table napkin presentation (one page) with a bid of $4 million. Of course the NHL chose Finley as owner. And the next madcap chapter would begin which would ultimately result the NHL having to step in and buy out Finley while searching for another buyer in February 1974. Mel Swig bought the team but when a new arena did not materialize he partnered up with the Gund Brothers and the team moved to Cleveland. The Cleveland team would effectively fold into the North Stars team and then later be split again with a new team San Jose locating back in California.:amazed:

It took David Molson of the Habs to finally intervene and overrule Campbell giving Vancouver its NHL franchise (along with Buffalo and the Knox brothers who were also ticked over the NHL blocking their attempts to buy and relocate the Seals to Buffalo) in 1970.

By that time Smythe who had been ousted by John Basset as Leafs chairman in a power struggle that would ultimately see Harold Ballard oust Bassett several years later, was facing criminal charges and was ill (he would subsequently die in 1971).

At this point a BC boycott was really picking up steam and it was clearly affecting the sales of Molson and ESSO products so it was not entirely altruistic on David Molson's part as fans in BC had organized quite an effective boycott targeting Molson beer and ESSO (major NHL sponsors at the time) over the denial of an NHL franchise. Also by expanding to Buffalo and Vancouver the NHL managed to pocket $12 million in expansion fees that it would not have seen if the Seals re-located.

From The History of Hockey in B.C. by Denny Boyd:
Vancouver’s reaction to the rejection and to Campbell’s words was one of boiling indignation. Hundreds of letters of protest were fired off to NHL headquarters. The sale of beer brewed by the family behind the Montreal Canadiens dropped sharply as did purchases of oil and gasoline bearing the name of the sponsor of Canadian NHL telecasts. Vancouver was a city spurned, and was acting accordingly.​

As the boycott continued David Molson (owned the Habs) basically told Campbell to pipe down about Vancouver and the BOG awarded franchises to Vancouver and Buffalo.

David Molson, a member of the NHL expansion committee, tempered the turn-down slightly when he said, “The league is committed to Vancouver. The next city, either through a new franchise or a franchise transfer, is Vancouver. If we expand again, it will have to be by two cities to facilitate scheduling. But when you have two weak sisters you have to be a little hesitant about going out and adding two unknowns.â€

The weak sisters he was referring to were Oakland and Pittsburgh, both of them deep in early financial straits and neither of them drawing solid and consistent spectator support.

While David Molson’s announcement had been the first genuinely positive indication that the NHL wanted Vancouver as badly as Vancouver wanted the NHL, his promise was verbally negated by Campbell who, in a hasty moment, said, “Vancouver won’t be in the league this year or next. You can count on that.â€

But the expansion committee, at the June, 1969 NHL meeting, partially provided a rebuttal to Campbell by announcing that the NHL would expand again in time for the 1970-71 season.​

And NHL hockey would finally come to the Wet Coast and to Buffalo. And then the Canucks lost the spin of the "Wheel of Misfortune" getting Dale Tallon instead of HHOF'er Gilbert Perrault. But that is another tale of woe.

So yes there is a lot of history behind Leaf angst in Vancouver.

For many it has been passed down from father to son (or mother to daughter - mind you my mother and sister were Habs fans which made for interesting Saturday dinners around the TV watching HNIC) and the origins of the antipathy have become misty over time.

But the aggrieved feelings remain. There is nothing quite like the wrath of a Vancouver hockey fan spurned - even if many young 'uns do not recall the exact reasons and circumstances.

However now you know ... and History Bites.:D
 
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stuffradio

Registered User
Oct 3, 2012
2,837
62
Vancouver
There seems to be a lot of wonderment on the part of Leafs fans as to why there seems to be anti-Toronto feelings amongst Canucks Nation.

Leaving aside the feelings based on political matters, there are historical hockey roots for the anti-Toronto feelings in Vancouver. And it also involves Buffalo our expansion cousins.

I am speaking as former Leafs fan (from the late 1950's to the Ballard era) who was born and raised in BC.

Historically there is good reason for Vancouver fans disliking the Leafs due to Stafford Smythe's deep-sixing the Canucks' entry to the NHL in 1967 with the help of Clarence Campbell when Vancouver rejected Smythe's attempts to build and control a new arena in Vancouver. He vowed to block any Vancouver entry to the NHL:
Back in the middle of 1964, Toronto Maple Leafs’ president Stafford Smythe, seeking new ways to increase his cash inflow, mused that he might, just might, consider building an NHL-sized arena in Vancouver, if Vancouver would grant him free prime property in the downtown area. Smythe and his assistant, Harold Ballard, came to Vancouver to promote his plan.

Reaction in the city was split down the middle. Rabid hockey fans felt that no concession was too great if it meant an NHL franchise. But others differed. Some people were turned off by Smythe’s patronizing attitude. Others felt that the granting of free land was a blatant give-away to eastern interests.

There were even rumors, never confirmed, that Smythe planned to build a hotel complex and a dog-racing track on the site of the proposed rink.

At any rate, Smythe’s proposal was put to the public and was rejected. Smarting with indignation, Smythe said that he doubted if Vancouver would ever get into the NHL in his lifetime.​
From The History of Hockey in B.C. by Denny Boyd

Smythe and Clarence Campbell worked hard to ensure that Vancouver's bid for a team in the 1967 expansion was defeated and then had the temerity to try to blame the lack of success on the Vancouver bidders. Talk about outraged fans in Vancouver.

Subsequently, the NHL granted expansion franchises to St. Louis, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Minnesota, Oakland and Los Angeles. Vancouver was left out.

Campbell said, “It would have been in the best interests of the NHL to have another Canadian franchise. It’s too bad Vancouver fumbled the ball so badly when they had it in the first place.â€

The Vancouver ownership group then made an attempt to relocate an existing team that was experiencing financial and attendance problems to Vancouver (there is nothing new, eh?) . They aligned themselves with Labatts and they had an agreement in principle with the Seals owner Barry Van Gerbig to purchase 49% of the team but they were rejected as owners by the NHL as it was feared that they were going to move the team to Vancouver. The NHL vetoed the deal and made it clear that there was no way there decision to place a team in the Bay Area was going to be second guessed and move to Vancouver no matter how poor the attendance might be ( averaged 4,960).

The Seals ownership group then filed an antitrust action against the other NHL owners (it had been an 8-4 vote at the BOG against) and it took until 1974 for a decision. The court would surprisingly rule that the NHL teams was not in economic competition (a single entity). That ruling would be rejected shortly in the Raiders case which ruled the NFL teams were in economic competition but it did not help the Seals who continued to hemorrhage money on a scale at least equal and probably greater than the Coyotes.

BTW at that time a young guy joined the Van Gerbig ownership group, George Gillett, who would later own the Habs and has just sold.

An attempt was also made to sell the team to the Knox brothers who wanted to re-locate the the seals to Buffalo.

Eventually after the NHL put several hand-picked owners in place such as TNC (and who all withdrew or ran out of money) and put the team back in Van Gerbig's hands. GM Frank Selke Jr would later say that TNC was "cruel hoax" foisted upon them by the NHL who had no real financial backing and "further proof the NHL would try anything to keep up appearances without any consideration for the fans, the players, their families and the organization."

The team went into bankruptcy but the the bankruptcy judge did not want to make a decision and asked the NHL to find yet another owner. I guess this was because the NHL had shown such expertise in the past.

The choice would come down to the Bay Area based Roller Derby tycoon Jerry Seltzer (roller derby was the next big thing in those days and was outdrawing hockey in the Bay Area) and the eccentric Charles O. Finley. Finley was the handpicked choice of Clarence Campbell who because Finley had not clue about hockey personally presented Finley to NHL power brokers Bruce Norris and Bill Wirtz.

Seltzer would put together a very good ownership group including AFL owners Lamar Hunt (KC Chiefs), Bud Adams (Houston Oilers) and Ralph Wilson (Buffalo Bills). Seltzer had a local TV deal in place and all the Bay area media backing his bid as he was local boy considered to be a good corporate citizen. It was very solid professional presentation running some 120 pages with financials, projections, marketing plans, etc. His group bid $4.3 million for the team.

Finley basically did a back of table napkin presentation (one page) with a bid of $4 million. Of course the NHL chose Finley as owner. And the next madcap chapter would begin which would ultimately result the NHL having to step in and buy out Finley while searching for another buyer in February 1974. Mel Swig bought the team but when a new arena did not materialize he partnered up with the Gund Brothers and the team moved to Cleveland. The Cleveland team would effectively fold into the North Stars team and then later be split again with a new team San Jose locating back in California.:amazed:

It took David Molson of the Habs to finally intervene and overrule Campbell giving Vancouver its NHL franchise (along with Buffalo and the Knox brothers who were also ticked over the NHL blocking their attempts to buy and relocate the Seals to Buffalo) in 1970.

By that time Smythe who had been ousted by John Basset as Leafs chairman in a power struggle that would ultimately see Harold Ballard oust Bassett several years later, was facing criminal charges and was ill (he would subsequently die in 1971).

At this point a BC boycott was really picking up steam and it was clearly affecting the sales of Molson and ESSO products so it was not entirely altruistic on David Molson's part as fans in BC had organized quite an effective boycott targeting Molson beer and ESSO (major NHL sponsors at the time) over the denial of an NHL franchise. Also by expanding to Buffalo and Vancouver the NHL managed to pocket $12 million in expansion fees that it would not have seen if the Seals re-located.

From The History of Hockey in B.C. by Denny Boyd:
Vancouver’s reaction to the rejection and to Campbell’s words was one of boiling indignation. Hundreds of letters of protest were fired off to NHL headquarters. The sale of beer brewed by the family behind the Montreal Canadiens dropped sharply as did purchases of oil and gasoline bearing the name of the sponsor of Canadian NHL telecasts. Vancouver was a city spurned, and was acting accordingly.​

As the boycott continued David Molson (owned the Habs) basically told Campbell to pipe down about Vancouver and the BOG awarded franchises to Vancouver and Buffalo.

David Molson, a member of the NHL expansion committee, tempered the turn-down slightly when he said, “The league is committed to Vancouver. The next city, either through a new franchise or a franchise transfer, is Vancouver. If we expand again, it will have to be by two cities to facilitate scheduling. But when you have two weak sisters you have to be a little hesitant about going out and adding two unknowns.â€

The weak sisters he was referring to were Oakland and Pittsburgh, both of them deep in early financial straits and neither of them drawing solid and consistent spectator support.

While David Molson’s announcement had been the first genuinely positive indication that the NHL wanted Vancouver as badly as Vancouver wanted the NHL, his promise was verbally negated by Campbell who, in a hasty moment, said, “Vancouver won’t be in the league this year or next. You can count on that.â€

But the expansion committee, at the June, 1969 NHL meeting, partially provided a rebuttal to Campbell by announcing that the NHL would expand again in time for the 1970-71 season.​

And NHL hockey would finally come to the Wet Coast and to Buffalo. And then the Canucks lost the spin of the "Wheel of Misfortune" getting Dale Tallon instead of HHOF'er Gilbert Perrault. But that is another tale of woe.

So yes there is a lot of history behind Leaf angst in Vancouver.

For many it has been passed down from father to son (or mother to daughter - mind you my mother and sister were Habs fans which made for interesting Saturday dinners around the TV watching HNIC) and the origins of the antipathy have become misty over time.

But the aggrieved feelings remain. There is nothing quite like the wrath of a Vancouver hockey fan spurned - even if many young 'uns do not recall the exact reasons and circumstances.

However now you know ... and History Bites.:D

It goes both ways. Read their GDT about how much they hate us also.
 

tc 23

#GaunceForGM
Dec 11, 2012
11,358
21
Vancouver
I finally decided to put some vcash on the Canucks. Not a lot, mind you, but hopefully that's enough to get our juju going.

I went to do the same thing but accidentally bet on Toronto instead as I was half asleep and on mobile. :(

No idea if this can be fixed but I'll gladly see my vCash disappear if it means a win.
 

stevecanuck16

Registered User
Jul 28, 2009
1,416
0
One of the best GDTs in awhile. Bravo!

Wondering if we will see Lain draw in somehow. Although I was pretty happy with Pelletier, Lain's size might be help against Toronto. He is also an Ontario boy.
 

CP

Thou shalt not Tank
Mar 8, 2008
865
0
Burrows NEEDS to score before his break. Don't care if the team loses bad as long as Burrows scores.
I need my dragon slayer back!
 

Wilch

Unregistered User
Mar 29, 2010
12,224
487
That image of Kessel will be forever stamped on my brain.
 

m9

m9
Sponsor
Jan 23, 2010
25,107
15,229
Ray's above advice has got me through many tough times. I love that episode.
 
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