Why is it rare for hockey players to start playing at a later age?

[MarkusKetterer]

I don’t think he’s actually 5’11, he looks more like he’s closer to 5’9 or 5’10.

Your average NHL forward is usually around 6’1 200 lbs, and your average NHL defenseman is closer to 6’2-6’3 215 lbs.

The guy who gave him his first major concussion, Andy Sutton, was a 6’6 245 lbs defenseman.

This is the hit I’m talking about

Sutton was a brick wall

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Sutton was a brick wall

Yeah, I wouldn’t want to run into his shoulder with my head down that’s for sure.

 

[MarkusKetterer]

Yeah, I wouldn’t want to run into his shoulder with my head down that’s for sure.

I wouldn’t want to do it with my head up either

 

[Seanaconda]

I don’t think he’s actually 5’11, he looks more like he’s closer to 5’9 or 5’10.

Your average NHL forward is usually around 6’1 200 lbs, and your average NHL defenseman is closer to 6’2-6’3 215 lbs.

The guy who gave him his first major concussion, Andy Sutton, was a 6’6 245 lbs defenseman.

This is the hit I’m talking about

Skinner looks like he's 5'6 .

Crosby McDavid hall are 5'11 , and yes they get destroyed sometimes too but he is shorter.

 

[ovythegiraffe]

Skating and stick handling takes a lot of work. I think that you could still develop to pro level if you started as late as like 12, but at that point the kids that started at 3 are so much ahead that it's very difficult to get into a good program. Like you're gonna start with maybe 1-2 practices per week in a pretty easy going environment, while the guys that have played since 4 years old are already playing, practicing and competing almost at a pro level intensity.

Skateboarding has a lot of top level pros that started 11-13 and it's similarly unnatural skills. The difference is though that you do it on your own speed so you aren't handicapped by the system structures.

 

[Jacob]

Basketball is somewhat unique because of such a massive advantage height gives.

 

[Atoyot]

Neuroplasticity. If you don't learn skating and handling a puck with a stick at a young age it's near impossible to become elite. The things that you need to be elite in other sports all involve things that kids do already so that foundation is already built. Throwing, catching, kicking, running. Nothing really translates to skating and handling an object with a stick.

 

[RebuildinVan]

Cost. My parents couldnt afford it when I was young. By the time they could I was already 14 and thought god no cuz I was 8 years behind everyone

 

[majormajor]

Basketball is a poor comparison. Those big men aren't even particularly athletic at basketball, they're just big. You don't have to train your brain to be big. A shockingly high proportion of the world's 7 foot tall humans are in the NBA.

Hockey has to start earlier because of skating. It is so alien from running that our brains can't learn how to do it beyond a certain age. You need neuroplasticity to learn how to skate at a pro level. We have many more neural connections for doing things with our hands and you can teach someone a new sport for their hands at a later age. But feet don't have that neural density, it has to start earlier.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Jesus Christ. Youngest EVER all star? Damn. I was looking up his stats and he doesn't seem all that good nowadays. Did he fall of a cliff or something?

When Skinner broke into the League, Carolina was trying to build around Eric Staal and an injured Cam Ward. Their broke owner meant they desperately needed talent as players hit UFA and left or "aged out" of the League. Jim Rutherford had a low opinion of non-1st round draft picks and this left a depleted prospect pool. These two factors combined to create a roster theoretically in their competition window while starved for talent.

Skinner was a much needed addition to the roster talent wise, especially for a non-lotto 1st rounder in a not amazing draft class. As a result, the team allowed his negative attributes to fester and grow. His tunnel vision. His poor defense. His refusal to use his teammates and instead try to turn a 1 on 4 into a low percentage shot and turnover. Outside of learning how to not get himself killed on the ice, and sadly he was one of the last players to be destroyed unnecessarily before the League actually started to give a shit about player protection from predatory head hits (cue John Kerry's quote, how do you ask a man to be the last man to get concussed for a mistake?), he didn't really develop as a player between his breakout 2010-2011 season and when he was traded to Buffalo.

Carolina failed him. It's sad to see. Columbus made Rick Nash respect the game away from the puck, and he had a short but respectable career away from C-bus because of it.

 

[Montreal Shadow]

Height does make an enormous difference in basketball. Make those 7’ guys 6’3”, suddenly they don’t make the league anymore. Chara at 5’11” probably still makes the NHL but probably isn’t as dominant.

 

[Saitama]

Skating coaches mostly train players so their skating is more efficient.

Also to add to my prior post, Jeff Skinner was a figure skater up until he was 12. He became a 1st round pick, was the youngest player to ever play in an All Star Game in all the major sports (NBA, NFL, MLB, NHL), won the Calder as the NHLs best rookie, and is now overpaid on the Sabres.

Man, not only the youngest, but to play an all-star game in all the major sports? That's really impressive!

 

[GermanSpitfire]

What's with all of these "Why isn't hockey basketball?" threads?

It’s a basketball fans trying to understand hockey, i welcome it.

 

[Butch 19]

It's mainly because the scouting and prospecting starts so early at like 6 years old, and all of the top players are usually on these top peewee teams. For instance Connor McDavid was already a big prospect as a 3-year-old.

Forget the ?

 

[LeHab]

Hockey is more like other sports, basketball is the exception as growth spurts in teenage years can certainly motivate to become serious about basketball.

 

[golfortennis]

There is also the reinforcement loop. Take a group of 7 year olds that are the AAA team. The next year, when there are tryouts, those kids will have a big step up on making the team, because "they already played AAA." (Or whatever the levels are at that age). Unless a kid who comes into the picture is leaps and bounds better than anyone, if you have the same coaches, they are going to go with the players they know.

Similar to how players born earlier in the year tend to make teams a lot more, due to the size advantage they had when they were young, they kept making the "top teams" because, well, they were on the "top team" last year, so they must be better.

There is some unintentional weeding out of some players this way.

Then there's the money...

 

[WarriorofTime]

Skating is not natural, stick handling pucks is not natural and it makes a big difference to be put on top teams from a young age

 

[joestevens29]

Unlike the other sports it's very hard to emulate the full hockey experience as a kid.

Soccer, football, basketball, baseball etc.. are very easily played at school and at home. Those sports you can casually play and develop your skills a lot easier.

Hockey is just a different beast. Most kids can play hockey on the street and in school, but it's not on ice. I played a lot of hockey with kids that were quite talented at the road hockey or ball hockey in gym, but they never learned the skating part until it was too late. Without that ice it really makes it tough to get the full skills needed for hockey. I even live in a place where outdoor rinks are quite the norm, so there was a lot of opportunity for kids to learn that didn't play organized hockey. However, there really wasn't anyone ever there to teach them how to skate. So I could imagine how much tougher it would be in places that don't have the outdoor rinks.

And even the kids in organized hockey, how many of us went to different training camps to practice skating? Or spent time on those outdoor rinks working on it. It's just not an easy skill to pickup and be elite at.

 

[OV Rocks]

The other challenge to starting hockey so late, is it is hard for a 15 year old to find a legitimate team/group to start on. They have the playing ability of a 6 year old mite, but obviously they can't join that team. They can join a rather "non-competitive" midget team, which is likely to be a team that is horrible, and doesn't see much in the ways of talent progression. Then you get a bit of a spiral where the game is no fun at all for the new hockey player.

It's funny, you can go to a pond in the winter and actually find some pretty good players who have absolutely no competitive hockey experience but can skate, stick handle, and pass pretty well. However, you put them in full pads and in a game 5 on 5 with a legit goalie and they would be lost.

If you are athletic and 15 years old, it's not hard to jump into a soccer game and run fast, understand space, get open, etc. Same can go for basketball, ironically though most hockey players are terrible at it. Natural athleticism can only go so far in hockey if you can't skate, or can't skate with your head up.

 

[BadgerBruce]

In Canada, minor hockey registration numbers peak in Atom (9 and 10 year olds) and drop every year after that.

Even girl’s Canadian gymnastics club membership doesn’t peak until age 12.

Part of the problem is Canadian minor hockey is an absolute race, definitely NOT a marathon. The CHL out west (WHL) drafts then when they are in freaking grade 9 and just 14, which means they are scouting them when they’re 12. And though we hear the odd story about late bloomers, most families see the writing on the wall when their kids are 10-11 years old. Early puberty is everything.

I love minor hockey — I coach — but the average player lasts 3-4 years and quits while still in grade school. Imagine giving up a recreational activity forever at age 11, and nobody wants to change the system responsible for this.

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

Skating is too important. Harder to pick it up and get good in mid to late teens.

Yup. Played roller from a younger age, started ice when I was 13 or so- way too late. I had hands, a good shot, straight line speed, but I couldn’t even stop going one direction. Agility? Nah. I coulda trained my butt off to become decent at best, some of these kids it’s as natural as walking.

I’d also then add the physicality/speed is tough to get used to all at once. I’d guess it all slowly ramps up when you’re younger, whereas starting at 13- I never learned proper hitting procedure, and there are some monsters by the teen years. It’s just a skill you naturally develop over time, hit avoidance, but starting late you’ll likely get wrecked before you can learn the lessons you need to.

 

[lottster14]

Because it's the best sport on earth and requires the most development to be a professional. IMO.

 

[BlueAzN]

Skating is too important. Harder to pick it up and get good in mid to late teens.

THIS, in bball, you can just be overgrown and have a chance at being a defensive specialist if you have some athleticism to go along with your overgrowness.
In hockey, being a big fook won't help you if you can't skate or move the puck. Basketball players don't even have to touch the ball to get paid if you're a shutdown D. A shutdown D in hockey must be at least competent with the puck unless you're Dermott doing a spin-o-rama.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Skating. Unlike basketball or football which are more based on athleticism, skill based sports like hockey, soccer, and baseball require starting at a very early age where the skills become as natural as breathing.

The level of skating required to become a professional, let alone an NHL player, is so high, these kids are scouted at 15, 16, 17, get drafted at 18 , so they need >10 years of intensive training on skates to reach the level required

 

[Mickey Marner]

Sports that rely more on size and athleticism (basketball, football) than skills allow for a later start date for those with a desirable physique. Sports that rely more on skills (hockey, baseball, soccer) than size and athleticism must be started earlier so you don't fall behind your peers. If you never learned how to hit a 50 MPH pitch at 10, you're unlikely to hit an 80 MPH pitch at 16.

Hockey also doesn't have a large skills overlap with other land-based sports. You can't develop skating and puck-skills by playing basketball, football or soccer.