Chazz Reinhold
Registered User
All this talent the Kings are "throwing away" hasn't seem to hurt them too much.
Why is Bud Holloway not on your team?
- Thread starter MessierII
- Start date
I would have liked to see how Bud would have done in LA. Seems like a Williams style player. I think another team will sign him this offseason.
Frolov 6'3
Unregistered User
No if I throw away $1.000, it doesnt hurt me too much either.
If I keep it, I can do even greater things.
Chazz Reinhold
Registered User
You really think Holloway or Purcell or Moulson or Hickey or Loktionov are going to be difference between the Kings repeating or not?
I swear, some people complain just to complain. No team in the NHL is going to be able keep every single prospect. That's just the way it goes, and that's why there are restrictions such as waivers. None of the players the Kings have let go are superstars or on the path to be superstars.
Frolov 6'3
Unregistered User
No, stick to the point please. You said; All this talent the Kings are "throwing away" hasn't seem to hurt them too much. I think that's so short sided. The Kings have won a Cup so why would we care about the future ? I want to win a second, third and more. Heck, we are 12th in the conference !
Holloway is lighting up the 3rd best league for two straight years and he was in our system. In the meantime, Moulson is going to have a 4th straight 30 goal campaign and that Purcell dude is doing pretty well as well.
No, no team can keep every single prospect, FACT, but this is getting ridiculous. Cliché, Zeiler, Segal, Clune etc etc. all got a shot.
Bud still has to show NHL potential. I've seen some games, he's really good.
I'm curious which other NHL team has let go three 60 point players, for next to nothing, in a four year time span.
With old ass wingers all about to leave. You might want to look at the future and not our current roster buddy. It doesn't hurt to have good YOUNG forwards does it. I don't know about you but we seem to not have an abundance of that. The future we have old wingers and some old forwards soon to leave, I rather not trade for one I rather have one of our own players get a chance. Open your eyes to the future because some of our current players won't be here Penner Stoll Williams. That's a lot. Then we will have a problem.
damacles1156
Registered User
- Feb 5, 2010
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Say what ?
Manchester is loaded with Forwards. What the Kings lack is NHL ready Defenders.
Not to mention next year, all the college Forwards will be AHL eligible.
kilowatt
the vibes are not immaculate
- Jan 1, 2009
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The Kings didn't really throw anyone away.
Has everyone forgotten how bad Teddy Purcell was? He just couldn't make a play. He had hands of stone when he was with us. I remember multiple tap-in goals that he just flat out missed. He didn't make good passes and he didn't have a great shot. I was so excited to see him promoted to the Kings, but it just didn't pan out. He was even on the first line for a while with Kopitar and Brown. How long do you wait?
Where was Loktionov going to go? Kopitar - Richards - Stoll - Fraser... I don't see Loktionov being a bottom-six center and the Kings have Kopitar (well, hopefully) and Richards (and even Carter) locked up long-term. There was nowhere for him to play. We tried him on the wing... it never worked out.
Hickey had many chances to impress in training camps, but never did. Well, not after he got injured, anyway. It was a toss-up between him and Doughty in '08-'09 but Drew beat him out, injuries caught up with Hickey, and he was never the same after that. Hickey is getting a decent chance on one of the worst blue lines in the league. If Mitchell AND Greene weren't injured, we wouldn't even be talking about this. We are just unlucky that three of our top-six defenders are out long term. With that said, Drewiske, Ellerby, and Muzzin have stepped up and are playing big minutes. That's a pretty big deal.
Moulson didn't get a fair shake, and we lost out on that. But Moulson also benefits by playing with John Tavares, who is a better player than anyone on the Kings (except perhaps Kopitar). Tavares has been on the ice for what, 60+ straight Moulson goals? Moulson is a good player and I wish he would have had that success here, but I really doubt that that would have been the case.
Honestly, I think the player that got shafted the hardest was Brian Boyle. He looked good for the Kings. He had size, but that doesn't mean he was meant to be a fourth-line checking center. Oh well.
Has everyone forgotten how bad Teddy Purcell was? He just couldn't make a play. He had hands of stone when he was with us. I remember multiple tap-in goals that he just flat out missed. He didn't make good passes and he didn't have a great shot. I was so excited to see him promoted to the Kings, but it just didn't pan out. He was even on the first line for a while with Kopitar and Brown. How long do you wait?
Where was Loktionov going to go? Kopitar - Richards - Stoll - Fraser... I don't see Loktionov being a bottom-six center and the Kings have Kopitar (well, hopefully) and Richards (and even Carter) locked up long-term. There was nowhere for him to play. We tried him on the wing... it never worked out.
Hickey had many chances to impress in training camps, but never did. Well, not after he got injured, anyway. It was a toss-up between him and Doughty in '08-'09 but Drew beat him out, injuries caught up with Hickey, and he was never the same after that. Hickey is getting a decent chance on one of the worst blue lines in the league. If Mitchell AND Greene weren't injured, we wouldn't even be talking about this. We are just unlucky that three of our top-six defenders are out long term. With that said, Drewiske, Ellerby, and Muzzin have stepped up and are playing big minutes. That's a pretty big deal.
Moulson didn't get a fair shake, and we lost out on that. But Moulson also benefits by playing with John Tavares, who is a better player than anyone on the Kings (except perhaps Kopitar). Tavares has been on the ice for what, 60+ straight Moulson goals? Moulson is a good player and I wish he would have had that success here, but I really doubt that that would have been the case.
Honestly, I think the player that got shafted the hardest was Brian Boyle. He looked good for the Kings. He had size, but that doesn't mean he was meant to be a fourth-line checking center. Oh well.
kingsfan
President of the Todd McLellan fan club by default
Moulson, Purcell and who?
If you mean Holloway, that's some nice spin doctoring. He's a 60 point SEL player (which is nice for sure) not an NHL player.
Honestly, the only players who have left LA for nearly nothing that have done anything great are Purcell and Moulson, and both got a sloid try out in LA. Purcell had 91 games as a King, while Moulson got 29. It's not like they were never given a look.
As for the rest of the guys mentioned in this thread, like Loktionov, Holloway and Hickey, what have they really proven to be labelled as given away talent? Loki has one goal in three games as a Devil, Hickey has one goal in 11 games with the Islanders, and Holloway is in Europe. Do they have talent? Yes. Have they proven anything? Not at all.
And for the record, every team has a Purcell or Moulson of some level. Detroit lost Quincey to us and gave away Leino (though he came back to earth last year). Chicago got Patrick Sharp from Philly for Matt Ellison. Bryzgalov was lost by Anaheim on waivers. Calgary walked away from Martin St. Louis and trading Marc Savard for Ruslan Zainullin. It happens.
When was Brian Boyle on the Sharks?
http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/players/3363/career;_ylt=AjKextHfpK0k1JS3w4en_5tivLYF
http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/players/3363/career;_ylt=AjKextHfpK0k1JS3w4en_5tivLYF
damacles1156
Registered User
- Feb 5, 2010
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I don't know why people bring up Purcell....He plays with probably the Best Shooter in the NHL, also a guy named St. Lou.
If You can't put up points playing with those guys....You don't deserve to put on hockey skates.
Moulson is about the only Guy the Kings should have taken a longer look at.
My personal Beef, Hickey should have stayed. But you can't keep them all.
Frolov 6'3
Unregistered User
Again, which other NHL team has given away two +60 points players in such a short time. That will be three anytime soon when Holloway is coming to the NHL. Breaking all kind of records and is 11th in the league in hits as well, you dont see that very often.
I dont care Detroit lost Quincey on waivers. I dont care Chicago got Sharp from Philly for crap. I already said, that happens. That can happen so now and then, but not three players in a timespan of 3 years. Than you are doing something wrong. Of course we get to hear the usual stuff that player A is playing with Tavares and player B with Stamkos. The Kings have Kopitar and he's not a scrub. I never had a problem with Purcell because he got a good look. Moulson was ridiculous though, so was Holloway.
On top of that, I would have kept Hickey over Muffin as well.
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kilowatt
the vibes are not immaculate
- Jan 1, 2009
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At what point did we give Holloway away, though? Lombardi was upset that Holloway left in the first place. He told Moller to go, but was upset when Holloway left.
I don't think we "gave" Holloway away. At all.
Frolov 6'3
Unregistered User
Clune, Cliche, Zeiler, Segal etc...all scrubs who got at least a call. Meanwhile Holloway is the leading scorer on your farm team and never got a sniff @ NHL action. Almost = still nothing.
If you think we didnt give him away, than you can say he was mistreated. There's a reason he got such a contract from a SEL team. He wasnt a crappy player.
If you think we didnt give him away, than you can say he was mistreated. There's a reason he got such a contract from a SEL team. He wasnt a crappy player.
kilowatt
the vibes are not immaculate
- Jan 1, 2009
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I won't disagree with that. We brought up scrubs to help on the fourth line. But is it necessarily a bad thing to leave our highest-scoring minor leaguer to try to bring that team to the playoffs? The Kings made the playoffs in 2010-11 by going 8-2-3 in February and 9-3-2 in March, including 11 straight games without a regulation loss. The Kings sucked for most of the season and then went 19-8-5 to finish the season. Had we brought up Holloway that season and he hadn't performed well, we would all be talking about how he needed more time in the AHL and that we messed up his development by bringing him up too early. We would probably be saying, "We should have let him try to lead the Monarchs to a Calder Cup."
I just don't see why he bolted after leading the Monarchs in scoring. He didn't even go to training camp. He was next in line, ready to be called up. He had a tremendous season and would have been rewarded for it by making the team. Do you remember who started the season in LA? Scrubs like Ethan Moreau and Trent Hunter, because we didn't have anyone else ready to play. We didn't have Carter yet, either. Our team wasn't very good.
Our opening roster was:
Gagne - Kopitar - Brown
Parse - Richards - Williams
Hunter - Stoll - Moreau
Clifford - Richardson - Lewis
Holloway would have made the team over Parse, Hunter, and Moreau for sure. It wasn't like Holloway had been wasting away in the AHL either - it was only his second full season there. He was a third round pick in 2006 and played in the WHL until he joined Manchester in '08-'09 - what was he expecting?
Frolov 6'3
Unregistered User
Well, you got to admit, he might be right. He was fully convinced that he belonged in the NHL, or at least should have gotten a call up already. SEL is no NHL, but the odds are he will be very effective in the NHL.
I like that.
I was almost in the same situation @ work. New employee suddenly got a pay raise and I didnt. I think I'm better and deserve more, threatened to leave and suddenly I get even more. I like that too.
Not sure if Bud had any bargaining power. Doubt it would work with Lombardi though...he's that stubborn.
I like that.
I was almost in the same situation @ work. New employee suddenly got a pay raise and I didnt. I think I'm better and deserve more, threatened to leave and suddenly I get even more. I like that too.
Not sure if Bud had any bargaining power. Doubt it would work with Lombardi though...he's that stubborn.
Ollie Weeks
the sea does not dream of you
- Feb 28, 2008
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The only time I think about Moulson or Purcell is when they are brought up by overindulgent point-counters during the latest scoring spree.
Boyle I don't think about at all.
Bud frickin Holloway? LOLOLOLOL
Boyle I don't think about at all.
Bud frickin Holloway? LOLOLOLOL
he also set the SEL playoff scoring record last year. He set Skellefteas all time points record this year and the season isn't even done. IIRC he is also 3 assists away from setting the SEL all time assists record.
I think you are underplaying what this guy is doing by saying he is "only" a 60 point sel player. Hell, the guy is likely to break 70 this season seeing as he is sitting at 67 with 4 more games to go I think...
Willard
Kings All The Way
It's like watching Let's Make A Deal, where somebody put $500 in Holloway's hand and asked if he wanted to keep that or take Door #1. He kept the money and it turns out there was a New Car! behind Door #1. He could have made the Kings in place of Trent Hunter in October 2011, but "Oh Well." Now he's taken his seat again in the crowd and we've got brand new contestants.
SurMartin
Registered User
Yeah he's doing more than just "really well".
-SEL playoff record
-First foreigner to win SEL in points
-Most points ever by a foreigner in SEL
-Most points ever by a Skellefteå-player
-Needs 2 points in the remaining 4 games to have scored the second most points ever in SEL
-Needs 3 assists to beat the assist record
-11th in hits
Also, Oscar Möller has scored fourth most goals in SEL this year in just 24 games. (2 hat-tricks and one 4 goal game)
Name Team Pos GP G AVG.
Söderberg, Carl LHC CE 50 29 0.58
Arlbrandt, Pär LHC LW 50 20 0.40
Holloway, George SAIK RW 51 19 0.37
Möller, Oscar SAIK RW 24 18 0.75
Fasth, Jesper HV71 RW 43 18 0.42
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Raccoon Jesus
Todd McLellan is an inside agent
I *really* hope this is something that can be reconciled. The guy is a player, and we may have forward holes next year.
It would be horrible asset management to lose him for nothing, at least.
It would be horrible asset management to lose him for nothing, at least.
kingsfan
President of the Todd McLellan fan club by default
People bring up Purcell because he's had success since leaving here. I get it, I just don't worry about it much. He was given a good chance here. Honestly, so was Moulson. How many 9th rounders who are cast off get 29 games to prove themselves? Outside of 1st and 2nd round picks, no prospects really get much chance to prove themselves at the pro level. You either make it early, or you don't. Muzzin now is a prime example. He's had 27 career games and people around here want him scratched when Martinez is healthy.
Again, if you'd ready the very post of mine you are quoting, you'd see Calgary did it with Marc Savard and Martin St. Louis. That's even worse than what LA did, since Savard was NHL proven (which Moulson and Purcell were not) and that Savard and St. Louis turned into high 90-point scorers, which Moulson and Purcell don't seem destined to be.
So says you. I prefer to wait for a guy to play an NHL game before jumping to that conclusion. Plenty of other surefire NHLers did nothing when they finally got the the NHL.
All very impressive, but once again, give him an NHL game first before we call him a top 2 line player.
As I said above, it can happen, and let's stop calling Holloway something he hasn't proven to be.
Does anyone know for sure either played with Kopitar? Especially Moulson
I do agree with you on Holloway, I felt he should have got a look. Won't aree on Moulson though, sorry. 29 games is a decent look.
Most would have.
I did not say he is 'only' a 60 point SEL player. I said that's what he is so far. I acknowledge the fact he can be a good NHL player, in fact I think he has a good chance to do so. Unlike Frolov 6'3 though, I'm not going to label him as a 60 point NHLer until he actually is.
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Moulson did play with Kopitar and Brown at the beginning of the 08 season. He had one point (a goal) and was a -4 in 7 games with them and he was taken off the line. He looked like crap, and he was traded not too long after that.
That trade was a wake-up call, a classic case of change of scenery. I think he realized it was put up or shut up at that point.
Chazz Reinhold
Registered User
Moulson was never traded. He was sent down to Manchester after those 7 games. The Kings didn't re-sign him in the off season, and he signed a tryout contract with the Islanders. All this talk about "giving" Moulson away is revisionist history. 28 other NHL teams didn't think enough of him to give him a contract or even invite him to training camp; only the Islanders gave him that chance.
http://www.insidesocal.com/kings/2009/07/06/moulson-signs-with-islanders/
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