Who Loves Justin Abdelkader?

[iDangleDangle]

I think it's hilarious that people are judging a single player's season this year.

It's been a season where every single player took a step back. There's something systemic going on. There's something going on at the team level.

I just don't see how you can accurately gauge a player's value after a season like this. "Well, his production is down. He sucks." Yeah, just like everyone else's.

Well, Holland based his perceived value of Abby on two flukey seasons riding shotgun to Datsyuk after already having done that for few more seasons before that without anything to show for it...

Truth? Abby isprobably somewhere in the middle, leaning more the the sub 30 point guy.

 

[nbwingsfan]

Love? No

Dislike as much as most people? No

He has a place on this team as he's one of the few on the team who really battles for the puck and can lay a big hit. He is however overpaid by about $1.5M and his contract is wayyyy too long. More suited as a solid 3rd line player.

 

[HIFE]

Turns out Abdelkader needs his knee scoped. Makes sense he wasn't right returning from injury. Problem for me he was a hot mess before the injury but may be this was related? I still think he can play a lot better and at least raise his value somewhat.

There's a lot of bad contracts out there that IMO are worse than Abdelkader at 4.25. Lucic, Ladd, Giroux making 8 million...it's not an excuse for the Wings lame decisions but there are worse deals.

 

[KasperTheGrittyGhost]

I have never liked the guy. That probably goes to me being a Notre Dame fan, but I just can't find many redeeming qualities about him.

 

[avssuc]

Turns out Abdelkader needs his knee scoped. Makes sense he wasn't right returning from injury.

There's a lot of bad contracts out there that IMO are worse than Abdelkader at 4.25. Lucic, Ladd, Giroux making 8 million...it's not an excuse for the Wings lame decisions but there are worse deals.

What makes the Lucic contract worse than Abdletross?

-Lucic is far more durable (see the first part of your post)

-Has played 70 or more games 8 times to Abdelkader''s 4 (in the same amount of seasons)

-Is two years younger

-Shows up more in the postseason

-Can fight his way out of a wet paper bag

-Isn't scared of Brian Boyle

-Has 5 seasons with 20 or more goals to Abdelkader's 1

-Has 5 seasons over 50 points to Abdelkader's 0

-Only makes $1.75 million more

-Has front loaded contract that is and will be easier to move

-Two years younger, signed for the same term

If the Wings were a couple years from being competitive again, I'd take Lucic all day, every day. Since the Wings future looks pretty murky, he'd be a waste.

 

[Wingsfan 4 life]

Turns out Abdelkader needs his knee scoped. Makes sense he wasn't right returning from injury. Problem for me he was a hot mess before the injury but may be this was related? I still think he can play a lot better and at least raise his value somewhat.

There's a lot of bad contracts out there that IMO are worse than Abdelkader at 4.25. Lucic, Ladd, Giroux making 8 million...it's not an excuse for the Wings lame decisions but there are worse deals.

All three of those players had multiple 50+pt seasons under their belt before signing their current deals. Abby's deal is like Clarkson all over again.

 

[HIFE]

@avssuc- Thanks for the information, hadn't considered the details of Lucic's production. I've never been a fan (thought he was a hunchbacked wannabe goon) but I agree the extra 1.75 mil isn't a factor if you're gonna pay anyways. There was a thread the last two months discussing ML and reading that now Edmonton fans have nothing but good to say. I kind of forgot Abdelkader was also signed for 7 YEARS, yikes.

 

[ZDH]

Ol' stonehands 2mil overpaid 3rd liner who eats valuable 1st line developmental minutes and couldnt even put up #s next to the single most creative player of all time signed for the next 7 years Abdeltross?

Love him

 

[PelagicJoe]

I like Abby enough. 4 or 5 years ago, I would have said he sucked. He's one of the only guys we have that will deliver a hit regularly. His contract is too long, yes, but he's one of the few physical guys we have.

 

[Heaton]

Abdelkader was signed because Holland thought he could produce offensively. You can find Abdelkader type guys in free agency for nothing every year. Abdelkader can't provide offense unless the other two guys on his line are producing, he doesn't drive offense and never will.

 

[Bench]

But Heaton sometimes he runs into guys. And they go, "hey, that almost hurt skinny dude."

 

[Heaton]

But Heaton sometimes he runs into guys. And they go, "hey, that almost hurt skinny dude."

I also hear he's the best on the team for providing vintage memes.

 

[avssuc]

@avssuc- Thanks for the information, hadn't considered the details of Lucic's production. I've never been a fan (thought he was a hunchbacked wannabe goon) but I agree the extra 1.75 mil isn't a factor if you're gonna pay anyways. There was a thread the last two months discussing ML and reading that now Edmonton fans have nothing but good to say. I kind of forgot Abdelkader was also signed for 7 YEARS, yikes.

No prob brother. Like I mentioned, I'd only be in favor of signing a guy like him if the Wings were looking to contend, and if the team had some studs that needed a hired hand to ride shotgun. I can't think of a player better for the role than Lucic in the game today.

That brings up the issue of goons and their value. I watched a documentary on Amazon about fighting in the modern game. Kocur was a large part, pretty cool stuff.

I can't remember the numbers used, but they paint a pretty good image of how fighting still has a place. I understand that many of the members here will disagree, but that documentary really cemented my support. I'm not a fan of the dark side of fighting, but it seems like there's more risk when it's removed. I've suffered traumatic brain injuries deployed in combat, so the reality of recovery and living a life after is something I know first hand. I've always felt that my hockey mates were the closest to my military brothers, so I think the cost is understood by those that play the role of enforcer. Probably the topic for another thread though.

 

[TatarTangle]

If your boss says he's going to give you a YUGE raise are you going to say no? Hate Abdelkader's contract, not him as a player. He's a perfectly good hockey player, just overpaid, like most of the Red Wings

 

[RabidBadger]

Abdelkader was signed because Holland thought he could produce offensively. You can find Abdelkader type guys in free agency for nothing every year. Abdelkader can't provide offense unless the other two guys on his line are producing, he doesn't drive offense and never will.

Yep. And he never has. He made a name for himself as a draftee by winning the MVP of the finals for MSU riding Tim Kennedy's coattails. He put together a nice year for the Wings riding Dat's coattails.

I never understood the affinity for the guy; stupid penalties, bush-league play (ala the sucker-punching in last year's playoffs), among other idiotic, poorly timed plays. I'm pretty sure if he did not play for Detroit everyone on this forum would despise him.

Abdelkader translates to "one acting without thought" in German. There you have it.

 

[Retire91]

If your boss says he's going to give you a YUGE raise are you going to say no? Hate Abdelkader's contract, not him as a player. He's a perfectly good hockey player, just overpaid, like most of the Red Wings

I really never understood this. Abby deserves to be piled on just as much as Holland. It takes 2 to negotiate and Abby is underperforming by a huge margin to what he negotiated and at his age that gap is going to widen over time. Abby accepted a contract he was never going to live up to. Fans are not allowed to hate him because Holland offered it? Fault is on both of them.

 

[Leronziia]

His mother.

Presumably his partner.

 

[TatarTangle]

I really never understood this. Abby deserves to be piled on just as much as Holland. It takes 2 to negotiate and Abby is underperforming by a huge margin to what he negotiated and at his age that gap is going to widen over time. Abby accepted a contract he was never going to live up to. Fans are not allowed to hate him because Holland offered it? Fault is on both of them.

So you wouldn't take the raise? The NHL is like any other business and every single player is looking for that huge, long-term contract. Why wouldn't you?

What I have found through conversations with guys I play hockey with that have played in the IHL, AHL and NHL is that they all think he is a good, servicable hockey player.

What I have found through conversations in the forums is that people have a seething hate for the guy. I personally don't get hating someone, it takes a lot of energy and time to hate someone.

Having said that I'm not saying one is right and the other is wrong. I think he brings an element they need on the team, just at the wrong price. He could easily be making $2 million less and a lot more people could stomach the contract.

 

[njx9]

So you wouldn't take the raise? The NHL is like any other business and every single player is looking for that huge, long-term contract. Why wouldn't you?

Absolutely right - hating him for accepting an offered contract, or for negotiating the pants off of Holland is ridiculous. It's not his fault that the team was stupid enough to give him that contract. Hate him for not living up to it, or whatever, but for signing it? Come on. It's as stupid as hating Datsyuk for signing his contract.

Having said that I'm not saying one is right and the other is wrong. I think he brings an element they need on the team, just at the wrong price. He could easily be making $2 million less and a lot more people could stomach the contract.

It's not the money, it's the term. A $4.5m deal for 3 years? It's still stupid, but it's not painful. It's not immovable. A 7 year deal for an already average 3rd line winger, with no discount on cap (a la Glendening's far more appropriate salary)? That's absolutely terrible.

 

[Retire91]

It's still his responsibility for performing. How far up the chain does this go. We can't hate Holland because Jimmy D or the Illich family are the ones that keep him in place? So no one can talk bad about Holland now. It's not his fault. He isn't responsible for his decisions because he didn't hire himself.

Hate is too strong of a word I doubt anyone hates him lol. But good bad or indifferent he has signed up to be the poster child for almost everything wrong with this organization. I don't think too many people would mind 30 million dollars to play thay role either but sports fans have every right to dislike him for what that means to their team.

 

[Winger98]

With Gator, I'm not sure he's that different of a player now than he was five years ago. So, if we didn't hate him five years ago, I'm not sure it's fair to hate the player now. At the same time, I think it's also entirely fair to hold him and his contract up as emblematic of some of the problems with the Wings right now. It's not a good contract. At best, we can hope he comes close to earning most of it. Push comes to shove, the fault of him getting that deal, though, rests with Holland.

All of that said, if Gator can pot 15 goals and throw ~200 hits, he probably comes close to earning that contract that year. Can he do that? I seriously doubt it, especially with the number of guys who either should or could slot in ahead of him in the lineup (in other words, his PP time should be non-existent and his days of feeding off a top line center should be over).

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

With Gator, I'm not sure he's that different of a player now than he was five years ago. So, if we didn't hate him five years ago, I'm not sure it's fair to hate the player now. At the same time, I think it's also entirely fair to hold him and his contract up as emblematic of some of the problems with the Wings right now. It's not a good contract. At best, we can hope he comes close to earning most of it. Push comes to shove, the fault of him getting that deal, though, rests with Holland.

All of that said, if Gator can pot 15 goals and throw ~200 hits, he probably comes close to earning that contract that year. Can he do that? I seriously doubt it, especially with the number of guys who either should or could slot in ahead of him in the lineup (in other words, his PP time should be non-existent and his days of feeding off a top line center should be over).

It does point to a lack of talent. Because it is worth pointing out Justin Abdelkader tied for the team lead in power play goals this year. So think about that as much as we dislike him he scored the same amount of power play goals as Tatar, Larkin and Vanek.

He has a lot of soul searching to do this summer. I hope the knee surgery helps him bounce back. We shall see but unacceptable year for him, he needs to bring more.

 

[Winger98]

It does point to a lack of talent. Because it is worth pointing out Justin Abdelkader tied for the team lead in power play goals this year. So think about that as much as we dislike him he scored the same amount of power play goals as Tatar, Larkin and Vanek.

He has a lot of soul searching to do this summer. I hope the knee surgery helps him bounce back. We shall see but unacceptable year for him, he needs to bring more.

Lack of talent, weak systems, inexperienced kids. I'm really hoping we see guys like Larkin, AA, and Mantha take another step next year on the man advantage and begin to assert themselves there. And that we give them the ice time to do so.

Gator's over 30 now, isn't he? The time is coming where the just isn't going to be a bounce back. I think he's just going to be a sunk cost on our roster. Good enough to play every day, but not good enough to earn that contract on a consistent basis.

 

[Bench]

The best case scenario is that Larkin starts to emerge as a driving force and Abby can find some chemistry with him. I could see that at least being an upside, maybe?

Obviously I hate the Abby deal and am very, very outspoken about it. Most of you are probably sick of me harping about it. But hey, I'm looking for some positive things to come. Prove me wrong out there Abby. And Larkin. Please? Pretty please?

 

[Reddwit]

As OP, I'd like to remind everyone of the original intent of this thread: to find out who really loves Abby, thereby finding out the reasoning behind the Wings marketing division shoving him down our throats.

After reviewing the thread in its entirety, its clear that a sliver of the minority actually does love Abdelkader while the remainder of the minority likes Abdelkader, with some sort of addended caveat (i.e. contract, injuries, diversity of purpose). The majority seems to either treat Abdelkader with a sort of removed acceptance of his place on the team, tolerate him, or feel some sort of negativity towards him ranging from disturbance to downright loathing of him.

All this (with some caveats to the conclusion itself) makes me think the Wings brass made a huge mistake in pushing Abdelkader to the marketing forefront a few years ago. Abdelkader had a brief streak of success as a grinding, physical, supplementary afterthought of a Cup-contending component some years ago and yet has spent the majority of his career clawing to reach expectations ever since. After having a solid season as a Cup component, he fought (often literally) to gain traction as a coveted grind-line derivative, and once he seemed merely competent in that role, he was thrust into the Homer/Cleary position, where he spent 1.5-2 years falling short of filling the shoes of the aforementioned secondaries. Now, he's falling short of fulfilling expectations brought on by his contract, which was built upon a brief period where he actually did reap the benefits of playing alongside a generational centerman.

Ultimately, it leads me to the conclusion that (1) the Wings marketing folk were way off in estimating that the fanbase would buy into Abby as some sort of beloved Holmstrom/McCarty variant, and (2) those same people, by nature of them pushing Abby as a face of the Wings, had a major hand in Abby getting the bloated contract that he did. In other words, how well can you fight against the claims of your employee that he deserves a fat raise when he not only backed up those demands with on-the-job performance but also backed them up with your own organization's use of your character as a face of a franchise?