Wheeling averaging 2,040 in attendance

[ForsbergForever]

Through 11 home games and with an impressive 13-6-0-3 record. They only had 1,318 last night... If/when the team finally folds after so many years of struggling to survive what will become of the current three team Atlantic Division? With Elmira and Reading also experiencing some difficulties, do all three teams call it quits if any one of them goes under? Also sticking with Wheeling, what does Montreal and Pittsburgh do for ECHL affiliates?

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[AHLFAN]

Baltimore???

I recently read on this forum that the Capitals are looking to put a AA team in Baltimore. Reading and Elmira were mentioned as possible teams to wind up there.

 

[lennysundahl]

I've been curious as to how long Wheeling can stay afloat at that level. It's very much like Johnstown, in an area that's been in a steady decline for quite some time, but they've got actual local ownership--between that and the support they have from the Pens organization, I think they're more stable than would be expected from a team drawing that low. Still, it seems like a "when" will the owners get tired of losing money as opposed to an "if" (if they're making money somehow we need to all take notes)...

 

[Prussian_Blue]

Would like to see Wheeling move into the USHL, as a more "local" opponent for Youngstown and as a bridge to the mid-Atlantic for the USHL, which has expressed interest in expanding in that direction.

 

[Off da post and in]

Would like to see Wheeling move into the USHL, as a more "local" opponent for Youngstown and as a bridge to the mid-Atlantic for the USHL, which has expressed interest in expanding in that direction.

Let's see.....

USHL (16 teams), NAHL (24 teams), NA3HL (21 teams), MNJHL (16 teams), and EHL (18 teams ).

That's 95 Tier I, II, and III teams in the USA.

Yep, just what America needs, another junior level hockey team.

 

[Liberty Biberty]

I usually make about 7-10 games a year. Its a shame that the whole area is dying. There is nothing in Wheeling besides the casino. They do have a ton of corporate sponsors, most of which also sponsor the pens. Maybe someone could shed light on how much $$$ that brings into the team.

They should be giving tickets away since there are a few colleges close by. Get some butts in the seats, especially on dollar beer nights. Even with a student ID tickets are $11. I would just make it $5 for every seat in the Bank. Try something to get more people there, because they have a decent team to watch.

 

[JungleJON]

Well, I think in time (maybe next year) the Nailers will go the same way as Johnstown and drop down to juniors. The Tomahawks have a good following and I know the costs are nowhere near what they are in the ECHL.

In time you will see the same happen to Elmira, it really makes more sense. The ECHL seems to be looking at larger cities and newer arenas. Wheeling, Johnstown, Erie, Knoxville & Virginia was how the league began. Knoxville is in the SPHL, Virginia (Vinton) no longer has hockey, Erie (OHL) and Johnstown (NAHL) junior level.

 

[mk80]

Well considering that Indianapolis will probably be losing the Ice in a year or two. Wheeling could definately be a good landing spot for the USHL to add a close team to Youngstown.

Also I've been reading here about Baltimore possibly having an ECHL team. Baltimore lost two AHL franchises in the past, of course those both played quite some time ago. I think a ECHL franchise could succeed there, the issue is if the city is replacing 1st Mariner Arena or not like they want to.

 

[ForsbergForever]

Now averaging 1,990 through 13 home dates...how low it goes no one knows! The team has got to be hemorrhaging money at this rate...

(I guess I'll just appoint myself the official Wheeling attendance watch guy.)

 

[JungleJON]

Would like to see Wheeling move into the USHL, as a more "local" opponent for Youngstown and as a bridge to the mid-Atlantic for the USHL, which has expressed interest in expanding in that direction.

You think Wheeling is going to help out Youngstown? Their high for avg. attendance was in 2010-2011 1,878 and it has been a steady decline 1,609, 1,371 to this season's 1,047.

Maybe Youngstown's days are numbered as well.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

It's sad to watch the Nailers franchise die. Another poster suggested folding is not an "if" but a "when". Unfortunately, I think that's accurate. I will make it out to one of the remaining 3 Cyclones games in Wheeling this year as I want to see another pro game at Wesbanco and feel this season could be my last opportunity to do so.

The NAHL has a lower cost structure than the USHL. Johnstown's listed attendance figures are almost identical to the Chief's numbers in their last year in Johnstown. I'd think that Wheeling-if juniors are in its future-would like to be in the same, lower cost league as Johnstown's NAHL Tomahawks.

 

[JungleJON]

Johnstown avg. 2,527 last season and should be able to bring this year's number up to that level or surpass it. They had a lot of home games to start the season during high school football, which still has a big following in the area.
Wheeling should be looking at a move to the NAHL and in time you might see Elmira go the same route. These cities still have a fan base of around 2,000 which would be a plus for the NAHL.

 

[lennysundahl]

You think Wheeling is going to help out Youngstown? Their high for avg. attendance was in 2010-2011 1,878 and it has been a steady decline 1,609, 1,371 to this season's 1,047.

Maybe Youngstown's days are numbered as well.

A Wheeling-Youngstown rivalry would help some at the gate, but it would be a slight bump IMO. But then Chifles mentioned joining Johnstown in the NAHL, and that would be a good fit too--rekindle that rivalry, have a nice little circuit with them and Jamestown (and, again, maybe Elmira too). Time will tell I guess... I might make an excursion out thataways (FINALLY) soon, I'm interested to see how things are with my own eyeballs.

 

[CrazyEddie20]

The only thing that stanches Wheeling's financial bleeding is their travel. They have day trips to Reading, Cincinnati, Toledo, and Fort Wayne, which saves them a considerable amount of travel costs.

By my count, Wheeling has had seven day trips so far, which probably has saved them approximately $25,000 between hotel rooms, bus leasing, and per diem.

 

[easternrefugee]

The ECHL gets more expensive every year to run. In the west tickets are averaging at least $20.00 for a lower bowl seat. AHL?NHL pays zip to help the ECHL out and so if your ticket sales are down then the survival chances are slim. The ECHL model seems to favor newer arenas in the 5,000 seat capacity. I think that is why the west is doing well. The only real way of saving teams in the eastern conference is for the CHL in the middle of the country to merge with the eCHL. It could possibly lower travel costs.

 

[gordie]

Wheeling Attendance for the January 12 game against Toledo at WesBanco 3,504. I hope the Pens Organization keeps this close affiliate in Operation and since there will be upgrades to WesBanco Arena via revenue from a local Sales Tax, I expect Pittsburgh and Montreal to keep them operating.

 

[jabberoski]

Wheeling Attendance for the January 12 game against Toledo at WesBanco 3,504. I hope the Pens Organization keeps this close affiliate in Operation and since there will be upgrades to WesBanco Arena via revenue from a local Sales Tax, I expect Pittsburgh and Montreal to keep them operating.

Pittsburgh and Montreal are affiliated with Wheeling. Neither team has an ownership stake in the Nailers.

 

[gordie]

Pittsburgh and Montreal are affiliated with Wheeling. Neither team has an ownership stake in the Nailers.

That is why I expect them both to give them Financial Help if they ask for it.

 

[jabberoski]

That is why I expect them both to give them Financial Help if they ask for it.

Why would they give help? Maybe Pittsburgh, because of the geographic ties, but no way Montreal would. Even Pittsburgh would be a 50-50 proposition, at best.

 

[gordie]

Why would they give help? Maybe Pittsburgh, because of the geographic ties, but no way Montreal would. Even Pittsburgh would be a 50-50 proposition, at best.

Both Pittsburgh and Montreal have benefited from being able to send players from the AHL to the lower ECHL and since Wheeling is close to Pittsburgh and the rest of the Eastern NHL, I would suspect it makes sense for Montreal's Farm System as a whole. With Edmonton purchasing the Bakersfield ECHL team, I believe this will become more of a trend in the NHL.

 

[jabberoski]

Both Pittsburgh and Montreal have benefited from being able to send players from the AHL to the lower ECHL and since Wheeling is close to Pittsburgh and the rest of the Eastern NHL, I would suspect it makes sense for Montreal's Farm System as a whole. With Edmonton purchasing the Bakersfield ECHL team, I believe this will become more of a trend in the NHL.

There are plenty of other ECHL teams out there that they would be able to assign their players to without having to drop money into supporting the outside ownership's interests.

 

[CrazyEddie20]

That is why I expect them both to give them Financial Help if they ask for it.

So wait - neither NHL club has any equity in the Nailers, so now you expect them to throw capital at the Nailers' debt? What does the NHL club get in exchange for their generous contribution of (likely hundreds of) thousands of dollars? Equity in a money loser?

 

[gordie]

There are plenty of other ECHL teams out there that they would be able to assign their players to without having to drop money into supporting the outside ownership's interests.

They wouldn't have the control over the system played. Any player Pittsburgh brings up talks about playing the same system in all three leagues. What outside ownership's interest?? We are talking about money into the ECHL Operation, not something else.

 

[gordie]

So wait - neither NHL club has any equity in the Nailers, so now you expect them to throw capital at the Nailers' debt? What does the NHL club get in exchange for their generous contribution of (likely hundreds of) thousands of dollars? Equity in a money loser?

Control over the system played and a close by ECHL Operation where player movement throughout the organizations is simple AHL WBS Penguins and AHL Hamilton Bulldogs.

 

[jabberoski]

They wouldn't have the control over the system played. Any player Pittsburgh brings up talks about playing the same system in all three leagues. What outside ownership's interest?? We are talking about money into the ECHL Operation, not something else.

No NHL team has control over what system an ECHL team plays. That is up to the coach of the ECHL team.

The outside ownership interest I was referring to is the Wheeling ownership. Why would Pittsburgh or Montreal, who have no ownership in the teams, pay money to support that outside ownership?