What's going to happen to Tokarski?

[Miller Time]

I think you should take a look around every team in the league, then. Every team has a backup. Most have a #3 option, either as an AHL vet or a young up-and-comer. Today, no team needs to burden themselves with an extra goalie contract, and that's all that Budaj or Tokarski represent to anybody. Teams would have gladly burned a 7th round pick on Budaj if they really thought he was "as high quality as you can find". Nobody wants him.

But it's still all caveated with "yet". Injuries could eat into the stability that all teams in the league currently perceive they have in goal.


Well, if the "best possible return" is a negative value or just some dead-end return contract, then it may still not be a trade worth making. Just putting one on waivers could well be a better option. I don't think we owe Joey MacDonald any especial consideration either, so if he gets bumped for a little while by Budaj or Tokarski coming down to the Bulldogs, that's no big deal.

Even a "7th" is better than nothing.
I suspect tokarski's value would be more than that for several teams... Budaj perhaps not, especially given MT's decision to bypass him in the PO's.
But you don't start the year with 3 on the nhl roster, and either of them is likely to get claimed if exposed to waivers.

Personally, I'm dangling Tokarski until late September & trading him for best offer on table. (*unless price is not ready to start season)

 

[FerrisRox]

They went with Tokarski in the playoffs because the Habs had a better chance to win the cup with him, there's no other reason.

Further to that, while it was obviously a "coaching decision" to go with Tokarski over Budaj, that doesn't mean that Budaj doesn't have the coaching staff's confidence as a result.

Being a back up for a starting goaltender that is projected to be carrying a fairly heavy work load requires a certain kind of player, not necessarily cut-and-dry the most talented player. How that player pushes - or doesn't push - the starting goaltender is factor, how they mentally prepare for a light work load and how they support the team in practice, etc. is important as well.

In my opinion, Peter Budaj has proven a lot more in terms of his ability to play at an NHL level and how he's fit into the team and worked with Carey. Tokarski played well last spring, but at the end of the day he won two games. Let's be serious.

 

[Miller Time]

there was no pressure because no one expected him to play and most rightfully knew that sans price the habs goose would be cooked.

That's VERY different than playing under the expectations that are present in montreal for goalies. One might even say UNIQUELY present in montreal. We have ZERO indication whether he can handle it when people view him as anything other than our last hope.

And it doesnt change the fact that if you choose him, you are essentially killing his career, no one wants a goalie who plays a dozenn games a year and by the time people get used to him playing such low numbers, fucale's probably ready.

He's a AHL calibre goalie who lucked into a NHL position and did better than expected which is still VERY different from good. That does not make him NHL calibre and it sure as hell doesnt make him one of the more attractive backups in the league.

right now who do you think has more value ( not upside on the inane supposition that they are going to get the chance to actually display their talents), tokarski or James Reimer ?

You can only trade on potential for so long, remeber that habs goalie who lit it up in the playoffs, that no namer who looked so bright. What was his name again ? Oh that's right, Steve Penny. How did that work out again ?

Tokarski isnt bad, he isnt good. What he is, is unproven. Thinking that a GM would trade a third for a guy whose still on his second sip on his cup of coffee in the nhl on the sheer basis that he " might" be good is crazy.

Crazier than trading mcdo/Higgins for Gomez?
Crazier than giving Pisani a big pay day?
Crazier than most trade deadline deals?


Playoff performance is like catnip for gm's... They can't resist.
A young goalie who played great in the ECF, available for a mid level asset? I don't think it would be a tough sell.

 

[FerrisRox]

Playoff performance is like catnip for gm's... They can't resist.
A young goalie who played great in the ECF, available for a mid level asset? I don't think it would be a tough sell.

I don't disagree with that. But were not talking about Steve Penney. Steve Penney came out of nowhere in the 1984 playoffs with a few (bad) NHL starts to his credit and proceeded to deliver highlight reel goaltending and backstopped the Habs all the way to the Semi-Final.

This isn't Chris Kontos or John Druce or Pisani or whoever. This is a guy who won two games and played well.

There's a world of difference that seems to be getting ignored. Tokarski played great and it was a fun story but in the end in won two games and they lost the series. It's not only a very small sample size it's also a loss. This seems like an emotional response by some Habs fans that suddenly think he's a hero and destined for NHL success because of this handful of games. It's not very realistic and I don't think there were any other GM's that suddenly changed their plans and targeted Tokarsi as a trade target after he played five pretty good games.

 

[Miller Time]

Michael Leighton back-stopped his team to the Stanley Cup Final - meaning he did what Tokarski did, except he won multiple series and didn't it for a much longer time. Where's he at?

If you think Tokarski winning a game in the ECF suddenly make him among the best back up goalies in the league I think you're going to be very surprised when he gets waived to the minors next month. He doesn't have anywhere close to the value you seem to think he does and he has a helluva lot more to prove before he will be perceived as legit NHL back-up let alone among the best in the league in that regard.

Every GM in the league knows Montreal has Price, Budaj and Tokarski under contract. They also know that Joey MacDonald was signed. If they were perceived as "about the best back ups you could find in the league" I assure you, teams would have been contacting Bergevin to acquire one of them. Montreal will be forced to make a decision at the end of camp, so teams know they would be available and the price would be very reasonable, and still, there was no trade. Your perceived value and the actual value are dramatically apart it would seem. I think Budaj might return a 5th or 6th rounder at best to a team like New Jersey. I don't think Tokarski has much trade value at all.

Leighton got a 1.1m$ raise (from 600k to 1.5m) for his playoff work...

He has played 2 NHL games since then.

PO performance creates demand that exceeds "value".

Thanks for proving my point

 

[Miller Time]

I don't disagree with that. But were not talking about Steve Penney. Steve Penney came out of nowhere in the 1984 playoffs with a few (bad) NHL starts to his credit and proceeded to deliver highlight reel goaltending and backstopped the Habs all the way to the Semi-Final.

This isn't Chris Kontos or John Druce or Pisani or whoever. This is a guy who won two games and played well.

There's a world of difference that seems to be getting ignored. Tokarski played great and it was a fun story but in the end in won two games and they lost the series. It's not only a very small sample size it's also a loss. This seems like an emotional response by some Habs fans that suddenly think he's a hero and destined for NHL success because of this handful of games. It's not very realistic and I don't think there were any other GM's that suddenly changed their plans and targeted Tokarsi as a trade target after he played five pretty good games.

You're approaching it rationally...

Gm's don't work that way.

Need + Narrative.

Though I would argue that every day that goes by diminishes Tokarski's lingering PO bump...
Perhaps MB is banking on him getting lots of pre season work, and solid play there (or injury/disappointing play from rival incumbents) will nudge a prospective trade partner a bit further in his offering?

 

[FerrisRox]

Leighton got a 1.1m$ raise (from 600k to 1.5m) for his playoff work...

He has played 2 NHL games since then.

PO performance creates demand that exceeds "value".

Thanks for proving my point

So you think what Tokarski did in the playoffs, win two games, is the same as what Leighton did, which was go to the Stanley Cup Final?

I wasn't denying Leighton had inflated value based on his playoff performance... I was pointing out that he's played just two games since. Lessons learned, these guys don't have a track record and in the case of Tokarski, he doesn't have the success that Leigton had. Leighton won three series, Tokarski won two games.

 

[Miller Time]

So you think what Tokarski did in the playoffs, win two games, is the same as what Leighton did, which was go to the Stanley Cup Final?

I wasn't denying Leighton had inflated value based on his playoff performance... I was pointing out that he's played just two games since. Lessons learned, these guys don't have a track record and in the case of Tokarski, he doesn't have the success that Leigton had. Leighton won three series, Tokarski won two games.

says you...

 

[habs59]

Trade him to the jets in a package deal to get buffy and kane

 

[FerrisRox]

says you...

You're right, all of the trade rumors and all of the teams clamouring to get their hands on Dustin Tokarski this summer prove me wrong.

 

[FerrisRox]

Trade him to the jets in a package deal to get buffy and kane

Yeah, that'll happen.