Speculation: What would you pay Larkin on an extension?

[Pavels Dog]

8x8 seems about right.

 

[Stony Curtis]

True. He could just dip into the massive pool of #1 c’s that are ufa’ or available for trade.

I get what you're saying, and all things considered it'll probably go down like that. But there have been more than a few times when SY made a move and I said, "Man, I did not see that shit coming."

 

[Revenge of Gru]

Columbus maybe if they get rid of Laine.
Buffalo no, they are still paying 9 million per for Jeff Skinner.
Seattle no, they are building a team from the ground up.

Larkin is not worth 9 million.

He could get it easily regardless of your opinion.

 

[Revenge of Gru]

It will be less than any formula is suggesting.

It's Yzerman negoating this, and it will set the Tampa-style TEAM STANDARD.

It's the Yzerman-STANDARD, from Detroit days, when the highest-paid leaders left money on the table to get Brett Hull + Cup.

Everybody will be taking less than market value. And that's the biggest Weapon in Salary Cap world.

Just wait and see.

Yzerman is not infallible. He completely botched the Bertuzzi situation. Bert inevitably will walk. Larkin's agent will smell blood and he should if he's doing his job. Larkin will not win a cup here. Why should he take a discount to play for a mediocre middling team stuck squarely in purgatory?

 

[Henkka]

8x8 seems about right.

What if Yzerman maximum is 4 years.

 

[Gniwder]

What’s a bigger dumb GM move? Overpaying Larkin by a million or two or having pius suter become your #1 c?


I don’t think it would come to that because I would guess Larkin is the player most likely to take a hometown discount

This. Larkin makes the team watchable, pay him whatever he wants.

Want to save $1M/yr? Don't re-sign Erne, DDK, Suter, or Leddy. Not sure why people are worried about $1M in either direction of $8M, the team won't find a better player in free agency for less than $9M, and there's no prospects as good either. So either the team re-signs Larkin or winds up overpaying for a shittier player in free agency.

 

[Henkka]

They should save 1M per position.

That's 23M cap edge in 23-man roster.

Just like at Tampa. Everybody is underpaid - and happy. They are winners and the best team.

 

[Henkovic]

I think Larkin would take a team friendly contract. 7-7.5x7. He's gonna play for the red wings for his whole career.

 

[newfy]

Name 1 team with the cap space that would pay him that much as UFA?
As much as I like Larkin he hasn't shown anything close to 9 million a season.

A 26 year old first line center that can be had for free? You really think all kinds of teams wouldnt be lining up to take a stab at getting him?

8x8 wuold be nice for both sides I think, he would easily get 9 on the open market

 

[Gniwder]

Yzerman is not infallible. He completely botched the Bertuzzi situation. Bert inevitably will walk. Larkin's agent will smell blood and he should if he's doing his job. Larkin will not win a cup here. Why should he take a discount to play for a mediocre middling team stuck squarely in purgatory?

Bert had a back injury, it was a risk Stevie wasn't willing to take. He missed almost the entire season last year, that's not the type of risks GMs take.

Bert isn't walking, he's just gonna command more money and Stevie will have to pay it. That's just how it goes sometimes.

 

[Gniwder]

A 26 year old first line center that can be had for free? You really think all kinds of teams wouldnt be lining up to take a stab at getting him?

8x8 wuold be nice for both sides I think, he would easily get 9 on the open market

We'll find out this offseason with Hertl. He'll set the market for next season along with Kadri, so this discussion is premature anyways.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

What if Yzerman maximum is 4 years.

Like he only gave 4 years to Stamkos or Hedman, right? Where is this 4 year maximum coming from?

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

Man, I swear you guys had this "Larkin is a #1C" rants saved in your drafts lol. Ever heard of SAMPLE SIZE? Let him do it for a FULL SEASON OR TWO before we give him the bricks truck.........

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Are those the only choices? Because a GM who left himself no options other than those two choices could certainly be considered dumb. SY is not dumb.

No, those are not the only choices. But, Yzerman will only play hardball with a guy if he's got a damn good idea that he'll win playing hardball with a guy.

Wings are probably going into negotiations hoping for something that lands in 8x7-8x9. But they're not going to be pushed into a corner to have to wildly overpay. To win in negotiations, you have to be the one willing to walk away from the table and get the opposition to come to your terms. It's something Yzerman is damn good at.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Man, I swear you guys had this "Larkin is a #1C" rants saved in your drafts lol. Ever heard of SAMPLE SIZE? Let him do it for a FULL SEASON OR TWO before we give him the bricks truck.........

He's making 6.1m right now. Adding another 2M to that contract is not "backing up the brinks truck". Regardless of anything that's happened (namely, being on one of the shittiest rosters in league history for five years), he's a 0.7 PPG C who's reasonably good defensively. In the current NHL, that's an 8M a year player.

His sample size is 17-18 and 18-19 where he had 63 and 73 points in 82 and 76 games respectively and this year where he is at 37 in 37.

I swear, it seems sometimes like you pull up arguments with words that you know are involved in arguments, but you have no idea what they actually mean. Dylan Larkin has 470 games during which he's averaged in the neighborhood of 0.7 PPG while having one of the most wretched defenses, with a singular good outlet passer, in hockey behind him and operating on a one-line offensive team.

Frankly, if you get Dylan Larkin at 8x8, you're getting a deal.

 

[14ari13]

This. Larkin makes the team watchable, pay him whatever he wants.

Want to save $1M/yr? Don't re-sign Erne, DDK, Suter, or Leddy. Not sure why people are worried about $1M in either direction of $8M, the team won't find a better player in free agency for less than $9M, and there's no prospects as good either. So either the team re-signs Larkin or winds up overpaying for a shittier player in free agency.

We have to save 1 million here and there. When we become competitive it will be helpful and decisive to go all the way.

 

[Gniwder]

We have to save 1 million here and there. When we become competitive it will be helpful and decisive to go all the way.

Look at every playoff team and they save money on the bottom 6, not the top 6.

Wanna save $1M? Let Erne walk, he can be replaced for $1M.

 

[newfy]

We'll find out this offseason with Hertl. He'll set the market for next season along with Kadri, so this discussion is premature anyways.

I dont think Hertl is held in the same regard as Larkin around the league at all. Kadri is a weird one though, this year is such an anomaly for him on a stacked team that I have no clue what someone will pay him

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

We have to save 1 million here and there. When we become competitive it will be helpful and decisive to go all the way.

Trim the money off of Bertuzzi’s contract, Fabbri’s contract, etc.

Dylan Larkin at 8x8 is a discount, even if you don’t think it is.

That IS trimming a million off our cap.

What contract do you think Tomas Hertl takes? Because you’ll have to add some to that for Larkin because Larkin is a better player

 

[Gniwder]

I dont think Hertl is held in the same regard as Larkin around the league at all. Kadri is a weird one though, this year is such an anomaly for him on a stacked team that I have no clue what someone will pay him

True, but at the same time teams would have concerns about Larkin long term due to injuries as well as the type of game he plays. A player that relies on speed generally does not age as well as a player that relies on skill. So in that regards, I think it's a wash.

Kadri is indeed a strange one. I think that's why he's important as far as what a GM is willing to pay. He is definitely not a player I want, and would probably wind up being a disaster if he signs anywhere but Colorado.

 

[newfy]

True, but at the same time teams would have concerns about Larkin long term due to injuries as well as the type of game he plays. A player that relies on speed generally does not age as well as a player that relies on skill. So in that regards, I think it's a wash.

Kadri is indeed a strange one. I think that's why he's important as far as what a GM is willing to pay. He is definitely not a player I want, and would probably wind up being a disaster if he signs anywhere but Colorado.

I dont think teams really would worry about injuries. He'll be 26 when his deal is up. Getting a shot at a first line center in the middle of their prime vs what teams sign 30+ year old free agents for regularly makes me think injuries would be at the back of their minds. It would be sweet if he took a hometown deal to kinda set the standard for what guys will sign for but compared to the open market 8x8might actually be a discount

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

I'd be shocked if Dylan Larkin takes anything less then 8x9 he's already a PPG player this year and is only getting better.

 

[Gniwder]

I dont think teams really would worry about injuries. He'll be 26 when his deal is up. Getting a shot at a first line center in the middle of their prime vs what teams sign 30+ year old free agents for regularly makes me think injuries would be at the back of their minds. It would be sweet if he took a hometown deal to kinda set the standard for what guys will sign for but compared to the open market 8x8might actually be a discount

I think 8x8 is a fair deal that includes about $1M/yr of hometown discount. If he wants $9, I think a 7 year deal is more appropriate, no point in giving him an extra year if the team has to pay UFA salary. Unless he has a really bad season next year, that is probably the range we see.

I like DBoss, I think he's playing well, but I also don't think he'll be a $9M/yr player when he hits 33. My opinion, nothing to back it up except that speed players don't age well.

 

[kliq]

I dont think Hertl is held in the same regard as Larkin around the league at all. Kadri is a weird one though, this year is such an anomaly for him on a stacked team that I have no clue what someone will pay him

He’s also a lot older then Larkin. I believe about 6 years? The older you are, the less you will get in term.

 

[Gniwder]

He’s also a lot older then Larkin. I believe about 6 years? The older you are, the less you will get in term.

Hertl is 28 with a November birthday
Larkin will be a free agent on his 27th birthday (almost exactly)

16 months is not a big factor in free agency. Both will be looking for their big payday since they're not gonna get another big contract again.

We know with Larkin that he will try to win regardless of how much he makes, I don't think money is the motivating factor like it is with Erne, Namestnikov, or Mantha. I'd also like to see Bert re-signed since he's also got a winning mentality.

I think the other big factor here is if Stevie signs some help or not this summer. I doubt D-Boss wants to lose his entire career. If it was me, I'd Hossa and sign a cheap one year contract to chase the Cup. But that's me.