Westhead: Coyotes' survival hinges on arena deal battle

[CBJ goalie]

I'll give credit to even SN guys who I dislike in Damien Cox openly tweeting about this topic and calling for the farce to end. I expected Friedman to always report on it.

And he did:
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/coyotes-crisis-rears-ugly-head-at-terrible-time/

....but nothing of substance that I can see. Just generally commenting how bad the timing is for this to happen (SC Finals, 2 weeks before NHL draft).

 

[LPHabsFan]

Yes, I think not moving and fighting Balsillie was correct, but yeah, would the NHL and its owners have been better off just moving this team before this lease?

There really wasn't a good option two or three years ago though.

 

[Killion]

It does neither side any good to go nuclear.

Well, Glendale just publicly opened the silo's, countdown to missile launch at 600hrs CMT. So short of Alien intervention, Giant Black Triangles or Silver Discs showing up & deprogramming, shutting the entire system down in Arizona, those MinuteMan's, there gunna be headed straight for NYC. Target coordinates = 1185 Avenue of the Americas. So either once again the COG folds like a cheap cardboard suitcase in the rain or they carry through with their threat & this passes vote this evening. If its a threat, scare tactic to get IA to re-open & renegotiate as in TODAY or ELSE, thats just not on. If this is just all a game of Bluff, Glendale has just absolutely guaranteed that team leaves, the relationship while toxic as it is now beyond poisoned. Fatal.

 

[powerstuck]

There really wasn't a good option two or three years ago though.

There were. Today I see Seattle (without an arena) and Portland (without an owner willing to even hear about hockey) as front runners.

Well, two-three years ago Quebec city would have welcomed the Coyotes in the old Colisée for two years at most and would have started building their arena (due in September) a year to 18 months earlier if they would've been given a team.

So, today landing posts are not really different than three years ago the way NHL looks at them.

 

[cbcwpg]

Well, Glendale just publicly opened the silo's, countdown to missile launch at 600hrs CMT. So short of Alien intervention, Giant Black Triangles or Silver Discs showing up & deprogramming, shutting the entire system down in Arizona, those MinuteMan's, there gunna be headed straight for NYC. Target coordinates = 1185 Avenue of the Americas. So either once again the COG folds like a cheap cardboard suitcase in the rain or they carry through with their threat & this passes vote this evening. If its a threat, scare tactic to get IA to re-open & renegotiate as in TODAY or ELSE, thats just not on. If this is just all a game of Bluff, Glendale has just absolutely guaranteed that team leaves, the relationship while toxic as it is now beyond poisoned. Fatal.

Not just for you, but a question for anyone...

- Lots of speculation..... You would like the team to stay but, you have an AMF agreement that you just can't afford anymore or you would just like better terms. And maybe you just don't think IA is giving you enough bang for the buck because they aren't very good at arena management. And maybe you have convinced yourself that if the team did leave, it's not the end of the world. Or maybe you see the writing on the wall and you figure the team will use the out clause and leave anyways. But you found a tricky way to maybe get out of the lease.

What would you do if you were the CoG?

 

[Acesolid]

Man, the more I think about it, the more this is nuts if the vote passes tonight and the Coyotes are kicked out of Glendale.

If they are, can the NHL manage to get a court injuction to force the City to let the Yotes play in their arena?

Because the NHL's "window to relocate" is paper thin right now. And it might even be too late.

If they don't immediately relocate if the vote passes, they basically commit themselves to playing another season in Arizona whether they can manage to play in the arena (trough an injuction, or at terms very advantageous to Glendale) or not (even if it's at a 1000 seats Pee-Wee arena). And thus they are really weak.

Bettman has to choose now: roll the dice or relocate. But if he rolls and loses.... man, this might get uglier then even the darkest hours of the Yotes....

 

[Llama19]

Not just for you, but a question for anyone...

- You would like the team to stay ( assuming this ) but, you have an AMF agreement that you just can't afford anymore or you would just like better terms. And maybe you just don't think IA is giving you enough bang for the buck because they aren't very good at arena management. And maybe you have convinced yourself that if the team did leave, it's not the end of the world. But you found a tricky way to maybe get out of the lease.

What would you do if you were the CoG?

With Anthony LeBlanc shouting how well the 'team' is doing financially, they could stay...

But without IceArizona getting their 'arena management fee,'
Glendale apparently has determined they are not essential to their bottom line,
which is probably what the audit finally revealed...

P.S. The city 'may' use the last installment of $3,750,000 (due to be released on July 1) as an additional 'bargaining' chip...

 

[cbcwpg]

Man, the more I think about it, the more this is nuts if the vote passes tonight and the Coyotes are kicked out of Glendale.

If they are, can the NHL manage to get a court injuction to force the City to let the Yotes play in their arena?

Because the NHL's "window to relocate" is paper thin right now. And it might even be too late.

If they don't immediately relocate if the vote passes, they basically commit themselves to playing another season in Arizona whether they can manage to play in the arena (trough an injuction, or at terms very advantageous to Glendale) or not (even if it's at a 1000 seats Pee-Wee arena). And thus they are really weak.

Bettman has to choose now: roll the dice or relocate. But if he rolls and loses.... man, this might get uglier then even the darkest hours of the Yotes....

It is too late. Winnipeg got the Thrashers at the end of May and it ONLY worked because they already had an NHL facility at ~90% up to NHL spec for playing, and a staff in place to run a team. And that was still full on panic mode. I just don't see anywhere else that could take a team in time for next season. But if the Coyotes were kicked to the curb, the NHL would have to do something.

 

[Killion]

What would you do if you were the CoG?

Oh, absolutely I'd be looking for way out of this abomination of a deal and Id make absolutely certain that whatever way out was beyond bullet proof before dropping the bomb. This deal, death by a 1000 cuts. Its untenable. Madness. Should never have been allowed to have happened. That it did without intervention be it the State itself or Goldwater was to me both stunning and absolutely appalling. Honestly I dont even understand how it doesnt run against the very precepts & basis of fundamental Contract Law. Absolute financial suicide for the city. No performance clauses, no transparency, no nuthin, over double the going rate for management services, blatant subsidy if ever there was one. Yet I cant help but wonder based on past performance by the COG if this isnt all some kind of ill advised Bluff, that they crater once again, all tough talk & politicking, no intention of hitting that big red button.

 

[Mightygoose]

There really wasn't a good option two or three years ago though.

I see also years in the past, the NHL always had Glendale willing to do whatever they wanted to keep the team. It's all political IMO.

Weather that meant yes to the 2 'insurance policies', the proposed AMFs to Jamison and now to IA 2 years ago.

In this whole saga, the league always had enough votes in their municipal partner so to say, hence the league never had a reason to move them. This is why the Thrashers we're an easier move to WPG.

The irony here is more many years, the city had multiple votes to keep the team in town and required a 'yes'. This time a 'yes' and to the exact opposite.

 

[cutchemist42]

Man, the more I think about it, the more this is nuts if the vote passes tonight and the Coyotes are kicked out of Glendale.

If they are, can the NHL manage to get a court injuction to force the City to let the Yotes play in their arena?

Because the NHL's "window to relocate" is paper thin right now. And it might even be too late.

If they don't immediately relocate if the vote passes, they basically commit themselves to playing another season in Arizona whether they can manage to play in the arena (trough an injuction, or at terms very advantageous to Glendale) or not (even if it's at a 1000 seats Pee-Wee arena). And thus they are really weak.

Bettman has to choose now: roll the dice or relocate. But if he rolls and loses.... man, this might get uglier then even the darkest hours of the Yotes....

This is what Im wondering, is that the NHL while it might have a general idea for what it wants for City, is now probably in the warroom frantically figuring out its next move.

If they are, what are their best options?

 

[powerstuck]

Not just for you, but a question for anyone...

- Lots of speculation..... You would like the team to stay but, you have an AMF agreement that you just can't afford anymore or you would just like better terms. And maybe you just don't think IA is giving you enough bang for the buck because they aren't very good at arena management. And maybe you have convinced yourself that if the team did leave, it's not the end of the world. And maybe you see the writing on the wall and you figure the team will use the out clause and leave anyways. But you found a tricky way to maybe get out of the lease.

What would you do if you were the CoG?

I personally would have the team leave.

CoG has to pay the arena debt. But they have to do so even if they have a main tenant or not.
Current main tenant costs CoG about $7-8M a year ($15M AMF - Various taxes and fees return).

Loosing that main tenant makes me save $7-8M a year and opens door to find another main tenant or arena manager that should be able to charge less in AMF but bring in more in taxes.

In other words even if CoG is able to get a tenant or manager that would charge them $5M/year, they would be in better financial terms than they are right now.

 

[Llama19]

Oh, absolutely I'd be looking for way out of this abomination of a deal and Id make absolutely certain that whatever way out was beyond bullet proof before dropping the bomb. This deal, death by a 1000 cuts. Its untenable. Madness. Should never have been allowed to have happened. That it did without intervention be it the State itself or Goldwater was to me both stunning and absolutely appalling. Honestly I dont even understand how it doesnt run against the very precepts & basis of fundamental Contract Law. Absolute financial suicide for the city. No performance clauses, no transparency, no nuthin, over double the going rate for management services, blatant subsidy if ever there was one. Yet I cant help but wonder based on past performance by the COG if this isnt all some kind of ill advised Bluff, that they crater once again, all tough talk & politicking, no intention of hitting that big red button.

Are we seeing the future...

 

[Agalloch]

Why don't the Coyotes just buy the arena and be done with the City of Glendale ?

 

[LPHabsFan]

There were. Today I see Seattle (without an arena) and Portland (without an owner willing to even hear about hockey) as front runners.

Well, two-three years ago Quebec city would have welcomed the Coyotes in the old Colisée for two years at most and would have started building their arena (due in September) a year to 18 months earlier if they would've been given a team.

So, today landing posts are not really different than three years ago the way NHL looks at them.

1 - You're assuming that the Colisee is capable of housing an NHL team there full time. An exhibition game or two is one thing but for a season it's different.

Without trying to get this into a relocation thread, Seattle is much closer because back then they hadn't done the various studies they needed to do and figure out funding and where they want to build it. Portland haven't followed much.

2 - There's also the Thrashers issue that came up at the same time. Moving one team is bad enough but to move two (I think within weeks of eachother?)

Not just for you, but a question for anyone...

- You would like the team to stay ( assuming this ) but, you have an AMF agreement that you just can't afford anymore or you would just like better terms. And maybe you just don't think IA is giving you enough bang for the buck because they aren't very good at arena management. And maybe you have convinced yourself that if the team did leave, it's not the end of the world. But you found a tricky way to maybe get out of the lease.

What would you do if you were the CoG?

Assuming the COG follows through with voiding the lease, they've already accepted the fact that the team has a very real chance of not playing there anymore. They are mainly banking on the fact that it will be difficult (not impossible) to move and are hoping to strong arm the league into agreeing to something on better terms.

The problem is we are back to square one in a lot of ways. Even cutting down the AMF in half won't do much because then at best (based on what I remember of the numbers) it will break even. They don't want to break even, they want to make money. And any money they make is taking money away from IA and there's no reason whatsoever to think IA is going to agree (willingly) to something that takes significant money away from them.

For the COG, I think they've started to realize that they are better off not paying the 15 million because any amount they make directly and indirectly (westgate) because of the Coyotes is far outweighed by what they spend.

People said it two years ago and they will say it again. Thinking solely for what is best for the COG, there was a company that came up with a half decent bid three years ago and let the team either leave or negotiate with them.

For the team, they are better off either leaving or negotiating with the other company. They probably won't spend that much more on "rent" and they wouldn't have to deal with all the headaches that come with being "in charge" of the arena.

 

[checkerdome]

It must be ever so demoralizing for Coyotes players(and coaching and management) to be playing in a city whose "management" doesn't even want them there.

 

[Nordskull]

Seems legit

 

[CGG]

Also from the Westhead article, for anyone who thinks Anthony Leblanc and friends are innocent victims in a COG power play:

“When we went through the acquisition process last summer, we negotiated a number of revenue streams with the city of Glendale and one of them was of course them receiving a 20 per cent cut of the naming rights deal and we provided them with an expectation of what we thought that was going to be,†LeBlanc says in the video. “We’ve been able to provide them and hit that number that we provided them which was north of $600,000 a year so we’re very excited about that.â€

Glendale’s monthly arena revenues and expenditures breakout…. The latest monthly statement, for the month ended April 30, 2015, shows no income in the month for naming rights, and $274,500 in revenue year to date.

Good move, IA. Promise $600,000 a year to the city in naming rights. Don’t give them any details. Negotiate a new deal. Pat yourself on the back publically for delivering $600,000 a year to the city. Then actually pay them $274,500, which is far less than anyone was expecting. Don’t give the naming rights contract to anyone. Get a yesman to say that council all must be “lying or have amnesiaâ€. Then get all gosh golly shucks when the COG wants to tear up the lease. It’s braindead simple, really.

 

[Killion]

In other words even if CoG is able to get a tenant or manager that would charge them $5M/year, they would be in better financial terms than they are right now.

Yeah, absolutely. Yet time & time again, they are convinced that they can have their cake & eat it too. Beyond delusional, that if they just hang in there eventually they'll break even. If this is a bluff, its ill conceived to say the least. If their serious, have thought this all through properly & are prepared to go nuclear & have their i's dotted & t's crossed then good for them. Unfortunately I have even less confidence in the COG than I do in IA's abilities, smarts & savvy in filling the rink be it for hockey or non-hockey events.

 

[rt]

NHL states they expect the COG to honor their "obligations" and for the Coyotes to play at GRA this season.

But what if the COG actually does vote tonight? What if they actually do cancel the lease and the management contract?

Even if the NHL feels the COG doesn't have a leg to stand on. Even if they're sure they'll win a lawsuit, isn't there the danger that in pursuing legal action against the COG, that the city will attempt to remove the team from the city owned GRA? Even if the NHL is confident a judge will allow the team to play there, can they be CERTAIN? Even if that does happen, and a judge does let them play out the year at GRA, how much will a lame-duck season cost the NHL? Especially when they'll just have to sell for relo next season anyway. They're already losing the expansion nut in that scenario.

So while there is still a window for relo right now (as microscopically narrow as that window may be), doesn't it make sense to just move the team immediately if the City cancels the agreements for the arena? If you sell to Quebec you can be CERTAIN that all 30 of your franchises actually have a place to play next season. Even if you thought QC was good for 500m in expansion, and you think you can only get 300m out of them for relo, at least you don't end up losing 50+ million this season. So you're out over 100m, but you avoid the doomsday scenario of a truly homeless franchise.

 

[Nordskull]

Yeah, absolutely. Yet time & time again, they are convinced that they can have their cake & eat it too. Beyond delusional, that if they just hang in there eventually they'll break even. If this is a bluff, its ill conceived to say the least. If their serious, have thought this all through properly & are prepared to go nuclear & have their i's dotted & t's crossed then good for them. Unfortunately I have even less confidence in the COG than I do in IA's abilities, smarts & savvy in filling the rink be it for hockey or non-hockey events.

I'd say you're right.

If they go ahead, I'm ready to wear a Habs hat for an entire week.

 

[tony d]

Yeah, the Coyotes are an embarrassment to the league. Even if this gets cleared up tonight something else will come up next week. Time to move that team to anywhere else but Arizona.

 

[madhi19]

Man, the more I think about it, the more this is nuts if the vote passes tonight and the Coyotes are kicked out of Glendale.

If they are, can the NHL manage to get a court injuction to force the City to let the Yotes play in their arena?

Because the NHL's "window to relocate" is paper thin right now. And it might even be too late.

If they don't immediately relocate if the vote passes, they basically commit themselves to playing another season in Arizona whether they can manage to play in the arena (trough an injuction, or at terms very advantageous to Glendale) or not (even if it's at a 1000 seats Pee-Wee arena). And thus they are really weak.

Bettman has to choose now: roll the dice or relocate. But if he rolls and loses.... man, this might get uglier then even the darkest hours of the Yotes....

Bettman can afford to gamble, after all it with the league line of credit not his money that he's playing with. But I wonder if the clowns who are badly leveraged already can? If they really want to stick it out, and sue the NHL might have to take back ownership of the team.

 

[Evil Doctor]

Seems legit

I don't see how a league going to war with one of it's member host cities can in any way benefit the league? The only end result is that ground is permanently salted for hockey in that area, and might cause other potential host cities to reconsider wanting to get in bed with the NHL.

 

[LPHabsFan]

NHL states they expect the COG to honor their "obligations" and for the Coyotes to play at GRA this season.

But what if the COG actually does vote tonight? What if they actually do cancel the lease and the management contract?

Even if the NHL feels the COG doesn't have a leg to stand on. Even if they're sure they'll win a lawsuit, isn't there the danger that in pursuing legal action against the COG, that the city will attempt to remove the team from the city owned GRA? Even if the NHL is confident a judge will allow the team to play there, can they be CERTAIN? Even if that does happen, and a judge does let them play out the year at GRA, how much will a lame-duck season cost the NHL? Especially when they'll just have to sell for relo next season anyway. They're already losing the expansion nut in that scenario.

So while there is still a window for relo right now (as microscopically narrow as that window may be), doesn't it make sense to just move the team immediately if the City cancels the agreements for the arena? If you sell to Quebec you can be CERTAIN that all 30 of your franchises actually have a place to play next season. Even if you thought QC was good for 500m in expansion, and you think you can only get 300m out of them for relo, at least you don't end up losing 50+ million this season. So you're out over 100m, but you avoid the doomsday scenario of a truly homeless franchise.

Well, my guess is the NHL has a certain point whereby they will have to make a decision. If they are not able to get a TRO/injunction at a certain point they will have to decide on plan b.

Dare I say that it might be within the next.........two weeks?