Vladimir Konstantinov Gofundme

[Shaman464]

It’s not evil.

It’s actually far more disgusting how you are trying to turn this into more than it is with incredibly specious arguments. What the city has given or whatever that nonsense is has nothing to do with anything.

If the Wings or some of Vladdy’s teammates wanted to kick into support him, it would be fantastic. It would be amazing. But the fact that they aren’t fronting the money for living expenses or health care over twenty years after the fact when he got injured in a very very unfortunate accident while celebrating with some of the team isn’t an example of evil.

It sucks that Vladdy and his family are in such dire straits. It really sucks. But the Wings, the NHL/NHLPA, and even Vladdy’s old teammates aren’t somehow lesser men or organizations because they don’t foot the bill for him

I can't hear you over a literal billionaire letting a guy who helped build his brand and his family potentially lose the care he needs so he has to CROWD FUND his care. What's worse, and what you don't care to address is that part of that brand they built is that they take care of their own. Detroit has done a lot for the Illitches. Paid for their arena, given them millions in tax breaks, haven't charged them for water (which is really weird), let them have sweet heart deals for land they refuse to develop. The least they can do is actually live up to the image they work so hard to tell us all about.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

I can't hear you over a literal billionaire letting a guy who helped build his brand and his family potentially lose the care he needs so he has to CROWD FUND his care. What's worse, and what you don't care to address is that part of that brand they built is that they take care of their own. Detroit has done a lot for the Illitches. Paid for their arena, given them millions in tax breaks, haven't charged them for water (which is really weird), let them have sweet heart deals for land they refuse to develop. The least they can do is actually live up to the image they work so hard to tell us all about.

Your argument has little merit.

1). The Illitches got money for LCA because the city thought building up the Cass Corridor and making District Detroit was a good business decision.

2). Just because someone has a lot does not make them evil for not spending it. It would be a fantastic thing if they were to foot the bill for Vladdy, but by no means should they be expected to just because “by god, he’s a billionaire.”

3). You can’t give any evidence as to the support they may have already provided or may continue to provide. They, as written in the post, just recently ran a premiere event for this special trust and I would imagine kicked in an amount themselves to it.

 

[Shaman464]

Your argument has little merit.

1). The Illitches got money for LCA because the city thought building up the Cass Corridor and making District Detroit was a good business decision.

2). Just because someone has a lot does not make them evil for not spending it. It would be a fantastic thing if they were to foot the bill for Vladdy, but by no means should they be expected to just because “by god, he’s a billionaire.”

3). You can’t give any evidence as to the support they may have already provided or may continue to provide. They, as written in the post, just recently ran a premiere event for this special trust and I would imagine kicked in an amount themselves to it.

1) Except there's not only a wealth of evidence that publicly financed stadiums are are horrible ideas, there's also been very recent news that the Illitches haven't lived up to their promises of developing the area around the stadium. Cass Corridor neighbors see unfilled promises in Little Caesars Arena district

2) He's not just 'by god a billionaire', their family has used their 'we take care of our own' 'we're all a family' tripe to win public good will.

3) You can't produce evidence of a negative. And, if apparently, they aren't kicking in that much that there is a crowd funding effort to try to support him.

 

[solo16]

How exactly do you know the family hasn't helped him already in a variety of ways. They hosted the inaugural snt fundraiser. I think alot of you guys are imagining an issue that fors not exist.

I do this professionally. If vlad is worth 20k or 2m I would still create an special needs trust for any additional donations. It's not a loophole it is technique designed by Congress intentionally.

Maybe chill the judgement and rhetoric this isnt the green new deal. It's not my job to tell a billionaire how to spend his money. I am sure they do more good accidentally than everyone in this thread.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

They spell their name Ilitch. Man this drives me crazy at times.

Separating a person that needs this level of care in this manner from personal wealth to a trust run estate is common in these cases. Vladdy's personal wealth is completely unknown.

Unfortunately, I have witnessed this twice in my own life. I don't think many of you understand the dynamics at play to care for an adult that functions at this capacity mentally and physically. To spout off this is evil right away is likely not the case. There is the small chance it turns out to be. Doubt they would glowingly thank the team or he would have been at several games this year if that were the case....

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

They spell their name Ilitch. Man this drives me crazy at times.

Separating a person that needs this level of care in this manner from personal wealth to a trust run estate is common in these cases. Vladdy's personal wealth is completely unknown.

Unfortunately, I have witnessed this twice in my own life. I don't think many of you understand the dynamics at play to care for an adult that functions at this capacity mentally and physically. To spout off this is evil right away is likely not the case. There is the small chance it turns out to be. Doubt they would glowingly thanks the team or he would have been at several games this year if that were the case....

There is nothing evil about it. Shaman and others want to demonize the Wings for not doing more when the principals involved in this (namely Vladdy’s family) don’t.

And I messed up the spelling, I apologize.

What it comes down to here is that it would be a wonderful thing if the org or his old teammates kicked in all the cash. However, they aren’t evil pieces of **** if they don’t. And from what I’ve been reading, this gofundme is independent from the actual true healthcare to maintain his physical health and extends to things like a new wheelchair accessible van for easier travel for trips and other similar expenses like that which fall outside of the purveyance of normal health care.

And you can tell the “this is evil” group has a weak argument because they bring in the political nonsense that everyone has a problem with (publicly funded arenas) to try to make the point stronger.

 

[solo16]

There is nothing evil about it. Shaman and others want to demonize the Wings for not doing more when the principals involved in this (namely Vladdy’s family) don’t.

And I messed up the spelling, I apologize.

What it comes down to here is that it would be a wonderful thing if the org or his old teammates kicked in all the cash. However, they aren’t evil pieces of **** if they don’t. And from what I’ve been reading, this gofundme is independent from the actual true healthcare to maintain his physical health and extends to things like a new wheelchair accessible van for easier travel for trips and other similar expenses like that which fall outside of the purveyance of normal health care.

And you can tell the “this is evil” group has a weak argument because they bring in the political nonsense that everyone has a problem with (publicly funded arenas) to try to make the point stronger.

The way an ant works is it can only pay for things Medicaid would not. So it cant pay for food or shelter. Only handicapvans, luxuries, support workers, cable TV, haircuts etc. That's just the tool the using. He obviously needs full care. If you allow the trust to pay for those needs covered by Medicaid then he is ineligible for the state assistance.

Go to a nursing home for a truly broke person. They have 0 amenities. Ahetwhe that is good or bad I do not know but having little things like cable TV covered when he runs out of money may have a profound impact on his life.

We also do not know how much money and support was given to him over the years. It's easy to say the team should pay, but I ask how much? How much have they already given. Hell just throwing him a fundraiser at the stadium is a pretty big gesture.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

It's definitely sad on many levels that it's come to a GoFundMe. Some have already delved into the nature of our healthcare system and costs associated with complicated long term care.

But before people cast judgment on anyone involve, let's remember we have no idea exactly who, what and how much all the people involved have already done for Vladdy. It's hard for me to believe but his accident was 22 years ago. An article in the Detroit News a couple years back referred to him having full-time caretakers. I can't even imagine how astronomical a number two decades of his care must cost.

 

[Debrincat93]

this is the part i dont get about athletes.
why not setup a #16 charity event where current guys every year sign some shit, auction it, and proceeds to go vladdy's org or whatever.

like random stuff, game used helmets to anything.
you mean to tell me, even having a Lakin + mantha/AA/Etc.. signed puck or bucket wouldnt land them $200+? each? come on.

 

[vladdy16]

There are many examples in the fossil record, through our 200,000 year history as a species, which show a handicapped member of a community being cared/provided for *unconditionally* until their last days.

Many thanks to TZE for offering level headed and experiential insight on how these things work today, and many thanks to Shaman for putting in the effort to stand up and look at this from a personal standpoint.

Beyond that, labeling a hockey player from the 80's/90's, that had half a career, as a 'celebrity' and 'millionaire' is a freaking joke.

The most efficient way to be dismissive would be to say nothing at all, imo.

 

[Fynn]

The Wings have pretty much given multiple players from their championship era "jobs" that are likely in the 6 figure range. Jiri Fischer has had a" job" with the Wings since his cardiac incident. I mean, they can't make Vladdie a good will ambassador and get him 100k a year so he can be taken care of? There isn't a slippery slope and it's a unique circumstance. Many organizations, the Tigers come to mind, have a myriad of "Special Assistants" consisting of retired, respected players to keep them in the family. I think it's an embarrassment to the Wings and the Ilitch family that his daughter had had to resort to GoFundMe to get him properly cared for.

 

[FissionFire]

All the chatter about the Red Wings stepping up, but isn’t this where the NHLPA should be stepping in front and center? Taking care of former players has long been an issue with them and this could be a great start. I hate seeing the players union always getting a pass when it comes to taking care of it’s old membership.

How can we be so sure the money isn't going to his handler/family member instead? Is Konstantinov in any metal state to understand and manage his finances? All you have to do is look at what happened to Stan Lee in his final years to know this is not a great cause to donate to.

I simply don't trust GoFundMe or any other charities. Too much corruption and other false acts.

$250,000 isn't that much money for the players and this organization. I'd rather just see the Red Wings family step up and pay for his expenses.

Since the donation is going into a trust I can say from experience that his family will not be cashing in on charity. Trusts have very specific and very strict rules about what money can be spent on and GoFundMe is good at shutting down fraudulent attempts and refunding money when it happens. The type of trust mentioned here would prevent any funds from being used for things like legal fees or administrative costs meaning 100% would go to authorized medical bills.

Your second point about what I assume to interpret as fake ‘jobs’ for money wouldn’t be smart. For one Jiri Fischer has a legitimate job. He scouts and even participates as an instructor as development camps. He’s never had a fake job. Just like Yzerman, Chelios, Draper, etc never had ‘jobs’ but actual real titles and responsibilities. For Konstantinov, it’s an entirely different situation. I’m fairly certain he’s long ago applied for and receives full disability. For him to start working, and at a significant income, would wipe that status out which would close a LOT of doors open now and make many of the medical bills covered suddenly become 100% his responsibility. It’s very likely cheaper for him NOT work than to have even a 100k annual salary job. I think you greatly underestimate the cost of care someone in his condition will have. It wouldn’t surprise me in the slightest if his medical expenses alone top 6 figures annually. That doesn’t include all the other benefits he likely gets as fully disabled such as housing assistance, food assistance, help paying utilities, etc.

 

[avssuc]

There are many examples in the fossil record, through our 200,000 year history as a species, which show a handicapped member of a community being cared/provided for *unconditionally* until their last days.

Many thanks to TZE for offering level headed and experiential insight on how these things work today, and many thanks to Shaman for putting in the effort to stand up and look at this from a personal standpoint.

Beyond that, labeling a hockey player from the 80's/90's, that had half a career, as a 'celebrity' and 'millionaire' is a freaking joke.

The most efficient way to be dismissive would be to say nothing at all, imo.

How dare you cite the anthropological and/or archaeological record here! Don't you know how to be a blissfully unaware serf and enjoy your bread and circus? We should be trying to deify Mike Ilitch so that we can build idols and worship him properly, not talking about how we were more evolved on the communal level prior to the neolithic revolution.

 

[avssuc]

Your argument has little merit.

Just because someone has a lot does not make them evil for not spending it.

Yes... yes it does. Money is a finite resource (forget about QE and the other evil methods they use to cook their books to attain more consolidated wealth). I would, by definition, be a POS if me and 7 of my wealthiest friends took 50% of the worlds water supply and hoarded the majority.

Study: 8 people have same wealth as world's poorest half

We would be the very definition of evil. As it is now, a child dies every 10 seconds from malnutrition (I know that number is debated, but it wouldn't be acceptable if it were 10 mins). When the UN estimates the number to end world hunger at $30 billion, the 3 richest Americans could end world hunger 7 times over. They make a choice to let people starve by not spending a tiny fraction their money (and there are market economic principles that will always prevent them from doing so). Extrapolate the cure over any percentage of the insanely wealthy and you see the same.

Maybe you've never been hungry (while living on or near precious metals/oil/etc) but it sucks kinda bad. I've been a gangster for capital interests in some of these poor areas. You hung your yellow ribbon while I witnessed/enforced the starvation and deprivation... and I did it for Merica... I did it to protect the economic world order, and the hoarding of resources that includes. After 2 decades in the racketeering biz, it's tough for me to look in the mirror. My wife thinks it's weird that I tend to leave the light off when I'm in the bathroom, but it's easier to be weird than to get lost in that reflection.

The only thing that sickens me more than those that are hoarding the problem solving wealth... are those that parrot 'their' comically insane talking points with an heir of intellectual superiority.

 

[Winger98]

Alright, this thread has ventured off the beaten path into politics realm. We argue enough with each other over hockey, so I'm shutting it down.