Music: Unpopular Music Opinions

[Behn Wilson]

-Freddie Mercury Best Male Singer of All-Time. Minnie Rippington Best Female.

No argument on Freddie Mercury, his voice is absolutely amazing. I think Karen Carpenter had the greatest female voice ever though your choice Maya Rudolph's mom, Minnie Riperton was no slouch either.

 

[Roo Returns]

Talking about Metal Heads; the community has changed so much since the 80s thanks to the internet and also maybe it's just because I'm an adult now, but people seem less one dimensional than the guys with long hair and all black. Some of the nicest people I've met have been metal heads, and they don't look down on you for only being a Judas Priest or Candiria fan etc.


Taylor Swift is an awful lyricist, it's like a 13 year girl had a slumber party and wrote lyrics on a toilet paper.

I'll go one step further and say that entire group (Katy Perry, Taylor Swift, Rhianna, etc.) that all came up together in the late 200s-early 2010s would be nothing without the 8 Swedish producers who write all their music.

I don't get Beyonce.

As to some of my earlier points I think J. Cole is a better rapper and has a better flow and voice than Kendrick Lamar. Damn was very boring to me. Chance The Rapper's gospel stuff is what makes him special to me.

As for the alternative bands. I never said I dislike Radiohead, just they're missing something from their music. It almost at times doesn't feel human or organic to me. But they have some great stuff.

 

[Pharrell Williams]

katy perry's teenage dream is one of the best pop albums of all time


also i mean this IS an unpopular music opinions thread but saying j. cole is better than kendrick lamar is like saying creed is better than led zeppelin, j. cole is pretty much a joke to a lot of people who listen to hip hop

 

[Roo Returns]

I am into metal and have been basically since the genre started and most metal fans I know are easy going and nice as can be. But the ones that are genre / sub-genre snobs are some of the most boorish people on the face of the earth. These are a very vocal online, a few of them can ruin a message board. The crowds at concerts are not like this at all.

It's funny, in college I found the beta hipsters (this was right before hipsters became cool), jam band (we're on a first name with Dave Matthews), and a decent amount of jazz musicians, to be more snobbish than metal heads. Heaven's forbid I listened to Primus, Dream Theater, Supertramp, whatever was on my head phones and I wasn't cool enough to have a conversation with. I also remember no one would play me a Karate record, and !!! was this huge secret, plus I went to a Pinback show and some people couldn't get over it.

 

[Roo Returns]

also i mean this IS an unpopular music opinions thread but saying j. cole is better than kendrick lamar is like saying creed is better than led zeppelin, j. cole is pretty much a joke to a lot of people who listen to hip hop

Not to be mean but that's the beauty of this thread and the society we live in. I can say that and not care if I have any cred from a board full of people I'll never meet, play music with, or marry.

And whose to say J. Cole is a joke? I've never heard that ever. Drake is a complete joke to me and a hack but 95% of the world doesn't feel that way.

 

[CycloneLaunch]

Yeah it's funny I don't have strong feelings either way on J. Cole but a common complaint about him is his music puts people to sleep so its interesting to me you would say that you prefer him to Kendrick cause Kendrick bores you.

Also a lot of people on a hip hop forum i frequent also think J. Cole is an "industry plant" hahaha

 

[Pharrell Williams]

Not to be mean but that's the beauty of this thread and the society we live in. I can say that and not care if I have any cred from a board full of people I'll never meet, play music with, or marry.

And whose to say J. Cole is a joke? I've never heard that ever. Drake is a complete joke to me and a hack but 95% of the world doesn't feel that way.

the whole platinum with no features thing became a meme too

drake sucks too, boo drake, boooooooooooo

 

[Know Your Enemy]

Sounds like everything I mentioned earlier to me. Cheesy, garish, overly showy, and kind of dumb, to my ears.

That's how I would describe a lot of Jazz music. Probably including some of the stuff that you like, like Free Jazz. although I haven't listened to that much of it. Do you think that jazz can often be overly showy?

 

[Roo Returns]

Yeah it's funny I don't have strong feelings either way on J. Cole but a common complaint about him is his music puts people to sleep so its interesting to me you would say that you prefer him to Kendrick cause Kendrick bores you.

Also a lot of people on a hip hop forum i frequent also think J. Cole is an "industry plant" hahaha

I never said Kendrick bores me entirely. good kid and Pimp are good albums. Damn was the boring one.

 

[Shareefruck]

That's how I would describe a lot of Jazz music. Probably including some of the stuff that you like, like Free Jazz. although I haven't listened to that much of it. Do you think that jazz can often be overly showy?

First, I can't comprehend thinking that jazz sounds garish and cheesy... like... at all. I mean, the common negative reputation would be for it to be considered pretentious and stand-off-ish, which is the polar opposite of that. Unless you're talking about smooth jazz or something, then I can see it.

Showy, I can possibly see with the more normal styles of jazz, but free jazz? No ****ing way. Free jazz can be criticized for being narcissistic, alienating, and self-indulgent, but nobody plays free jazz to show off their bravado and technique or to put up a front for an audience-- it's closer to communicating a mentality of "**** what everyone else thinks, I'm letting loose, becoming unhinged, and letting my raw, expressive instincts guide me."

In that sense, I would associate free jazz to being the punk music of regular jazz..... It's raw, uncontrolled, and irreverent, which would be completely anti-thetical to being showy and melodramatic.

While I love Jazz Fusion, I think you can far more reasonably make a case for Jazz Fusion being overly showy and grand-standing.

 

[Know Your Enemy]

First, I can't comprehend thinking that jazz sounds garish and cheesy... like... at all. I mean, the common negative reputation would be for it to be considered pretentious and stand-off-ish, which is the polar opposite of that. Unless you're talking about smooth jazz or something, then I can see it.

Showy, I can possibly see with the more normal styles of jazz, but free jazz? No ****ing way. Free jazz can be criticized for being narcissistic, alienating, and self-indulgent, but nobody plays free jazz to show off their bravado and technique or to put up a front for an audience-- it's closer to communicating a mentality of "**** what everyone else thinks, I'm letting loose, becoming unhinged, and letting my raw, expressive instincts guide me."

In that sense, I would associate free jazz to being the punk music of regular jazz..... It's raw, uncontrolled, and irreverent, which would be completely anti-thetical to being showy and melodramatic.

While I love Jazz Fusion, I think you can far more reasonably make a case for Jazz Fusion being overly showy and grand-standing.

That is exactly how I hear Free Jazz (like Coltrane). Obviously I don't understand Jazz much, because what I said is crazy to people who get it. I actually called my mother about this who is a jazz fan and studied music theory in College and she thinks I'm ****ed in the head saying that.

 

[member 151739]

Led Zeppelin is terrible. Iron Maiden is terrible. Judas Priest is terrible. Motorhead is terrible.

Also straight-up, instrumental jazz is an assault on the ears.

 

[Aladyyn]

Led Zeppelin is terrible. Iron Maiden is terrible. Judas Priest is terrible. Motorhead is terrible.

Also straight-up, instrumental jazz is an assault on the ears.

I can wrap my head around 3 of these, but I just can't fathom how one can hate Judas Priest.

 

[member 151739]

Also this.

Music: vocal or instrumental sounds (or both) combined in such a way as to produce beauty of form, harmony, and expression of emotion.

That is the definition of music. It doesn't say "guitar, drums, or piano" sounds. It says instrumental. And it says vocal, not singing that you personally enjoy.

Saying hip-hop or electronic music (DJs) isn't music is not an opinion. It is a factually inaccurate statement.

 

[Shareefruck]

That is exactly how I hear Free Jazz (like Coltrane). Obviously I don't understand Jazz much, because what I said is crazy to people who get it. I actually called my mother about this who is a jazz fan and studied music theory in College and she thinks I'm ****ed in the head saying that.

I'm hopelessly illiterate about the theory and technical side of it. But if I can speak in broad generalizations, I sort of instinctively see it like this.

Punk and Free Jazz are essentially taking the spirit of rock/jazz and stripping the music of everything that makes it palletable for most audiences, sort of embracing a nihilistic/raw/loose energy that's liberating, and happily flipping off the people who are left confused by it and want it to take itself more seriously.

Metal and Fusion (and sometimes prog rock) are sort of taking the fattest slabs of rock/jazz and laying it on as thick as humanly possible, hoping to impress and please in the most heavy and grandiose way possible.

These two things are at completely polar opposite ends of the spectrum, IMO.

I can understand anyone disliking either camps for various reasons, but I think calling free-jazz-era Coltrane grandiose, grandstanding, show-boating, and laying it on too thick makes about as much sense as calling John Lydon grandiose and grandstanding, show-boating, and laying it on too thick. I'm sure there are some jazz fans who will disagree with me, but my impression is that Free Jazz isn't really intended to be much of a highfalutin or meaningful thing, it's a very raw, primal, and instinctive thing, IMO. And when experimental rock bands (like Beefheart) borrow from it, that seems to be how they use those elements as well.

If you were making the argument that jazz groups like Mahavishnu Orchestra or the Weather Report were garish and laid it on too thick, I could get on board with that, though.

 

[Augscura]

I'm hopelessly illiterate about the theory and technical side of it. But if I can speak in broad generalizations, I sort of instinctively see it like this.

Punk and Free Jazz are essentially taking the spirit of rock/jazz and stripping the music of everything that makes it palletable for most audiences, sort of embracing a nihilistic/raw/loose energy that's liberating, and happily flipping off the people who are left confused by it and want it to take itself more seriously.

Metal and Fusion (and sometimes prog rock) are sort of taking the fattest slabs of rock/jazz and laying it on as thick as humanly possible, hoping to impress and please in the most grandiose way possible.

You sir, are completely ignorant to the world of old school death metal, late 80's and early 90's death metal is some of the most primitive, visceral, and raw music there is. Modern metal is definitely very strong on showmanship like you described but you'll still find that old school sound today if you're willing to look for it

 

[Shareefruck]

Probably.... I did say that I was going to speak in broad generalizations.

But it does seem like every time I try something, that's how it feels, and when it doesn't, it turns out that it's actually punk. I can accept that there must be some Metal out there that won't leave me with that bad taste, but every time I try something (like the EyeHateGod example), I end up still instinctively feeling that way about it. Almost like, even if it's attempting something raw, primitive, and visceral, I don't buy the sincerity of it based on the way it sounds or something.

What did you have in mind, though?

 

[Augscura]

Probably.... But it seems like every time I try something, that's how it feels, and when it doesn't, it turns out that it's actually punk. I've never gotten that impression from Death Metal, personally. Is there an old-school death metal and new school death metal that are completely different?

If so, can you recommend a few?

Old school:





Modern:



Big difference being production, old school is very raw and punchy, modern is very clean and overproduced, drums lack that punchiness, the overall sound is very compressed and robotic and the musicianship has way more showmanship

 

[Pharrell Williams]

Probably.... I did say that I was going to speak in broad generalizations.

But it does seem like every time I try something, that's how it feels, and when it doesn't, it turns out that it's actually punk. I can accept that there must be some Metal out there that won't leave me with that bad taste, but every time I try something (like the EyeHateGod example), I end up still instinctively feeling that way about it.

What did you have in mind, though?

metal usually seems both corny and cheesy to me but when it doesn't, i really like it. i like ride the lightning and some mastodon albums, but i'm pretty sure it's completely arbitrary that i don't feel as much cheesiness and corniness with them. maybe try leviathan by mastodon.

all of augscura's examples seemed so cheesy to me, the aggression feels so manufactured lol. "bro let's name our band MORBID ANGEL" "hell yeah bro"

 

[Augscura]

all of augscura's examples seemed so cheesy to me, the aggression feels so manufactured lol. "bro let's name our band MORBID ANGEL" "hell yeah bro"

That Morbid Angel song is taken from the best selling death metal record of all time, not that it means anything, just a fun fact

 

[Shareefruck]

Old school:





Modern:



Big difference being production, old school is very raw and punchy, modern is very clean and overproduced, drums lack that punchiness, the overall sound is very compressed and robotic and the musicianship has way more showmanship

I'm still listening to them, but first impression, while I agree that the modern one is a worse offender and has the least merit, I still get the same feeling I was talking about from the old-school ones as well. It doesn't feel organically raw and primitive to me, it feels like a band flexing their muscles and putting on a raw and primitive front to show off their masculinity or something. And I feel this way as early as Black Sabbath, so I don't think it's a new vs. old thing. Again, I find the nihilism of punk a lot more convincing in terms of how genuine/organic it feels to me.

Maybe there's some weird pablov's dog psychological bias going on with me or something. I don't know.

 

[Ouroboros]

That's how I would describe a lot of Jazz music. Probably including some of the stuff that you like, like Free Jazz. although I haven't listened to that much of it. Do you think that jazz can often be overly showy?

I feel the same way mostly. It all sounds very clinical to me - all very precise. The constant soloing over a harmony/chord progression just sort of fades off and becomes background music. Nothing grabs me.

It's not even debatable that the musicians in the jazz world are better than in metal. They are generally more trained in theory and composition and have much better chops and better ears. Anybody that plays an instrument can gather this almost instantaneously.

Most of the seminal metal albums were written and performed by kids with no training, no knowledge, and nothing remarkable in the way of playing chops. I can't change how it feels to somebody else, but I can objectively refute the notion of technical grandstanding and showboating. How can you showboat if you aren't skilled?

 

[Augscura]

Meh death metal is by no means accessible, very rarely does someone listen to it for the first time and enjoy it, metal in general is an acquired taste, death metal is a step beyond that, I can assure you though the purpose of the music is not to flaunt some masculinity card. That's more nu-metal and Pantera fans.

 

[Shareefruck]

Yeah, I don't deny any of that, and I didn't intend to accuse the musicians of really doing that. But I as a listener, I don't really care about the actual intentions of the musician, I just care about what feeling the music communicates to me.

But yeah, I keep trying metal and it just always feels off to me. I THINK I've kept an open mind to it for years now (as much as any other genre, anyways), but who knows.

 

[Ouroboros]

Again, I find the nihilism of punk a lot more convincing in terms of how genuine/organic it feels to me.

I'm not even quite sure what you mean by 'organic' in this context. Can you elaborate?

I'll explain a little bit about the ethos of metal as I see it - simply because I'm not sure you're grasping the point of it. It's not simply about being loud or abrasive or angry and it's not designed to be 'emotional' or 'relatable' or 'charming' or anything of that sort - that's generally outside of the scope. Nobody is ever going to hear it and form an immediate emotional bond with it - not likely possible. The perspective of metal has always been based on mythos/history/the metaphysical. That's why the subject matter it deals with is so esoteric; that's why it's about demons, angels, forces of nature, war, death and things of that nature instead of politics, society, emotions and what not. It's hyper-reality examined through an fantastical/surreal lens; it's about finding beauty in the darkness, order in chaos.

Metal is probably the one area that removes itself from the ennui that musicians in other areas - far more knowledgable, intelligent, comprehending musicians for the most part - are inevitably having to fight off. It is the only arena left where belief in the silliest of fantasies is still possible. It's an irony and cynicism free zone - that's refreshing to me. 'Cleverness' is antithetical to the cause.

If that's 'inorganic' then I guess I can't argue, but I find the dichotomy of a genre where the supposed juvenile belief in fantasy and in the spirit of ages long gone juxtaposes with the ferocity of savage music to be a thrilling one, and an experience that can't be replicated elsewhere. The spirit is almost akin to that of Romantic-era composers.

There. That's enough intellectualizing something that shouldn't be intellectualized in the first place. If you feel it you feel it, and if you don't you don't. If it hasn't hit you by now it never will.