Music: Unpopular Music Opinions

[Ouroboros]

Tolkien was a big influence for the second wave of black metal. Burzum, Summoning, and Gorgoroth are three that stand-out in that regard off the top of my head. Especially Summoning. There is a modular or interlocking quality to riffs and phrases that allows both free jazz, with its technical improvisation, and metal with its focus on themes and-or motifs to create a sort of narrative and ambient structure. The anti-religious sentiment in a lot of death, especially black metal, and even on the part of doom metal is like a focus on the symbol, concept, theme, and motif. In this there is also a sort of suspension of skepticism and disbelief about the supernatural and such things. The focus on concepts or motifs is also similar to free jazz and ambient music like Arktau Eos, which you posted on here some time ago. The album Mirrion is what I had in mind regarding the latter artist(s). 'Existential dread' is an apt phrase, in my opinion. There is a lot of coming back to the theme of individual death in death and black metal. This is an obvious sense in which the music is deeply metaphysically engaged. Like another poster said here, one thing that a lot lesser, newer bands may be lacking is that more personal, and perhaps original, inspiration. Even though, as you pointed out in the past, there is intentional composition in metal that is not in most of jazz, I suspect that even in metal a lot of the composition and-or music creation initially occurs or is written in an improvisational manner.

Are you familiar with 'Heavy Metal Be-Bop'? It was a series of interviews conducted by Hank Shteamer a few years ago focusing on the intersection between jazz and metal. The way you were trying to draw parallels between the two made me think it might be something you would be interested in.

As you might expect, a lot of the same bands and artists kept popping up in the discussions. John Zorn, Naked City, Painkiller, Last Exit, Mahavishnu Orchestra, Cecil Taylor and Tony Williams Lifetime on the jazz side and Gorguts, Meshuggah, Voivod, Slayer and Morbid Angel on the metal side - and interestingly enough Revenge (!!) were also mentioned multiple times.

They touch on the differences and similarities in technique, improvising vs. composing, how the scenes view one another, and a ton of other things. It's very interesting stuff - well, to me at least. The interviews with Craig Taborn, Weasel Walter, Andrew Hock, Mick Barr, and Damion Reid are particularly good.

 

[Know Your Enemy]

It's almost like you're making music into something ethical. Like, 'it is better for the artist or performer to behave in such-and-such a way and that makes the music better'.

That's upsetting to read

 

[Roo Returns]

Since I've been listening to them lately, time to talk about the band Extreme.

They were a great band who get unfairly labelled as the "More Than Words" guys. Their albums are quite progressive and funky. The newest one they put out in 2008 Saudades De Rock was a lot of fun and had nearly perfect pacing.

And moving on to Gary Cherone, Van Halen III was a good album. It was doomed to start from the beginning with **** poor marketing, the album cover of the dude with the cannonball which is Americana stock footage, and something I've noticed that anytime a big band has a high profile replacement member from another band, the public at least in the United States pretty much always writes it off, this goes back to Yes getting The Buggles, Navarro in RHCP, etc. Even successful times like when Warren Cuccurulo from Zappa/Missing Persons joined Duran Duran, the material is barely talked about ever and they did some very good stuff for about 3-4 albums.

EVH's playing on Ballot For The Bullet alone is marvelous.

Mr. Big suffered the same fate as Extreme. They're the "To Be With You" guys. Their first two albums are both pretty good. Sheehan did some really crazy stuff on bass.

 

[Smelling Salt]

Since I've been listening to them lately, time to talk about the band Extreme.

They were a great band who get unfairly labelled as the "More Than Words" guys. Their albums are quite progressive and funky. The newest one they put out in 2008 Saudades De Rock was a lot of fun and had nearly perfect pacing.

And moving on to Gary Cherone, Van Halen III was a good album. It was doomed to start from the beginning with **** poor marketing, the album cover of the dude with the cannonball which is Americana stock footage, and something I've noticed that anytime a big band has a high profile replacement member from another band, the public at least in the United States pretty much always writes it off, this goes back to Yes getting The Buggles, Navarro in RHCP, etc. Even successful times like when Warren Cuccurulo from Zappa/Missing Persons joined Duran Duran, the material is barely talked about ever and they did some very good stuff for about 3-4 albums.

EVH's playing on Ballot For The Bullet alone is marvelous.

Mr. Big suffered the same fate as Extreme. They're the "To Be With You" guys. Their first two albums are both pretty good. Sheehan did some really crazy stuff on bass.

Well this isn't unpopular with me because Extreme is my favourite band and Nuno is my fav guitar player and it's not close. Heard Nuno and Gary cover Queen's not often heard "Staying Power" a couple weeks ago? It's killer if you like Extreme/Queen:

[Yt]eBBkp4Bi3fI[/MEDIA]

Nuno also did a pretty great version of Muse's Hysteria a bit back:

[Yt]Bu9SzHMYB4A[/Yt]

And yeah Suadades was a nice return for them. Looking forward to their new stuff in 2018.

I try to get into VHIII but I just can't do it.

I still listen to Mr Big including their Kotzen years. Don't like the new album though.

 

[Hippasus]

Are you familiar with 'Heavy Metal Be-Bop'? It was a series of interviews conducted by Hank Shteamer a few years ago focusing on the intersection between jazz and metal. The way you were trying to draw parallels between the two made me think it might be something you would be interested in.

As you might expect, a lot of the same bands and artists kept popping up in the discussions. John Zorn, Naked City, Painkiller, Last Exit, Mahavishnu Orchestra, Cecil Taylor and Tony Williams Lifetime on the jazz side and Gorguts, Meshuggah, Voivod, Slayer and Morbid Angel on the metal side - and interestingly enough Revenge (!!) were also mentioned multiple times.

They touch on the differences and similarities in technique, improvising vs. composing, how the scenes view one another, and a ton of other things. It's very interesting stuff - well, to me at least. The interviews with Craig Taborn, Weasel Walter, Andrew Hock, Mick Barr, and Damion Reid are particularly good.

Sounds like a neat series, but no, I couldn't locate it. I only tried Youtube.

That's upsetting to read

A lot of people have that opinion--namely that drums etc. are just supposed to be there and be sort of be understated. As in, only work in service of the songs. But for music like free jazz and death metal, I admittedly have a bit of trouble understanding that perspective. I don't see the performances as grandstanding or anything when the music is naturally intense like it often is.

 

[Ouroboros]

Sounds like a neat series, but no, I couldn't locate it. I only tried Youtube.

You can check it out at this link if you're interested.

 

[Aladyyn]

Kate Bush is the most talented and brilliant artist of the 20th century. AINEC

 

[Hippasus]

I very much dislike fadeouts. Especially during the middle of an album. They just seem like lazy copouts and sort of mar the given album for me as they takes away from the immersion one gets.

You can check it out at this link if you're interested.

Thanks man, I'm checking it out. I got into an accident recently listening to Revenge. Go figure.

 

[BigMac1212]

Controversial Musical Opinions

I'm a country fan. I love the duo Brooks & Dunn. But I love the guy who sings lead for the songs Rock My World (Little Country Girl) & Lost and Found. (I don't know if it's Kix Brooks or Ronnie Dunn.)

Do you have opinions in the music genre that would be controversial?

 

[Spring in Fialta]

There's already two threads where this can go.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

Don't get the fascination with The Beatles. AT...ALL.

U2 is one of the most overrated bands of all time.

As much as I despise her, Pink is extremely talented.

As much as they represent Canadiana, The Tragically Hip is another group I have never understood the mass fascination with.

Justin Timberlake is one of the most talented artists of his era.

Pearl Jam and Creed songs could pass off as one another.

 

[Bee Sheriff]

Kate Bush is the most talented and brilliant artist of the 20th century. AINEC

This woman's work is her only good song

 

[Acadmus]

Don't get the fascination with The Beatles. AT...ALL.

ok, you're entitled to your opinion.

U2 is one of the most overrated bands of all time.

ok, you're entitled to your opinion, though I only agree post-Achtung, Baby

As much as I despise her, Pink is extremely talented.

ok, you're entitled to your opinion

As much as they represent Canadiana, The Tragically Hip is another group I have never understood the mass fascination with.

ok, you're entitled to your opinion, and from what I've heard I have to agree with it

Justin Timberlake is one of the most talented artists of his era.

ok, you're entitled to your opinion...probably right

Pearl Jam and Creed songs could pass off as one another.

NO NO NO NO NO!
Creed was a knock off of Live, they don't sound like Pearl Jam. Record companies around 2000 managed to find a few of these "clone" bands that sounded like other, early- to mid-90s bands for whatever reason while they pushed aside the originals (drive to get "younger" to appeal to millenials?). Live was one of the seeming victims, as Creed was a poor-man's version of them.

 

[Acadmus]

This woman's work is her only good song

I quite like Running Up That Hill, and Cloudbusting isn't so bad either. Her duet with Peter Gabriel on Don't Give Up is pretty good, too.

 

[Xelebes]

NO NO NO NO NO!
Creed was a knock off of Live, they don't sound like Pearl Jam. Record companies around 2000 managed to find a few of these "clone" bands that sounded like other, early- to mid-90s bands for whatever reason while they pushed aside the originals (drive to get "younger" to appeal to millenials?). Live was one of the seeming victims, as Creed was a poor-man's version of them.

Probably cheaper for the record labels or there are new record labels entering the market. For the former, recording can be costly with more established artists as they learn to want more out of their recordings. That can be incredibly expensive. On Nickelback's later albums, for example, they would blow more than a million dollars on getting the right kick sound. That's expensive for such a small detail.

 

[Skip Bayless]

One Direction is the greatest boyband of all time.