HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #87: 2024 Season Finale

[Deus ex machina]

I just like have conversations and I have strong opinions that I back up with context. Some can't handle it when they disagree.

The confusion here is some comprehend high traffic comments with obsession.



Monahan has rebounded and shut up his critics now that he is healthy but GM's won't over commit at this stage.

There will be lots of interest with Monahan this summer but the interest mostly comes with a value contract strategy.

Ideas and opinions have to take into account facts and real team needs though, not just wishful thinking.

While getting rid of Gallagher would be nice on the short term, Habs are more worried about long term cap implications.
Guys like Slaf, Guhle and probably Dach will need big pay raises soon.
Arpon Basu explains it well in his latest article.

Kings need to create cap space to add a number 1 goalie, not for Gallagher or Anderson.
Dennis Bernstein talked about it on TSN radio yesterday. He's pretty connected with the Kings.

Pat Verbeek has stated publicly that he's looking for a right handed top6 forward and a top4 right handed D. It's been reported on this tread already.
Kaiden Guhle is neither of that.

Sorry man, i'm cranky this morning...lol

 

[vokiel]

go after TB what do they have posters? they have no picks they would love the peg pick I bet

Tampa has nothing to trade, not even ice bunnies.

 

[Sorinth]

Gally is going to be Montreals Dustin Brown. Take the L and play him until his contract is up or he retires. Don’t see a possible trade for a loooong time, if even then.

I think he'd be tradeable to a rebuilding team that wants a "good" vet to surround their young guys. Problem is even in that situation he's a net negative trade wise so you probably have to send a pick.

 

[Drive425]

I think he'd be tradeable to a rebuilding team that wants a "good" vet to surround their young guys. Problem is even in that situation he's a net negative trade wise so you probably have to send a pick.

Much as I loved Gally's heart over the years, we're taking an L on this contract. Similarly, LAK will take the L on the Dubois trade/contract. Dubois is the antithesis of Gally and should be nowhere near the Habs, not even @ 50% retention.

 

[Kosseca]

I think he'd be tradeable to a rebuilding team that wants a "good" vet to surround their young guys. Problem is even in that situation he's a net negative trade wise so you probably have to send a pick.

A Gally that played like he did at the end of the season is ok to keep. Yes, he's overpaid, but he's a good leader, knows the market and can help younger player adjust.

 

[Whalers Fan]

You would have thought it was over last summer right?

 

[Miller Time]

I think it's deeper than this. The trend I noticed with Dubois is if he plays with talent, he does well. If he doesn't, he fades.

You don't pay passengers 8.5M on long term contracts.

In a cap system, a player's value is tied to the %of cap he takes up.

I agree with your assessment, to a degree (he's had quality linemates & deployment this year and played his way down the roster)... That he is a passenger rather than a play driver is exactly why he's a cap dump or buyout candidate with his current contract.

Remember when Ducharme put Caufield on the 3rd line? Caufield deserved this right? Take him away from talent and expect him to produce offensively. Not the exact same situation but you should get the point. I think a lot of fans have turned on him because he asked out from two teams now. What I see is someone who has wanted to play for the Habs since he asked out of Columbus and two teams interfered.

Caufield had a bad stretch of ~40 games in his rookie season, on a team that was spiralling to last place with a coach that was struggling in every aspect of team & player management. He's been a consistent performer outside of that stretch.

Not remotely comparable to PLDs season this year, nor the several instances in his career thus far that he's had performance and behavior issues. PLD has consistently underperformed with pocket stretches of high level play. At 26, the runway is short for him to change that.

He's not entirely innocent but there is a bandwagon of hate jumping on every negative thing they can say about him right now. Not surprised

Meh.
I don't think it's "a bandwagon of hate" driving the perception of him, it's his performance and behavior over several different seasons.

At this stage, I hope he gets bought out before he turns 26 on June 24th. Cost to the Kings is less and then signs with the Habs for $2M AAV.

Yes, on a 2-4M$, short term deal, PLD as a reclamation project is an easy yes... Just as I'd be willing to roll the dice even more in a trade where Gally goes the other way and the kings add sweetener.

I just don't think there's a need to excuse his poor performance nor much reason to expect he'll ever play up to the contract he's on.

 

[The Great Weal]

I'm curious why PLD is still being discussed here. He's probably the laziest player in the league and is a massive diva who quits when times get tough. What is the appeal here? If it's to get rid of Gallagher+Anderson in a trade, PLD has 4 more years than them and would be the highest paid player on our team. If the Kings buy him out, I'd do a 1 year show me deal but he's not someone you'd want to go longterm with. That Panthers run last year might have been a blessing in disguise since I'm pretty sure that pick would have been traded for him.

 

[Sterling Archer]

I think he'd be tradeable to a rebuilding team that wants a "good" vet to surround their young guys. Problem is even in that situation he's a net negative trade wise so you probably have to send a pick.

Good point, so let me clarify my post. Gally and any other player will always be tradable in that you can give to get rid of them. What I meant was that Habs won't trade assets to get rid of him, at least not now as he's still seen as someone who is a net positive to the team from an intangibles aspects, like Dustin Brown was. It's not worth it for the Habs to send a 1st to get rid of him when they can keep playing him and have his "leadership" around the youngsters and still be productive on the ice.

Some will say he's completely useless and zero value to the team, but that's not how the Habs see him. He still gives er' on the ice and can help mentor younger players. There's also the hope he can take on a different role within the team and be more of an agitator, defensive player while still chipping in some points. He won't score 30 but that doesn't make him useless, just really expensive. But Habs don't have cap issues now and likely won't for awhile, so trading Gally now isn't a pressing matter.

Anderson on the other hands... better bounce back next year.

 

[Sorinth]

Good point, so let me clarify my post. Gally and any other player will always be tradable in that you can give to get rid of them. What I meant was that Habs won't trade assets to get rid of him, at least not now as he's still seen as someone who is a net positive to the team from an intangibles aspects, like Dustin Brown was. It's not worth it for the Habs to send a 1st to get rid of him when they can keep playing him and have his "leadership" around the youngsters and still be productive on the ice.

Some will say he's completely useless and zero value to the team, but that's not how the Habs see him. He still gives er' on the ice and can help mentor younger players. There's also the hope he can take on a different role within the team and be more of an agitator, defensive player while still chipping in some points. He won't score 30 but that doesn't make him useless, just really expensive. But Habs don't have cap issues now and likely won't for awhile, so trading Gally now isn't a pressing matter.

Anderson on the other hands... better bounce back next year.

I don't think it would cost a 1st to trade him, and yes we probably aren't likely at a point where it makes sense to give assets just to get rid of him. But if for example the cost to trade him is something like Harris and a mid/late pick and the trade market for Harris alone is only a mid round pick then it might make sense to do that kind of trade even if it isn't a pressing matter just yet.

 

[Kosseca]

I'm curious why PLD is still being discussed here. He's probably the laziest player in the league and is a massive diva who quits when times get tough. What is the appeal here? If it's to get rid of Gallagher+Anderson in a trade, PLD has 4 more years than them and would be the highest paid player on our team. If the Kings buy him out, I'd do a 1 year show me deal but he's not someone you'd want to go longterm with. That Panthers run last year might have been a blessing in disguise since I'm pretty sure that pick would have been traded for him.

People have this romantic notion of what he can be: big, strong offensive top6 player, and some are ok with the idea of taking a risk that he may become that down the road.

Putting aside his contract, would it be a bad idea to see if MSL can redeem him? maybe. Problem is that you can't put aside his contract and the potential negative impact it can have if this "experiment" fails. So unless the Kings buyout his contract and he' ok to come here on a 2yrs 2M contract... it's a hard pass.

 

[Paddy17]

People have this romantic notion of what he can be: big, strong offensive top6 player, and some are ok with the idea of taking a risk that he may become that down the road.

Putting aside his contract, would it be a bad idea to see if MSL can redeem him? maybe. Problem is that you can't put aside his contract and the potential negative impact it can have if this "experiment" fails. So unless the Kings buyout his contract and he' ok to come here on a 2yrs 2M contract... it's a hard pass.

MSL is a good coach for young developing offensive players, but he's not a wizard. He can't do much if the player can't understand or doesn't want to.

See Josh Anderson.

 

[Runner77]

MSL is a good coach for young developing offensive players, but he's not a wizard. He can't do much if the player can't understand or doesn't want to.

See Josh Anderson.

See Drouin too.

 

[Captain Mountain]

MSL is a good coach for young developing offensive players, but he's not a wizard. He can't do much if the player can't understand or doesn't want to.

See Josh Anderson.

Its not just about development, its about fit and usage. Anderson is fast, big, can play physical and has a decent shot that he can get off.

He's also not a great passer, doesn't have great vision and doesn't always read play that well.

When playing in a tight system and asked to just drive to the net and be engaged he can be pretty effective. When playing a "concept" based system that requires reads of what opponents and teammates are doing, he's going to be far less effective. He also needs to play with players that can cover his weaknesses. Montreal right now can't do that at all.

Its somewhat similar with PLD. His effectiveness varies on coaching and teammates. I think there's a way he can be effective in Montreal with MSL, but the cost needs to make sense.

 

[Runner77]

Who gets traded?

At the moment, without a transaction, the Habs have 11 defensemen who could play in the NHL with the Habs next season.

Mike Matheson, David Savard, Kaiden Guhle, Arber Xhekaj, Jordan Harris, Johnathan Kovacevic, Justin Barron, Jayden Struble, Lane Hutson, Logan Mailloux and David Reinbacher represent these 11 defensemen.

Only seven or eight will remain in the NHL, and it’s important to note that Jordan Harris, Justin Barron and Johnathan Kovacevic will all be eligible for waivers next season.

Adam Engstrom will be in the NHL for the long haul, says former Habs defenseman

The most obvious observation that can be made about the current situation with the Montreal Canadiens is that there are clearly too many defensemen who could be playing in the NHL next season.

www.yardbarker.com

Just cause some D can play in the NHL doesn’t mean they will to start next season. We know Hughes will do what it takes not to expose young, NHL-ready or NHL-experienced assets to waivers.

Plus, the above assessment about Reinbacher, Mailloux and Hutson is premature — a lot may depend on how well they do at pre-season camp.

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

Anderson for Parayko

throw in Barron and some picks

Hutson-Parayko money pairing

 

[nhlfan9191]

MSL is a good coach for young developing offensive players, but he's not a wizard. He can't do much if the player can't understand or doesn't want to.

See Josh Anderson.

What you see is what you get with Dubois. He’s clashed with 4 different NHL head coaches. MSL has this reputation of being a calm players coach because he’s good at working with the kids, but ask Xhekaj, he isn’t going to put up with any bulls*** either.

 

[Hoochi Papa]

Are there any dead weight veteran contracts Montréal could add in exchange for a 1st round pick?

 

[Saundies]

Good point, so let me clarify my post. Gally and any other player will always be tradable in that you can give to get rid of them. What I meant was that Habs won't trade assets to get rid of him, at least not now as he's still seen as someone who is a net positive to the team from an intangibles aspects, like Dustin Brown was. It's not worth it for the Habs to send a 1st to get rid of him when they can keep playing him and have his "leadership" around the youngsters and still be productive on the ice.

Some will say he's completely useless and zero value to the team, but that's not how the Habs see him. He still gives er' on the ice and can help mentor younger players. There's also the hope he can take on a different role within the team and be more of an agitator, defensive player while still chipping in some points. He won't score 30 but that doesn't make him useless, just really expensive. But Habs don't have cap issues now and likely won't for awhile, so trading Gally now isn't a pressing matter.

Anderson on the other hands... better bounce back next year.

This is a difficult concept for fans to grasp, I find. Posters used to say the same things when we were terrible and Price wasn't playing well. "BUT HIS CONTRACT!! GET RID OF HIM! TOO MUCH MONEY" Okay... but how is that hindering us in any way RIGHT NOW? We are terrible whether Price makes 10.5 or 750K. It doesn't matter.

Big contracts and overpaid players become a problem when you're trying to contend or are starting to compete and you can't make the moves you want to make to get you to the next step, not when you finished 27th in a 32 team league and haven't even started competing yet. It would be nice if all players performed to their contracts on the team, but giving other teams assets to take them when they are not even detrimental yet is not a good move.

Gallagher and Anderson are overpaid and they don't play to their contracts. Fair. But we are not in a hurry to attach high value drafts picks to get rid of them just yet. It's our D that are jammed, not our forwards (and thankfully, we have no boat anchor contracts back there).

 

[Spring in Fialta]

Its not just about development, its about fit and usage. Anderson is fast, big, can play physical and has a decent shot that he can get off.

He's also not a great passer, doesn't have great vision and doesn't always read play that well.

When playing in a tight system and asked to just drive to the net and be engaged he can be pretty effective. When playing a "concept" based system that requires reads of what opponents and teammates are doing, he's going to be far less effective. He also needs to play with players that can cover his weaknesses. Montreal right now can't do that at all.

Its somewhat similar with PLD. His effectiveness varies on coaching and teammates. I think there's a way he can be effective in Montreal with MSL, but the cost needs to make sense.

I don't think there is any chance that the Canadiens or another team actually trade for him, even if LA retains. It's way too many years. It's a buyout or LA for Dubois and that's a hell of a problem to have because if they can actually swing a 14-year buyout the cost is actually attractive if you're unsure he can bounce back. Rough decision.

What you see is what you get with Dubois. He’s clashed with 4 different NHL head coaches. MSL has this reputation of being a calm players coach because he’s good at working with the kids, but ask Xhekaj, he isn’t going to put up with any bulls*** either.

I believe PLD and St.Louis worked together in Columbus and have a great relationship. Pretty sure it's been reported in the past.

 

[Saundies]

I don't think there is any chance that the Canadiens or another team actually trade for him, even if LA retains. It's way too many years. It's a buyout or LA for Dubois and that's a hell of a problem to have because if they can actually swing a 14-year buyout the cost is actually attractive if you're unsure he can bounce back. Rough decision.



I believe PLD and St.Louis worked together in Columbus and have a great relationship. Pretty sure it's been reported in the past.

PLD just seems like the kind of guy you'd sit down and try to be real with about his play, and then he'd resent you for it rather than attempt to change. This is the 4th team he's played like this for. The sample size has exceeded "too small to determine" and has become a pattern.

For that much money and the fact that he made a huge deal about coming here and then changed his tune to get more money with LA? Uh nah. Good luck with that, kid.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

PLD just seems like the kind of guy you'd sit down and try to be real with about his play, and then he'd resent you for it rather than attempt to change. This is the 4th team he's played like this for. The sample size has exceeded "too small to determine" and has become a pattern.

For that much money and the fact that he made a huge deal about coming here and then changed his tune to get more money with LA? Uh nah. Good luck with that, kid.

He didn't change his tune, Winnipeg told him he had to open up if he wanted a long-term deal and LA outbid the Habs. He said it himself after the trade. He was into the idea of playing for Montreal but 'LA wanted me more'. If Winnipeg had accepted our deal, he'd be a Hab and this board would be on fire if he had that season here.

Honestly, if he gets bought out, I don't think it's a good idea even on a short-term deal. The discourse will be insane.

 

[Sterling Archer]

I don't think it would cost a 1st to trade him, and yes we probably aren't likely at a point where it makes sense to give assets just to get rid of him. But if for example the cost to trade him is something like Harris and a mid/late pick and the trade market for Harris alone is only a mid round pick then it might make sense to do that kind of trade even if it isn't a pressing matter just yet.

I'm not sure it makes sense even at that. Habs don't need the cap and Gally isn't seen as a hinderance by the team, so why use any trade capital to move him at all?

 

[BoneHutson]

The only talks that should be happening on this thread concerning the Habs and Kings shouldnt be about trading for PLD, but about OS Byfield.

 

[Deebs]

The only talks that should be happening on this thread concerning the Habs and Kings shouldnt be about trading for PLD, but about OS Byfield.

Love the offersheets!!!!