Proposal: Tor moves

[Ashep]

Tor - Van

To Toronto:
Bo Horvat
Jake Virtanen

To Vancouver:
Mitch Marner
2020 2nd

Tor - Arz (Cap and LTIR move for the leafs)

To Toronto:
Christian Fischer
Marion Hossa

To Arizona:
Andreas Johnnson

To Toronto:
Matt Dumba

To Minnesota:
Timothy Liljegren
Jeremy Bracco
2020 1st

Re-sign
Mikheyev
Virtanen
Fischer
Robertson
Rodrigues
Dermott

Sign
Petro

Hyman (2.25) - Matthews (11.634) - Virtanen (2.5)
Mikheyev (1.5) - Tavares (11) - Nylander (6.963)
Fischer (1.5) - Horvat (5.5) - Robertson (.821)
Rodrigues (2) - Spezza (.750) - Engvall (1.25)

Rielly (5.5) - Petro (8.5)
Muzzin (5.625) - Dumba (6)
Dermott (2.5) - Holl (2)

Anderson (5)
Campbell (1.65)

LTIR
Hossa (5.275)

Leafs would meet the cap and have approx. 2.3 mil in LTIR to play with.

Click to read more...

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

I don't like any of the deals here for the leafs. Dumba isn't what we need either.

 

[Mickey Marner]

The LTIR isn't a magical cap space fairy.

 

[Alklha]

Tor - Van

To Toronto:
Bo Horvat
Jake Virtanen

To Vancouver:
Mitch Marner
2020 2nd

Tor - Arz (Cap and LTIR move for the leafs)

To Toronto:
Christian Fischer
Marion Hossa

To Arizona:
Andreas Johnnson

To Toronto:
Matt Dumba

To Minnesota:
Timothy Liljegren
Jeremy Bracco
2020 1st

Re-sign
Mikheyev
Virtanen
Fischer
Robertson
Rodrigues
Dermott

Sign
Petro

Hyman (2.25) - Matthews (11.634) - Virtanen (2.5)
Mikheyev (1.5) - Tavares (11) - Nylander (6.963)
Fischer (1.5) - Horvat (5.5) - Robertson (.821)
Rodrigues (2) - Spezza (.750) - Engvall (1.25)

Rielly (5.5) - Petro (8.5)
Muzzin (5.625) - Dumba (6)
Dermott (2.5) - Holl (2)

Anderson (5)
Campbell (1.65)

LTIR
Hossa (5.275)

Leafs would meet the cap and have approx. 2.3 mil in LTIR to play with.

Ignoring the trades... that roster is over the cap. LTIR does not allow you to exceed the cap with your 23 man active roster.

 

[Easternbear]

Tor - Van

To Toronto:
Bo Horvat
Jake Virtanen

To Vancouver:
Mitch Marner
2020 2nd

Tor - Arz (Cap and LTIR move for the leafs)

To Toronto:
Christian Fischer
Marion Hossa

To Arizona:
Andreas Johnnson

To Toronto:
Matt Dumba

To Minnesota:
Timothy Liljegren
Jeremy Bracco
2020 1st

Re-sign
Mikheyev
Virtanen
Fischer
Robertson
Rodrigues
Dermott

Sign
Petro

Hyman (2.25) - Matthews (11.634) - Virtanen (2.5)
Mikheyev (1.5) - Tavares (11) - Nylander (6.963)
Fischer (1.5) - Horvat (5.5) - Robertson (.821)
Rodrigues (2) - Spezza (.750) - Engvall (1.25)

Rielly (5.5) - Petro (8.5)
Muzzin (5.625) - Dumba (6)
Dermott (2.5) - Holl (2)

Anderson (5)
Campbell (1.65)

LTIR
Hossa (5.275)

Leafs would meet the cap and have approx. 2.3 mil in LTIR to play with.

 

[Easternbear]

Why in God's name would Vancouver do this?? Unrealistic

 

[Ashep]

Ignoring the trades... that roster is over the cap. LTIR does not allow you to exceed the cap with your 23 man active roster.

When a player is placed on LTIR, they are still on the team's payroll and their cap hit continues to count as it always did. However, LTIR allows a team to exceed the cap limit

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

Why in God's name would Vancouver do this?? Unrealistic

Toronto wouldn't do it either. Horvat is an excellent player but marner is just much better. Also the leafs would have him at 3c and that is a huge waste.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Ok obviously Vancouver declines, they have cap issues too. Also thats not how LTIR works at all, it doesnt give you cap space.

 

[the Chad Kilger]

I cant see many vancouver fans being pleased with that swap

 

[Ashep]

Ok obviously Vancouver declines, they have cap issues too. Also thats not how LTIR works at all, it doesnt give you cap space.

Correct it doesn't give you cap space. It allows a team to spend over the cap as a LTIR pool, which the leafs did last season by having Horton, clarkson, Johnson, and mikheyev on LTIR. That is why the leafs spent $93 million on roster players last year

 

[ToDavid]

No to Vancouver trade (Canucks also decline, they're not trading their captain and taking on Marner's contract).

No to Arizona. I don't really understand this, we get the worse player and take on a big LTIR contract. You seem to be under the impression that LTIR creates new cap space, which is not true.

I don't think Dumba is the best fit but I would do that trade. Minnesota probably doesn't, they're not trying to rebuild.

 

[Alklha]

When a player is placed on LTIR, they are still on the team's payroll and their cap hit continues to count as it always did. However, LTIR allows a team to exceed the cap limit

Yes, that's correct.

The part that you aren't understanding is that "their cap hit continues to count".

Roughly speaking, the a team with a $5.275m player on LTIR can exceed the cap by $5.275m... including that players cap hit. That roster is at almost $90m including Hossa, so it's ~$3m over the cap.

The active roster, excluding the players on LTIR, can't magically exceed $81.5m.

 

[TGWL]

I don't get it. Leafs have Matthews and Tavares locked up for years down the middle. Why would they trade a 1st line winger for more center depth and an inconsistent winger? Being able to toss out Horvat against other teams top lines instead of Matthews and Tavares would be nice, but it's not their biggest team. This trade seems contingent on the trades below/signings working out, but you don't need Matthews/Tavares/Horvat down the middle.

 

[ToDavid]

Correct it doesn't give you cap space. It allows a team to spend over the cap as a LTIR pool, which the leafs did last season by having Horton, clarkson, Johnson, and mikheyev on LTIR. That is why the leafs spent $93 million on roster players last year

It allows you to be over the cap including the LTIR players. Your 23 man active roster cannot be over the cap limit.

 

[Djp]

Tor - Van

To Toronto:
Bo Horvat
Jake Virtanen

To Vancouver:
Mitch Marner
2020 2nd

Tor - Arz (Cap and LTIR move for the leafs)

To Toronto:
Christian Fischer
Marion Hossa

To Arizona:
Andreas Johnnson

To Toronto:
Matt Dumba

To Minnesota:
Timothy Liljegren
Jeremy Bracco
2020 1st

Re-sign
Mikheyev
Virtanen
Fischer
Robertson
Rodrigues
Dermott

Sign
Petro

Hyman (2.25) - Matthews (11.634) - Virtanen (2.5)
Mikheyev (1.5) - Tavares (11) - Nylander (6.963)
Fischer (1.5) - Horvat (5.5) - Robertson (.821)
Rodrigues (2) - Spezza (.750) - Engvall (1.25)

Rielly (5.5) - Petro (8.5)
Muzzin (5.625) - Dumba (6)
Dermott (2.5) - Holl (2)

Anderson (5)
Campbell (1.65)

LTIR
Hossa (5.275)

Leafs would meet the cap and have approx. 2.3 mil in LTIR to play with.

LLTIR does not work how you think....

Hossa counts on roster day one then he goes on LTIE then you use the extra space to call up players against that space.

Toronto has how many players they can call up?

Lets also not forget this is not a 23 man but a 20 man roster.

On the trades---Vancouver doesnt do that. They arent trading a center for a winger.

Minnesota is looking for a clear top 6 F in a trade for Dumnba---not spare parts.

 

[Troy]

All teams decline easily. That pkg alone is not even close to Dumbas value. Bracco has no value at all.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Tor - Van

To Toronto:
Bo Horvat
Jake Virtanen

To Vancouver:
Mitch Marner
2020 2nd

Tor - Arz (Cap and LTIR move for the leafs)

To Toronto:
Christian Fischer
Marion Hossa

To Arizona:
Andreas Johnnson

To Toronto:
Matt Dumba

To Minnesota:
Timothy Liljegren
Jeremy Bracco
2020 1st

Re-sign
Mikheyev
Virtanen
Fischer
Robertson
Rodrigues
Dermott

Sign
Petro

Hyman (2.25) - Matthews (11.634) - Virtanen (2.5)
Mikheyev (1.5) - Tavares (11) - Nylander (6.963)
Fischer (1.5) - Horvat (5.5) - Robertson (.821)
Rodrigues (2) - Spezza (.750) - Engvall (1.25)

Rielly (5.5) - Petro (8.5)
Muzzin (5.625) - Dumba (6)
Dermott (2.5) - Holl (2)

Anderson (5)
Campbell (1.65)

LTIR
Hossa (5.275)

Leafs would meet the cap and have approx. 2.3 mil in LTIR to play with.

Vancouver can't afford Marner at nearly $11 mil per They're trying to resign Markstrom, Tanev and Toffoli doesn't work cap wise for them. And that in noway gets you Matt Dumba Bill Guerin wants a top 6 C and you provide him with none.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Correct it doesn't give you cap space. It allows a team to spend over the cap as a LTIR pool, which the leafs did last season by having Horton, clarkson, Johnson, and mikheyev on LTIR. That is why the leafs spent $93 million on roster players last year

Semi correct, it allows you to spend over the cap but the LTIR contracts still count 100% against the cap. Again, they dont give you free cap space. If you completely removed Horton and Clarkson from Toronto's roster last year and the rest of the team was fully healthy they would be able to run a 21 man roster and still be cap compliant.

Arizona has no reason to trade Hossa anyways. Hes owed only 1M this year and 80% of that is paid by insurance.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Yes, that's correct.

The part that you aren't understanding is that "their cap hit continues to count".

Roughly speaking, the a team with a $5.275m player on LTIR can exceed the cap by $5.275m... including that players cap hit. That roster is at almost $90m including Hossa, so it's ~$3m over the cap.

The active roster, excluding the players on LTIR, can't magically exceed $81.5m.

To further expand on this, you can only exceed the cap by that full 5.275M if you are at exactly the cap ceiling after he is palved on LTIR. If you cap hit excluding the the LTIR player (Hossa in this example) is say 80M then you can only exceed the cap by 3.775M. You also can nolonger accrue cap space throughout the year. Purposely using LTIR is not advantageous at all and is actually a hindrance. The only reason Dubas did it last year was to avoid an offersheet if Marner negotiations had gone into the regular season

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

A Bracco sighting!

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Whenever you see a thread called toronto moves or trades


You know it’s gunna be good

 

[glenbuis]

Neutral fan here but the Marner I seen in this year’s playoffs was not way better than the beast that was Horvat

 

[Lupuls Grit]

Leaving aside cap complications, Canucks won't trade Horvat for Marner. Marner's a great player but in that scenario, the Canucks are really short on centres. More importantly, the Canucks are saving Horvat to trade to Buffalo for Eichel...

 

[Fatass]

Love Marner, but want to see him on Bo’s wing, so got to keep Bo and get MM. Boeser and Jake, and Demko for MM would make me a happy Canuck’s fan.