Top 5 year by year in the '60s

[Big Phil]

Yep, without batting an eye. Hull didn't cease being a top notch player after 1969. Was still scoring 50 in the NHL & was outstanding in the 71 Stanley cup playoffs. He had a 77 goal season in the WHA. At age 37, he was the top goal scorer for team Canada in the 76 Canada cup. Espo also played on that team & if I remember correctly, Espo saw less & less ice time as the tournament went on (think he mentions it in his book).

I agree with most of the rest of what you are saying but I've always felt the WHA was a floaters league. But it is true Hull did have a good Canada Cup, better than Esposito, but I would have prefered to see what he could have done after '72 and throughout the '70s. I reckon it would have been even better than Mikita in the '70s but it is just so hard to judge because the WHA was not a top notch league with the best players in the world.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on the early '70s though. Espo just racked up too much dominance in that era. I mean 4 straight Art Ross Trophies, and a wealth of scoring records broken was amazing. No doubt Hull was a top notch player still in '72 but I feel the way their careers went in that decade was Hull continually maintained a high level of play (although it went down a bit in the '70s) while Espo soared to higher heights in the decade but came down to earth a bit faster.

I still have a hard time seeing the reasoning for Hull over Espo though at certain times. '69 you have made your point and that is a bit closer than other years but what about Espo's two greatest seasons ever? '71 and '72.

In '71 he had 76-76-152. In '72 it was 66-67-133. Hull was 44-52-96 and 50-43-93. Hey you dont need to tell me that Hull was still an elite talent at that time but how is it you justify putting Hull ahead of him in those years? Numbers wise Espo blows Hull out of the water. Leadership was pretty much the same, Espo won a Cup in '72 and led the playoffs in scoring while Hull was 2nd in playoff scoring in '71. Then there's the Summit Series which Espo played unbelievable in. I just cant see it, not by that time.

 

[Al Bundy*]

Phil,

care to contribute to my 'Worst goalies of the 90s' thread?

 

[pappyline]

I agree with most of the rest of what you are saying but I've always felt the WHA was a floaters league. But it is true Hull did have a good Canada Cup, better than Esposito, but I would have prefered to see what he could have done after '72 and throughout the '70s. I reckon it would have been even better than Mikita in the '70s but it is just so hard to judge because the WHA was not a top notch league with the best players in the world.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on the early '70s though. Espo just racked up too much dominance in that era. I mean 4 straight Art Ross Trophies, and a wealth of scoring records broken was amazing. No doubt Hull was a top notch player still in '72 but I feel the way their careers went in that decade was Hull continually maintained a high level of play (although it went down a bit in the '70s) while Espo soared to higher heights in the decade but came down to earth a bit faster.

I still have a hard time seeing the reasoning for Hull over Espo though at certain times. '69 you have made your point and that is a bit closer than other years but what about Espo's two greatest seasons ever? '71 and '72.

In '71 he had 76-76-152. In '72 it was 66-67-133. Hull was 44-52-96 and 50-43-93. Hey you dont need to tell me that Hull was still an elite talent at that time but how is it you justify putting Hull ahead of him in those years? Numbers wise Espo blows Hull out of the water. Leadership was pretty much the same, Espo won a Cup in '72 and led the playoffs in scoring while Hull was 2nd in playoff scoring in '71. Then there's the Summit Series which Espo played unbelievable in. I just cant see it, not by that time.

Don't want to go on & on with this. We were discussing one year--1969 & you keep bringing in all this other stuff. You always seem to have this need to have the last word.

The WHA was no more a Floaters League than the watered down NHL at the time. Guys like Blaine Stoughton & Mike Rodgers put up better totals in the NHL than they did in the WHA. But that's another topic.

And I stand by my statement that Hull was always the superior player to Espo. My eyes tell me that. It is not always about numbers and team cup wins. If you can't see it that's fine. We are all entitled to our opinion. We could debate this until the cows come home but what is the point.

BTW, do you use the "Big Phil" username because you are an Espo fan? just curious.

 

[Big Phil]

Don't want to go on & on with this. We were discussing one year--1969 & you keep bringing in all this other stuff. You always seem to have this need to have the last word.

The WHA was no more a Floaters League than the watered down NHL at the time. Guys like Blaine Stoughton & Mike Rodgers put up better totals in the NHL than they did in the WHA. But that's another topic.

And I stand by my statement that Hull was always the superior player to Espo. My eyes tell me that. It is not always about numbers and team cup wins. If you can't see it that's fine. We are all entitled to our opinion. We could debate this until the cows come home but what is the point.

BTW, do you use the "Big Phil" username because you are an Espo fan? just curious.

No Pappy, I never thought of my nickname in reference to Espo. I'm a fan of him just like Hull, no more, no less. I'm just 6'2" 250lbs. so that'll explain the nickname.

We did trail off a bit from the original idea of the thread but that is because I got intrigued about your thoughts on comparing Hull/Espo in the '70s even. I'm surprised though since both of us were around when the WHA was here that we have different viewpoints on it though, oh well.

You know, this got me thinking there should be a poll on this board on who was a better player from '69-72 Hull or Espo. I know we are both stuck on our opinions but it would be interesting to see which one of us is in the minority, I mean that literally since the History board would have the most intelligent of all the posters. I might try that, perhaps even just taking Hull's last season before the WHA in '72

 

[pappyline]

No Pappy, I never thought of my nickname in reference to Espo. I'm a fan of him just like Hull, no more, no less. I'm just 6'2" 250lbs. so that'll explain the nickname.

I am going to be very nice to you from now on

 

[Big Phil]

I am going to be very nice to you from now on

Relax, most of that is waterweight, lol

 

[Axxellien]

1959=60: #1= Bronco Horvath, #2=Bobby Hull, #3=Don Mckenney, #4=Glenn Hall, #5=Vic Stasiuk.....

 

[sidewayzLEAFS]

just wondering cause i dont see many goalies(hall) in these lists and very few d-men(orr, pilote,)...howe and hull are deserve to be in almost every year and orr deserves the last 2 years..whoever, a 70's list would be awesome