The young players and growing pains

[Hunting Bow*]

While watching game after game of just horrible passing it has donned on me as to why? We have such a big influx of young players this year, probably more than in a VERY long time. Here's what I see. These guys are still playing AHL hockey in their minds. In other words things you can get away with in the AHL just get taken advantage of in the NHL.

It's been a lot fun watcing the Larkins and so on, but this at times looks like a mite team vs peewee team.

Click to read more...

 

[Eggberto]

So. Apart from Larkin, Pulks and the couple games we saw AA who makes up this sudden influx of young talent? Maybe I'm missing someone.

I don't disagree with your statement that our passing has been bad and at times atrocious, but I also think this 'influx of young talent' so they're playing AHL hockey hypothesis is off base.

 

[Hunting Bow*]

So. Apart from Larkin, Pulks and the couple games we saw AA who makes up this sudden influx of young talent? Maybe I'm missing someone.

I don't disagree with your statement that our passing has been bad and at times atrocious, but I also think this 'influx of young talent' so they're playing AHL hockey hypothesis is off base.

Marchenko
Sheahan (still young)

With
Larkin
Pulkkinen
Athanasiou

5 out of 22??? 22%.

It's just when several are out there it happens.

 

[Eggberto]

Marchenko
Sheahan (still young)

With
Larkin
Pulkkinen
Athanasiou

5 out of 22??? 22%.

It's just when several are out there it happens.

I forgot about Marchenko.

I do not count Sheahan. Sure he's kind of young but he has well over a full season of experience.

So even if we count Larkin who is the least of the problems with this team what are the other 18 guys doing and why are they ineffective at passing? Surely guys like Erroricson, Kindl, Kronwall, and DeKeyser don't have their minds "stuck in the AHL".

Also in 13/14 we saw a similar influx of 'young talent' in sheahan, tatar, nyquist, and jurco all seeing relatively significant time in the big leagues. I don't think that an influx of young talent is necessarily the problem with the Wings passing game as the entire roster seems to struggle passing at the moment.

 

[WesNichols14]

Ferraro for a few games as well.

Smith and Kindl.... :p either way between the 4 or so players, that's basically one player per line, and that's all it takes to destroy possession.
I love watching larkin and 80% of the time he makes the right plays, but I have seen several times that he has messed up and the puck has went the other way. Give all these kids 40 more games to better adjust and we could be playing our best hockey around playoff time.

 

[Hunting Bow*]

Ferraro for a few games as well.

Smith and Kindl.... :p either way between the 4 or so players, that's basically one player per line, and that's all it takes to destroy possession.
I love watching larkin and 80% of the time he makes the right plays, but I have seen several times that he has messed up and the puck has went the other way. Give all these kids 40 more games to better adjust and we could be playing our best hockey around playoff time.

I 100% agree with you. Hence the title of the thread. I just hope enough points can be garnered to be available for the playoffs when they are playing their best.

 

[WesNichols14]

Also in 13/14 we saw a similar influx of 'young talent' in sheahan, tatar, nyquist, and jurco all seeing relatively significant time in the big leagues. I don't think that an influx of young talent is necessarily the problem with the Wings passing game as the entire roster seems to struggle passing at the moment.

Well the majority of that influx was under the kenny Holland over ripe style management.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

No. This is ridiculous. It has been veterans making mistakes at the same or greater clips than the young kids.

This is trying hard to find something to complain about. The team isn't playing well. It's because they're not playing well. Not some nonsense about kids not knowing they're in the NHL

 

[Hunting Bow*]

No. This is ridiculous. It has been veterans making mistakes at the same or greater clips than the young kids.

This is trying hard to find something to complain about. The team isn't playing well. It's because they're not playing well. Not some nonsense about kids not knowing they're in the NHL

LMAO

It's not about knowing if they're in NHL or not! It's about still being ripe and getting taken advantage of.

 

[Eggberto]

Well the majority of that influx was under the kenny Holland over ripe style management.

Last I saw Lenny Holland is still the GM so... Those same principles still apply, and not only that given the fact the Pulks won the AHL goal socring race despite only playing half the seasom there counts as overripe. Marchenko has been far from our worst defenseman and people have wamted either him or Ouelette in the NHL for the past couple seasons.

AA hasn't been our worst player and his like 4 games in the NHL are obviously an adjustment period. So. Yeah.

 

[Eggberto]

LMAO

It's not about knowing if they're in NHL or not! It's about still being ripe and getting taken advantage of.

One can easily argue Marchenko and Pulks are "overripe". Larkin, despite making a few mistakes here and there, has consistently been one of our top 5 players to the point where he is in the Calder discussion in an absolutrly stacked year.

If anything is causing the Wings poor play I'd attribute it to coaching before 'too many rookies' every time.

 

[Actual Thought*]

The passing problems are from a lack of structure and confidence in the system. Too much thinking and too much hesitation. Players aren't where they are supposed to be and passing lanes are being opened up. The issue is team wide which points to system and practice methods. All of these players have been much better in the past.

 

[Bench]

I think if you look at the roster objectively, pound for pound, it's a middle of the road team. It's a playoff team with Datsyuk and Zetterberg, and maybe more if the likes of Tatar and Nyquist emerge as consistent scoring threats. But since the younger players outside of Larkin are not rising to the demands of being cornerstone players, we have an average roster achieving predictably average results.

This doesn't even dive into the blueline which has yet to establish itself as an offensive threat, despite the efforts to engage the likes of Kindl and Smith into the play.

People will blame new coaches for the lack of scoring, but scoring woes have plagued this team for stretches for years and it's why many of us have called for adding a top 6 scorer to the roster to help Franzen, rather than replace him. To help take the load off the aging Z and D.

I'd like them to be playing better, but at the same time, I'm not surprised. I can't help but feel like people who have watched this team a couple hundred times over the last few years have seen this coming a mile away.

 

[Actual Thought*]

I think if you look at the roster objectively, pound for pound, it's a middle of the road team. It's a playoff team with Datsyuk and Zetterberg, and maybe more if the likes of Tatar and Nyquist emerge as consistent scoring threats. But since the younger players outside of Larkin are not rising to the demands of being cornerstone players, we have an average roster achieving predictably average results.

This doesn't even dive into the blueline which has yet to establish itself as an offensive threat, despite the efforts to engage the likes of Kindl and Smith into the play.

People will blame new coaches for the lack of scoring, but scoring woes have plagued this team for stretches for years and it's why many of us have called for adding a top 6 scorer to the roster to help Franzen, rather than replace him. To help take the load off the aging Z and D.

I'd like them to be playing better, but at the same time, I'm not surprised. I can't help but feel like people who have watched this team a couple hundred times over the last few years have seen this coming a mile away.

I don't agree at all that they are a middle of the road team but let's just say for a second that you are right. That means that they are underachieving in a massive way. They are playing like a gutter team. They are among the worst in the league in almost every area. Clearly that isn't a personnel issue. It isn't a youth issue.

It's funny how many people were saying how awesome our forward depth was before the season started and after the first 3 games. They are still very strong up front and at least average on the blueline if not slightly above. Last year people were saying over and over that they needed a RHPMD. Now they have one and suddenly they are worse so now all the players suck? Not quite. This team should be in the top 5 in the league.

 

[Bench]

This team should be in the top 5 in the league.

I wish I shared your optimism. I've watched too many games with the same players to suddenly think they'll hit another gear consistently. Flashes here and there, but we haven't seen sustained scoring from these guys in some time.

The Wings came into the season with a lot of "ifs" that would need to be met if they were going to be a top team. Underwhelming play from Sheahan, Tatar, and missing/rusty Datsyuk is a significant hit, and all of those players needed to have great seasons for this roster to be anywhere near top 5. Furthermore, DeKeyser isn't a difference maker, no matter how much we wanted him to be. And Kronwall, like our other two top players, gets older every year. Lack of scoring from defenders is still an issue - one that has been ongoing for years and years.

You can say this is all new to fit your agenda, but I'm seeing a lot of the same compounded with my favorite players getting older.

 

[Pavels Dog]

While watching game after game of just horrible passing it has donned on me as to why? We have such a big influx of young players this year, probably more than in a VERY long time. Here's what I see. These guys are still playing AHL hockey in their minds. In other words things you can get away with in the AHL just get taken advantage of in the NHL.

It's been a lot fun watcing the Larkins and so on, but this at times looks like a mite team vs peewee team.

I don't really agree. Larkin is one of few players on this team consistently making sharp passes, controlling the puck well, and making smart decisions. Marchenko is looking more poised than Kronwall and Dekeyser, who are both struggling bad. Pulkkinen hasn't been great but he's almost been better than Tatar. Athanasiou looked very good despite limited minutes.

Not to mention Z hasn't been too hot lately and Pav is still not quite up to speed.

The kids are the least of this team's problems.

 

[Actual Thought*]

I wish I shared your optimism. I've watched too many games with the same players to suddenly think they'll hit another gear consistently. Flashes here and there, but we haven't seen sustained scoring from these guys in some time.

The Wings came into the season with a lot of "ifs" that would need to be met if they were going to be a top team. Underwhelming play from Sheahan, Tatar, and missing/rusty Datsyuk is a significant hit, and all of those players needed to have great seasons for this roster to be anywhere near top 5. Furthermore, DeKeyser isn't a difference maker, no matter how much we wanted him to be. And Kronwall, like our other two top players, gets older every year. Lack of scoring from defenders is still an issue - one that has been ongoing for years and years.

You can say this is all new to fit your agenda, but I'm seeing a lot of the same compounded with my favorite players getting older.

First off "Agenda" is a laughable word to use. This is a discussion board not a congressional committee.
Secondly in September you said you "wouldn't count them out" as contenders. Now you are saying you knew they would suck all along.
The team is underachieving as a team because they are poorly coached. It couldn't be more blatantly obvious. The players didn't suck all along. They aren't suddenly all washed up. The defence isn't the worst in the NHL and it certainly isn't a lack of scoring from the D or the influx of youth. That's all nonsense. They don't score from anywhere. They are poorly coached. It is just that simple. It is crystal clear. It is undeniable. There is no other logical, reasonable conclusion that could be reached.

 

[SoupNazi]

First off "Agenda" is a laughable word to use. This is a discussion board not a congressional committee.
Secondly in September you said you "wouldn't count them out" as contenders. Now you are saying you knew they would suck all along.
The team is underachieving as a team because they are poorly coached. It couldn't be more blatantly obvious. The players didn't suck all along. They aren't suddenly all washed up. The defence isn't the worst in the NHL and it certainly isn't a lack of scoring from the D or the influx of youth. That's all nonsense. They don't score from anywhere. They are poorly coached. It is just that simple. It is crystal clear. It is undeniable. There is no other logical, reasonable conclusion that could be reached.

Would you say the 15 teams underneath us in the league are poorly coached as well?

 

[Actual Thought*]

Would you say the 15 teams underneath us in the league are poorly coached as well?

Some of them are. Some of them have less talent. Toronto is an example of such a team. However as bad as Toronto's roster is they have scored more goals than we have. Their record in the last 10 is better than ours as well. At the rate things are going it will be Toronto in our playoff spot. Coaching? I would say so.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

Some of them are. Some of them have less talent. Toronto is an example of such a team. However as bad as Toronto's roster is they have scored more goals than we have. Their record in the last 10 is better than ours as well. At the rate things are going it will be Toronto in our playoff spot. Coaching? I would say so.

All teams go on a winning streak.

If coaching is all that matters to hockey, I will just start following football.

 

[HomersWorld]

Some of them are. Some of them have less talent. Toronto is an example of such a team. However as bad as Toronto's roster is they have scored more goals than we have. Their record in the last 10 is better than ours as well. At the rate things are going it will be Toronto in our playoff spot. Coaching? I would say so.

Toronto has more goals and still has a worse goal differential. The fewest amount of ROWs in the league. And one win vs the Eastern conference. Dream big!

 

[14ari13]

Marchenko
Sheahan (still young)

With
Larkin
Pulkkinen
Athanasiou

5 out of 22??? 22%.

It's just when several are out there it happens.

Larkin, AA, Pulkkinen, Smith, Kindl, Shaehan. Tatar and Nyquist too in a way.

First off "Agenda" is a laughable word to use. This is a discussion board not a congressional committee.
Secondly in September you said you "wouldn't count them out" as contenders. Now you are saying you knew they would suck all along.
The team is underachieving as a team because they are poorly coached. It couldn't be more blatantly obvious. The players didn't suck all along. They aren't suddenly all washed up. The defence isn't the worst in the NHL and it certainly isn't a lack of scoring from the D or the influx of youth. That's all nonsense. They don't score from anywhere. They are poorly coached. It is just that simple. It is crystal clear. It is undeniable. There is no other logical, reasonable conclusion that could be reached.

What Are you talking about? This team struggled to make playoffs last 2-4 seasons.
We have lost our biggest Wing goal scorer in Franzen. We played without our best or next best center/forward.
DeKeyser was injured and Green our biggest acquisition was injured. The team needs 15-30 games to gel, then we can talk about the coaching.

 

[obey86]

Growing pains:

Getting better?

 

[SpookyTsuki]

Growing pains:

Getting better?

no u have it upside down

 

[Actual Thought*]

Toronto has more goals and still has a worse goal differential. The fewest amount of ROWs in the league. And one win vs the Eastern conference. Dream big!

Andy they still have a better record over the last 10 games than Detroit. That should be alarming if you are a wings fan. It isn't a dream. It is sad.