the Untouchables

[garmonbozia]

Just wanted to start a discussion about what everybodies thinking is on the concept of 'untouchable' assets. How deep a list is fair to protect from trading? Do you keep it fair when play-negotiating trade ideas of what you expect in return?

Some hold to the "anybody-can-be-traded-at-any-time" theory, others that you have top 3, 5, 10...whatever, that won't be traded no matter what. I suspect most GMs take a much more holistic, wider spectrum, longer range planned approach than the common fan does. But, I am curious what my fellow Lightning fans feelings are on the thought.


Personally, I think a top 3 is fair. Don't ask for players in my top 3 and I won't try and steal yours in same range. Currently, my Lightning top 3 assets would be Stamkos, Hedman, and St. Louis. They're my untouchables, everybody else available...if the price is right.

I acknowledge a whole host of 10 or so more guys aren't in any way truly available, but, I'll let any of them out for fictional trade discussion that we're all really powerless to make real. I have fun wondering "what trade would I consider moving Drouin, Kucherov, or Vasilevski in?" or "how many non-top 3 guys would I need to put together to get the top 5 guy the other teams fans want to move?"

Where do your thoughts on the matter lie?

Click to read more...

 

[Callum]

I think theirs truly only 3 untouchable guys on our roster at the moment.

Stamkos St.Louis and Bishop. Simply because there aren't many players better at what they do.

Then you have guys like Hedman, Drouin, Kucherov and countless other young guys. They aren't "untouchable" because the return we'd get would likely improve our situation. For example, if we trade Hedman.. It would probably be apart of a package for a better defensman.

 

[HoseEmDown]

Stamkos, Hedman and St. Louis everyone else can be had for the right price.

 

[BoltSTH]

Stamkos and Hedman are the only two untouchables.

It would take massive over payment to get us to trade Drouin, Vasilevskiy, and a 'too good to pass up' offer for Kucherov, Koekkoek (i.e. young 1st pair D).

 

[LightningStrikes]

Stamkos.

I'm unsure about Hedman, Marty and Bishop. I mean I wouldn't want to trade them but I'm not sure SFY wouldn't pull the trigger if the offer was right.

 

[Glide5]

Right now I imagine we have a top 2 in Stamkos and Hedman. Those two are going to be center pieces of the organization, and I dont think we would move them for anything unless it was a massive overpayment of which no one would offer on this board haha.

Outside of that, anyone could be availible in time. Not this trade deadline, mind you, but Marty could be traded next year if our team has a bad year and he wants to compete one more time. Theres no telling if Bishop's year is legitimate or if he's having a one off of greatness this year (and if Vasi is going to surpass him in a year or two).

But, for the sake of this year, I would most of our core is untouchable. That takes guys like Filp, Nate, Gudas, Carle, Killorn, Johnson, Kucherov and Palat off the table in an equal value trade scenario. They are worth more to us than what they could potentially bring back.

 

[Vasilevskiy]

Stamkos, Hedman and Vasilevski

 

[The Macho King]

The reason Vasi is untouchable is that his value is so hard to predict. He could be an absolute stud, but look at Markstrom a few years ago and then look at him now. If he develops well, we've got a good problem in a few seasons... wouldn't say he's "untouchable" as much as "unmovable".

 

[DFC]

There's no such thing as a true untouchable. All it really means, I think, is a player who wouldn't be moved even at fair value or better. So I think Tampa has a lot of "untouchables" right now. Stamkos is obvious, but I can't think of a one-for-one trade I would do with Victor Hedman right now, given his age, contract, remaining untapped potential, and how we don't have another guy who can do what he does. But I also consider Drouin and MSL untouchables, and Bishop, and just a couple of degrees below that is Kucherov and Vasilevski.

 

[Werewolf]

T1: Stamkos/Hedman/Bishop - that's the cornerstone of our organization right now.
T2: Drouin/Vasilevski - future of our organization.

I dont consider MSL untouchable - his replacement is Drouin on top line and he is now at end of career - would trade for right price / younger asset.

 

[Silver Tuna]

I think its way too early to call Bishop untouchable. For this season yes, there's no way you can trade him but it's not like he's guaranteed to be just as stellar next year and beyond.

As a Lightning fan there is not much you could actually entice me with to make me want to move Kucherov. I have to be his biggest supporter on this site and nothing short of a bonafide player in his position would get me to want to move him and that just wouldn't actually happen.

My list would be Stamkos and Kucherov with Hedman almost in that category.

 

[MrClutch86]

Bishop
Stamkos
Hedman


Almost Kucherov

 

[DFC]

I would add St. Louis because I think there's something to be said for loyalty. St. Louis, obviously, would have to do his part by, A.) being willing to stay here, and B.) staying here for a fair price. But under those circumstances, I think we owe it to him to allow him to finish his career here if that's what he wants. That's something we don't owe any other player, Stamkos included, right now.

But there are benefits to that kind of thing. If you get a reputation for having a classy organization, players will want to play for you. The best current example is Detroit. They respect their players and it helps when FA time comes around. I'd like Tampa to get a similar reputation. It doesn't always have to be a cut-throat business. Sometimes yes, like in Vinny's case, you can't avoid it. But not always.

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

mine is simple stamkos bishop hedman going to add marty for loyalty and would like to give him a job here when is done.

The three kids vasi kucherov drouin. I would put carle and gudas right there with them.

After that everyone is still proving themselves. They got through stages when are hot and cold etc..

Is easier for me to say who is available. Aulie, pyatt is top two. Next would be panik/connolly. Malone/purcell.

I would put jt brown at next level

than is going to be killorn johnson palat etc.. I keep johnson till give namestnikov a chance to show what he can do etc...

I dont trade someone one of the kids till know is a guy who can actually take his job and do a better job.

I know everyone wants now. We still got a lot of growing up and maturing to do. We are very good right now but a lot of that is we are so versatile have so many guys who can and have stepped up. I dont want to hurt that at all so each movement takes a long hard look etc..

So the key is do we have a guy who is proven to take that part and prove he can handle it? If not than I really am in the mode to say ok give it more time lets stay deep injuries happen too easily I like staying at the top where we are at and the only thing besides bishop keeping us there is how deep we really are

A top 10 d man? Everyone is on the table but the big four that includes drouin kucherov and vasi. Even marty might be on top thing for say weber. I think a top 10 you overpay and would rather just go grab something easier keep the guys I see as core. The 9 I mentioned gudas carle hedman marty stamkos bishop vasi drouin kooch? I would rather get a legit 3-4 d guy rh shut down with some upside for a little scoring dont need much am happy with our three honestly. Keep the nine go that route lose 1-2 forwards and keep this chemistry and team rolling.

Is just my thought I think we are close just got to be patient and make the right moves when they become available. Get a girardi if the price is right. If not is other deals that will be interesting where dont have to mess with the core or what could be core of future



P.S. I am kucherov's biggest supporter unless is bolt 32 lmao.

P.S. Number 2? Hedman? Who is playing better than hedman? Sure he makes some mistakes here and there but do you truly remember when he was MIA? Is not just the scoring HEDMAN HAS BEEN WHAT WE DREAMED OF THIS YEAR. If he keeps this up I do not see a better d man in the league the next 5 years. Just saying man is he becoming something!!

 

[Bolt32]

Untouachables....

Stamkos, Hedman and currently Bishop...though Bishop could change depending on next seasons play also if Guds or Vasi Emerge as legit number 1 netminders obviously. Long term only Stamkos and Hedman currently.

Next Tier possible of being untouchable in the future. Kucherov, Drouin and Vasi. All depends on their development and would cost a fortune to pry them away. Kucherov...something about that kid, makes me having scouting orgasms. He did that ever since before we drafted him, I still firmly believe that he can very well be a top 10 player in this league though obviously not their yet. Would like him to hit the weight room, give him some players that can keep up with him mentally and see how he does in an 82 game season. I Don't think we seen anything yet in comparison.

 

[Steve Yzerman]

There are no untouchables, everyone can be had for a price. No one is going to want to pay the price for Stamkos, Hedman, or Bishop though.

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

I really like our approach letting kids learn and play. Like what that stands for or hmm word constitutes? Not sure is the right word or explainable. Yet seems to me we got a lot of guys vying for positions. No one has really just taken it but the big three bishop hedman and stamkos seem locked. I would say gudas and carle have locked up roles for the future fippula also.

I would say everyone else is fighting for that spot. The good news is seems cooper and stevie have th patience needed to say hell if you can come out here and prove you are better deserve it more than hey we will give you the job till than keep competing.

I think this is super healthy for us and the future. We are gonna lose some guys obviously too many forwards either must stay up or are ready to earn a spot next year.

We could use maybe one two d upgrades but that means moving bodies too.

Is interesting I just hope we dont go all in with anything personally and keep the extra's we can we sure showed we can use extra bodies this year

 

[Rschmitz]

Stamkos
Hedman
Bishop

St.Louis you can't deal because he's the captain, either. Everybody else is totally deal-able, including Drouin, Kucherov, and Vasi at the right price.