The Roster Thread, Summer 2024

slip

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Adams was the GM who signed Reinhart to a 1 year deal in 2020, not Botterill. Reinhart still wanted a long term deal with the Sabres in 2020.

The 2020-21 season then played out the way it did and Reinhart no longer wanted to be a Sabre.

Botterill and Adams both made the same mistake with Reinhart, but Adams was the last one to do it. So it's on Adams more than Botts.
Things got acrimonious between Botterill and Reinhart, causing Sam to miss all of preseason in 2018. That two year deal was a joke and an insult to Reinhart, who probably already had a foot out the door long before Adams arrived, who was dishing out one year deals that summer like the world was gonna end after the season.
 

Chainshot

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Colton is signed for 3 seasons at a very reasonable price. His trade value is much much higher than 37 overall. Significantly higher. And I do think we need to overpay to acquire a 3C at $4.5 or less that's signed for a few years.

It was what he was just traded for. What is he done this year in Colorado? That makes him worth significantly more than that? I don’t see it.

Yeah I'm pretty off on the Armia/Kovacevic value. But I'm not as high on Rosen as the rest of the board...Armia is at 17 goals and plays outstanding defence and really turned it around after the AHL demotion and mental re-conditioning or whatever he did (plus he's great on the power play)...I like Kovacevic a lot also lol. I think those are two great fits for our team.

Armia was on waivers and the Habs have been talked about wanting to remove his cap hit. That doesn't invoke adding a recent first into a trade deal for that player, that's offering up something late in the draft to take on the hit for them if at all. I've like Kovacevic - mentioned him all the way back as of last year as a good third RHD option who could give them PK time affordably.

I think the inevitable next move is choosing between Byram or Power but that choice won't be made this off season.

Three new forwards, one new defenseman, backup veteran goalie. That's what I see happening this offseason.

I dont think we trade our 1st this year. Our issue is current young forward glut. Savoie/Kulich/Rosen at the same time is the issue. We will want blue chips around who will be ready in a few years.

They are in a position where they can start to move draft picks in packages to get what is lacking on the NHL squad without even touching their prospect pool yet. Or they can go big and include some of those guys to land the proverbial bigger fish in trade. They have a lot of folks coming and can even spread it further by leaning back into collegiate or European development paths that give them the 4 year signing window.
 

HOOats

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There should be no trade asset that is off the table to acquire the right guys via trade.

Sure, it would be great if they can use the surplus of the young forwards they already have in the system to do that. But, other GMs might want a pick more than a guy that the Sabres have drafted.

And the key needs to be landing guys that move the needle and not hearing more of the "we looked at adding a guy, but we didn't like the acquisition cost."

Standing pat cannot be an option this summer.
I disagree, but understand why opposing camps exist over this.

I'm not willing to buy like a team trying to get over the hump for a Cup when we're still only trying to make the playoffs. I'm not consumed by the sunk cost sadness of the drought and I'm glad Adams hasn't been either. I plan on enjoying decades more Sabres hockey and a flush prospect pipeline is the only way we are ever going to acquire and sustain high-end talent. You could say that hasn't worked thus far, but we're just beginning to see the yields of this youth project and every neutral observer is gaga over it. I also have a feeling that the satisfaction of making the playoffs will dissipate quickly once we get rocked by a real playoff team, so my idea of the build has always been aiming for further goalposts.

While I did provide the caveat that the pick could be moved for a no-brainer trade win, I still think it makes little sense moving forward. We have (emerging) top talent and we've established our future cap structure around that talent. Both in roles and dollars, the top of the lineup is pretty full (until Skinner's deal is off the books).

And that's before next summer when JJ and Quinn get paid like the true top 6ers they are. And potentially Byram. We don't have much room for the type of veteran that the #11 pick would return unless you're advocating using it for bottom 6 acquisitions, which would be unorthodox.

If we don't think our talent is good enough right now then we need to move players for players with prospects and later picks as sweeteners. I'm hopeful about the progress that can be made with a new coach and an embarrassed group of players that is highly motivated to improve (and importantly, still at the ages when improvement is likely). Add to that a few physical shot suppressor bottom 6 guys. If they're in the mix after New Year's, feel free to float the late-teens 2025 1st for a guy who fits here medium-term.

Not to mention that the Adams FO's selections in the 1st and 2nd have generally been very strong. I trust that they'll make the best of the options among Catton, Helenius, Buium, Parekh, Iginla, Silayev, Greentree, Yakemchuk, and Brandsegg-Nygård. Those are all exciting prospects who I want complementing our core in 2-3 years while making a million bucks.
 

Gabrielor

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Not to mention that the Adams FO's selections in the 1st and 2nd have generally been very strong. I trust that they'll make the best of the options among Catton, Helenius, Buium, Parekh, Iginla, Silayev, Greentree, Yakemchuk, and Brandsegg-Nygård. Those are all exciting prospects who I want complementing our core in 2-3 years while making a million bucks.

Agree with this. He found as many top 6 forwards in 1 draft, picking 8th and 34th, as Tim Murray did in 2 whole drafts with 2nd overall picks in each.
 
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Old Navy Goat

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Adams was the GM who signed Reinhart to a 1 year deal in 2020, not Botterill. Reinhart still wanted a long term deal with the Sabres in 2020.

The 2020-21 season then played out the way it did and Reinhart no longer wanted to be a Sabre.

Botterill and Adams both made the same mistake with Reinhart, but Adams was the last one to do it. So it's on Adams more than Botts.
Reinhart took Buffalo to arbitration which is why he got the one year deal. This was also after Eichel asked to be traded, so he could see the writing on the wall that a rebuild was on the way
 

TehDoak

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I was going to reply to this and say "Well, Adams has already said that he wants a 4th line center, and suggested 3rd spot is likely filled internally"

But, I realized, we can probably scrap a lot of what Adams has expressed the needs to be so far. For better or worse, Adams has historically bent the knee a bit to what the coach wants. He did it for Krueger, he did it for Granato.

Can probably stop some of the speculation on what Adams will ACTUALLY do until we hear from the new coach. At the very least, we should get a fresh set of eyes on the roster that won't just want more USHL guys to join the friendship circle.
 

SharkInABoloTie

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There's a 0% chance Tuch is gone...which means...

Looking at where Skinner finished his last 20 games, we could assert that Skinner is already not a top 6 winger.
Right. I would agree with both of you. Just basing my comments off of how last season started, I see our current "top 6" wingers as Quinn, Peterka, Skinner, Tuch. Skinner should no longer be considered a top 6 forward, and a $9m middle 6 winger is not an option. Especially one that doesn't have much speed anymore, makes bad turnovers, and is a defensive pylon. I know we would all love to send Skinner packing, but I don't know how realistic it is to occur.

So let's say next years top 6 wingers include Tuch, Quinn and JJP. I think Benson can likely be another. Do one of those first 3 I mentioned get moved? I'm curious what the outside options are and what that means for what we currently have.
 

Doug Prishpreed

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If we don't make the playoffs next year, Tuch is gone -- that's another motivation for changing the coach now. If yet another star player refuses to re-sign, that could be contagious and Adams can't risk that.
 

BFLO

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Reinhart took Buffalo to arbitration which is why he got the one year deal. This was also after Eichel asked to be traded, so he could see the writing on the wall that a rebuild was on the way
Players opt for arbitration when they think they are getting lowballed.

Which means Adams lowballed Reinhart in 2020 when he had the opportunity to sign him long term instead.

Reinhart told the press that Buffalo never offered him a long term deal under Botts or Adams, but that he had wanted to sign until the 2020-21 season happened.

Botts and Adams both had the opportunity to lock Reinhart up lock term. Neither one even made him an offer.

They both suck.
 
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Jim Bob

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I disagree, but understand why opposing camps exist over this.

I'm not willing to buy like a team trying to get over the hump for a Cup when we're still only trying to make the playoffs. I'm not consumed by the sunk cost sadness of the drought and I'm glad Adams hasn't been either. I plan on enjoying decades more Sabres hockey and a flush prospect pipeline is the only way we are ever going to acquire and sustain high-end talent. You could say that hasn't worked thus far, but we're just beginning to see the yields of this youth project and every neutral observer is gaga over it. I also have a feeling that the satisfaction of making the playoffs will dissipate quickly once we get rocked by a real playoff team, so my idea of the build has always been aiming for further goalposts.

While I did provide the caveat that the pick could be moved for a no-brainer trade win, I still think it makes little sense moving forward. We have (emerging) top talent and we've established our future cap structure around that talent. Both in roles and dollars, the top of the lineup is pretty full (until Skinner's deal is off the books).

And that's before next summer when JJ and Quinn get paid like the true top 6ers they are. And potentially Byram. We don't have much room for the type of veteran that the #11 pick would return unless you're advocating using it for bottom 6 acquisitions, which would be unorthodox.

If we don't think our talent is good enough right now then we need to move players for players with prospects and later picks as sweeteners. I'm hopeful about the progress that can be made with a new coach and an embarrassed group of players that is highly motivated to improve (and importantly, still at the ages when improvement is likely). Add to that a few physical shot suppressor bottom 6 guys. If they're in the mix after New Year's, feel free to float the late-teens 2025 1st for a guy who fits here medium-term.

Not to mention that the Adams FO's selections in the 1st and 2nd have generally been very strong. I trust that they'll make the best of the options among Catton, Helenius, Buium, Parekh, Iginla, Silayev, Greentree, Yakemchuk, and Brandsegg-Nygård. Those are all exciting prospects who I want complementing our core in 2-3 years while making a million bucks.
I am not suggesting that they trade their 1st round pick in just any move.

But, if another GM is insisting on that pick in the package for a guy that can make a meaningful impact, it would be tough to swallow for Adams to walk away from the deal because of that pick.

If including the first in a deal is the difference between adding Anthony Cirelli or not, then I think they should do it. If it is the difference between adding Brady Tkachuk or not, then I think they should do it.

They shouldn't trade the pick to trade the pick. But, they also shouldn't turn down adding the right type of player if it will require that pick. And the same should go for a whole bunch of guys on this roster and in the pipeline.

:dunno:
 
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